George Orwell: A literary mediocrity (?)

[Bilbo1967]

Originally Posted by Canuck_in_Japan

Shouldn't this be in the General Forum or something? I don't think some guy's opinion necessarily qualifies as "News".

Possibly. If it bothers you that much, ask a mod to move it. As the OP that's fine with me.

[caleb72]

Originally Posted by issybird

Orwell's problem is that his best-known novels (Animal Farm, 1984) are not his best work.

Interesting. Thanks for that insight.

I found both stories particularly unsubtle (reader - meet sledgehammer), but whereas I disliked Animal Farm, I really enjoyed 1984.

Which would you list as his best novel(s)?

[Luffy]

I've only read Animal Farm, and I was very young at the time. I liked the story. I found it, however, a bit sad and boring in parts. Reading Animal Farm made me hesitate to go for 1984.

[meeera]

It's just Will Self being Will Self. His main purpose in life appears to be classifying books into Literature I Approve Of, and Literature That Probably Should Not Exist.

[darryl]

Originally Posted by paola

Will Self is a left leaning intellectual well known in the UK - he likes to be controversial (but in this he often offers unusual points of view).
He has a wry, dry writing style, one of his novels was shortlisted for the Man Booker prize.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Will_Self

Thanks for the information. Living in Australia he is someone I have not previously come across. Based on this little effort at attention seeking I doubt I am missing much. Surely "intellectual" should be prefaced with "self-declared". Whatever faults Orwell may have had, he has been judged by history and is certainly considered to be much better than mediocre.

I might add that I actually took the trouble to read Mr Self's article. That's a couple of minutes of my life wasted which I will never get back. My opinion is that I have rarely come across a more pretentious verbose piece of garbage. The content is dealt with more than adequately in the comments, most of which are a much better read than Mr Self's ramblings.

[leo_CR]

I enjoyed 1984 when I was a teenager. I read it again like 2 months ago, and it seemed sooooooo plain to me, that I had to struggle to finish it. However, I realized I was stating a judge with dozens of posterior work over my shoulders, so it would not be fair to me to say he was a mediocre writer when he wrote his work.

[Nabeel]

Orwell's fiction is clumsy, there's no doubt about it. His best work is represented in his prose essays. Yet the key essay on style - 'The Politics of the English Language' - is an odd little piece. I feel certain that he started writing on one topic, and changed his mind half-way through about the issues he wanted to address. It's the essay in which he decries the use of acronyms: for example, if you write 'NATO' instead of 'North Atlantic Treaty Organisation', you're less likely to wonder why Turkey is part of the organisation.

The second half of 'The Politics of the English Language' does make some extremely valid points about how to write clearly.

[Salgueiros]

I actually listened to that podcast and i agree with the idea expressed as a whole in that program. That phrase alone is a bit out of context from what he expressed.

To me, the most valuable idea from that podcast and one I fully agree is:

"Orwell and his supporters may say they're objecting to jargon and pretension, but underlying this are good old-fashioned prejudices against difference itself".

I find this to be particularly true for some people i know that profess admiration for his style.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by gmw

The latter, I think. Just a piece with a controversial title to draw readers. In the article we find this:

So it seems that even Will Self thinks that Orwell had some sort of genius. Self's objection, it seems to me, is that Orwell is readily understood by the masses (hence to mediocrity), and Self seems to think this is a bad thing for an author to aspire to. This interpretation is further supported by this paragraph:

And there is an element of truth in the concluding sentence. Much writing that seems profound manages to hide as much truth as it reveals - it's one of the things that marks out very clever speech-writers ... and journalists.

It makes me think of Pilate's question, "What is truth?" What I see as truth might not be the same as what you see as truth as the 'truthfulness' of a viewpoint is influenced by personal bias more often than not. It's the masses who read books that keep them in print not the publishers. They just print up what the public is willing to pay for. And as far as "Animal Farm" I understand Mr. Orwell had trouble getting it published at 1st because to paraphrase one publisher "While I don't like communism I can't publish such a general attack on it as this book is." (I don't recall the exact words of the quote but that's pretty close I think).

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by paola

Will Self is a left leaning intellectual well known in the UK - he likes to be controversial (but in this he often offers unusual points of view).

I have to confess that, although I live in the UK, I've never before heard of this gentleman.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by HarryT

I have to confess that, although I live in the UK, I've never before heard of this gentleman.

I think it's interesting that if you switch his 1st and last names around you get 'Self Will."

[tompe]

Originally Posted by HarryT

I have to confess that, although I live in the UK, I've never before heard of this gentleman.

That is impressive. Even I in Sweden have not avoided hearing about him.
I have not read his books myself but seen his books at friends places.

If I lived in the UK it would probably be nearly impossible to miss him (fromWIkipedia):

William Woodard "Will" Self (born 26 September 1961) is an English author, journalist and television personality.[2][3]

Self is the author of ten novels, five collections of shorter fiction, three novellas and five collections of non-fiction writing. His work has been translated into 22 languages, and his novel Umbrella was shortlisted for the Man Booker Prize.[4] His fiction is known for being satirical, grotesque, and fantastical, and is predominantly set within London. His subject matter often includes mental illness, illegal drugs and psychiatry.

Self is a regular contributor to publications including Playboy, The Guardian, Harpers, The New York Times and the London Review of Books. He currently writes a column for New Statesman, and over the years he has been a columnist for The Observer, The Times and the Evening Standard. His columns for Building Design on the built environment, and for the Independent Magazine on the psychology of place brought him to prominence as a thinker concerned with the politics of urbanity.

Self is a regular contributor on British television, initially as a guest on comic panel shows such as Have I Got News for You and Shooting Stars, but latterly appearing on current affairs programmes such as Newsnight and Question Time. He is also a frequent contributor to BBC Radio 4.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by tompe

That is impressive. Even I in Sweden have not avoided hearing about him.
I have not read his books myself but seen his books at friends places.

If I lived in the UK it would probably be nearly impossible to miss him (fromWIkipedia):

I watch very little TV. That's probably why I haven't come across him.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by HarryT

I watch very little TV. That's probably why I haven't come across him.

I also watch very little TV these days. I do watch some classic shows on METV (Adam-12 and some older shows) but there just isn't much of interest on TV anymore. If I do watch TV it's usually a DVD recording. I picked up some of the newest Doctor Who the other week and am working through that among other things. The quality of TV has gone down in recent decades. At least classic books are still readable & with my Kindle I always know I have a good read available.

[paola]

Originally Posted by HarryT

I watch very little TV. That's probably why I haven't come across him.

you obviously do not listen to radio 4

as I said, he writes on a lot of left leaning papers, like The Guardian, The Independent, etc., but also in the London Review of Books, and has had pieces in The Daily Telegraph as well as foreign newspapers (e.g. The New York Times).

More here:
http://will-self.com

He has a dry sense of humour, I find him quite entertaining.