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Old 07-14-2014, 10:02 PM   #106
davidfor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
Thanks.

0 is a valid value. 0 means off.
And what exactly does "off" mean? The only thing it can mean is the same as using 1. i.e. Allow one line from the a paragraph to appear at the end or beginning of the page/screen. The specs I can find say only "positive numbers are allowed". "0" is not a positive number.

Or do you think that "off" means don't leave any widows or orphans. i.e. Always start a paragraph on a new page/screen.
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Old 07-14-2014, 10:26 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arspr View Post
I do not agree with you davidfor.

Of course in the second image I cannot assure if there's enough space for TWO more lines. Maybe it seems enough, but in fact it isn't barely ...

But, it really doesn't matter because I'm just speaking of ONE line. I just want to move the third line of the paragraph from the third "page" to the bottom of second. And I can assure that there's more than enough free space for that single line.
Sorry, I was being a little bit to generic in that reply. Yes, there is clearly room for another line of text. Whether there is room for two is not clear.
Quote:
Any book is actually suitable. Just play with margins and font size till you get an adequate layout like the one I've posted.
But getting reproducible results are hard with a random book. To see the problem you need to get a paragraph with the right number of lines going over the end of the screen. Getting that depends on the length of the paragraph, the font used, the font size, the line height, the margins and the text before the paragraph. Changing any of that will change how the paragraph is rendered.
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Old 07-14-2014, 11:36 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by the.Mtn.Man View Post
Does this seriously bother people that much? Am I really the only person who doesn't fret about uneven white space -- or even the infamous long-paragraph bug -- and simply enjoys my book?
I don't even know what they're talking about. My books have words that start at the top of the page and go to the bottom of the page and then they continue on the next page. If something is amiss then I am not aware of it. Sometimes ignorance is bliss.
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Old 07-14-2014, 11:52 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the.Mtn.Man View Post
Does this seriously bother people that much? Am I really the only person who doesn't fret about uneven white space -- or even the infamous long-paragraph bug -- and simply enjoys my book?
It might depend on how visual a person you are? While I can read a book just fine however it's formatted. There are certainly things that allow me to enjoy the reading experience more. Visually when the text stops part way down the page my brain signals that it should be the end of a chapter and when it's not gets thrown off a bit. Doesn't mean the book can't be read, but it is a distraction. Which is why on the Aura HD I have everything loaded as kePub's as it gives me more consistent formatting usually.
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Old 07-15-2014, 03:03 AM   #110
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Canuck, I also don't quite understand. My Aura HD always fills every page, right to the bottom. Even if that means leaving a single line dangling at the start of the next page. As well it should be, I can't imagine why anyone would even feel that is a problem and then start solving that "problem" by leaving blank spaces on the bottom of pages.

I have no idea why I don't get these orphan/widow blank spaces on the bottoms of my pages. I have certainly not edited any style sheets, and I don't think I've done anything dramatic in Calibre. Do the only happen in epubs? I read kepubs exclusively.
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Old 07-15-2014, 03:17 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joques View Post
I read kepubs exclusively.
Kobo did the sensible thing and disabled the widows/orphans rules in the kepub reader, so you won't see the blank lines in kepubs with recent firmware.
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Old 07-15-2014, 03:19 AM   #112
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Joques: For the last couple of firmware versions, the kepub render seems to be using widows and orphans set to 1. Than means it will fill the screen as you are seeing.

The discussion about how the epub render works. Or how it is broken. It has a bug that sometimes gets the it wrong. From what I have seen, it gets it right more than it does wrong. And it uses the CSS default value of 2 for both. Personally, I think that is the wrong thing to do and edit all my books to use a value of 1.
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Old 07-15-2014, 05:21 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
Thanks.

0 is a valid value. 0 means off.
No, it is not. The properties widows and orphans are (now) strictly-positive (CSS3). The minimum value is 1. The default is (and should be) 2.
The old CCS2.x accepted 0 as a valid value, but 'since the draft/introduction' of CCS3 it doesn't anymore. Try the W3C CSS Validation Service on both properties.

This widows/orphans issue doesn't bother me that much. Personally i think that the default value of 2 is a bit overkill for ereaders as it breaks/moves (imho too frequently/unnecessary) sentences to the next screen while there is still enough space to display them. It is nice to read that I'm not the only one who edit the widows and orphan properties to it minimum value of 1.

The end of chapter bug bothers me much more and is still present in fw 3.5.0.
Last edited by Anak; 07-15-2014 at 05:23 AM.
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:04 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canuck_in_Japan View Post
I don't even know what they're talking about. My books have words that start at the top of the page and go to the bottom of the page and then they continue on the next page. If something is amiss then I am not aware of it. Sometimes ignorance is bliss.
I'm not exactly sure what the complaint is myself, to be honest. I think it's referring to the occasional variance of white space at the bottom of the page, but the way people are acting, you'd think it was scrambling the text instead.
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:05 AM   #115
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The end of chapter bug bothers me much more and is still present in fw 3.5.0.
What bug is this?
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:58 AM   #116
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What bug is this?
I posted an example here.
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:59 AM   #117
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anyone else having no book covers show when touch is a sleep?
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:10 AM   #118
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Geoff and David, thank you very much for clearing that up for me!
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:18 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by treadlightly View Post
I posted an example here.
I've never seen that before on my Touch or my Aura. I do notice, however, that your example features an especially long book (over 3000 pages!), so I wonder if that's the culprit.
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Old 07-15-2014, 08:41 AM   #120
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I've never seen that before on my Touch or my Aura. I do notice, however, that your example features an especially long book (over 3000 pages!), so I wonder if that's the culprit.
I've seen it in shorter books as well. It happens about once a novel for me (about once every 300 pages). I read epubs only.
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