Unutterably Silly The Countdown

[Greg Anos]

Originally Posted by vivaldirules

Beg to differ. Real answer: let's walk. It's a beautiful day out there. Every day.

Feel free to take a hike any time you want....


(Sorry VR, I just couldn't resist the punch line. Please stay around - RSE)

[vivaldirules]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Feel free to take a hike any time you want....


(Sorry VR, I just couldn't resist the punch line. Please stay around - RSE)

Good one, RSE. Just please don't run me over with your big boat.

[Greg Anos]

Originally Posted by vivaldirules

Good one, RSE. Just please don't run me over with your big boat.

Of course I won't. But I might offer you a lift.....

[vivaldirules]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Of course I won't. But I might offer you a lift.....

Thanks. But why don't you ditch that boat and join me for a walk. It's a beauuuuutiful day.

[Greg Anos]

Here's a nice alt-energy device...........

http://www.hyperionpowergeneration.com/index.html

[pshrynk]

I need one of those for my garage.

[DixieGal]

I betcha if you hooked it up to the hot water heater, someone could flush while someone else is showering, and it wouldn't even make someone scream.

[slayda]

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

i'm not disagreeing with you ; i know it's true. it's just deeply troubling.

Hey, who was it made such a big deal out of "What was his name's" concert?

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

(I'm going to regret this.....)

Quite possibly...

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Steve, American have wanted big cars for 60+ years. Look at what was made and sold. There were a few effcient cars slipped in (the classic example is the '55 to '57 Chevies) but mostly big boat cars sold. The youth market wanted High powered cars (small to have an even higher power-to-weight ratio) in the '60 and '70, but the small, effcient car market was always a niche market. Not non-existant, just niche. And don't let all the nostalgic hippies kid you otherwise. Don't take my word for it, look at the sales records.

Ralph, the American public was rapidly warming to small and efficient cars in the 60s... lots of Americans were discovering the small European cars, like VW's Beetle, and realizing that not all vehicles had to span 2 zip codes. By the 70s, even the muscle cars were scaling down in size and getting better mileage, and though they weren't as powerful as before, were still selling.

But Detroit was being forced by clean air regulations to build ever-more-complicated cars and emissions systems, which meant a severe curtailing of their profit per car. At the same time, big car sales were actually dropping compared to sales of small cars, which were cheaper because Americans wouldn't accept more expensive smaller cars, but which cost them more to manufacture because of the emissions equipment. Detroit saw that their profit margins would never be the same again.

Detroit's solution was to take advantage of the fact that the EPA regs basically omitted trucks from its consideration, since they were (at the time) a noticeable minority of the vehicles on the road, especially in commuter's hands, and therefore considered not worth regulating. Detroit could build trucks at a lower cost, since they did not need the same emissions equipment. But how to sell America on trucks?

Solution: A massive Madison Avenue ad strategy that runs essentially unchanged today, presenting the rebranded "Sport Utility Vehicle" as the vehicle everyone needed... even before they knew they needed them. They did NOT present them as "Big, like your Daddy's car." You never carried coolers, canoes, TVs, barbeque grills, three kids, four dogs, footballs, soccerballs, frisbees, and every toy you owned in your daddy's car at one time. They presented them as sexy and fun and cool, and they even purposely appealed to America's interest in the environment by suggesting owners could take their trucks into the green mountains and across virgin streams, seeing the environment up-close. (And incidentally presenting the then-familiar MPG figures, if at all, in almost invisible fine print.)

And simply because they were bigger, and "bigger things always cost more," Detroit sold them for more, even as they built them for less, making even larger profits. Then they spread money throughout the government to make sure the EPA regs would not be rewritten to include trucks, and kill their gold-plated chicken disguised as a golden goose.

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

They don't want small cars, they just figure they need them. At least for now. So the real answer is not to make everybody drive a tiny alt-fuel car, but to find a way to make an effcient alt-fuel big boat car. And everybody will live happily ever after.

America does not "want" Big-Boat cars. Prior to the 60s and 70s, they wanted them because ALL cars were big... they didn't know anything else. Since then, they have been conned into thinking they still want big vehicles, by ad methods that have worked on industrialized America for over a century, and have sold Americans on everything from Tang to Pet Rocks to Underoos.

(This is not to say that no one in America needs a truck... but that the SUV, specifically, was a vehicle invented for the specific purpose of selling spiffed-up trucks by appealing to people's base emotions (be cool, get laid), and that the number of trucks sold over the past 30 years FAR, FAR outstrips the number of people who actually need a truck in America.)

I hate to put it this way (because it's so f****n' sad), but in the same way that Americans were convinced that they wanted trucks, Americans can just as easily be convinced that they really want small and efficient cars... if it is within the desire of Detroit, the U.S. Government, and the rest of the auto industry, to convince them so. Ad campaigns have proven their ability to sway the public many times over, if done creatively and with a careful consideration to influence the emotion of the consumer. Remember the Crying Indian? Remember Smoky the Bear? Does anyone 40 or above in America not remember them?

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by slayda

Hey, who was it made such a big deal out of "What was his name's" concert?

that doesn't mean i have the first clue what car he drives. nor would i buy a car just because he drives it. seriously, give me a *little* credit. that is all about the *music*. which is how it should be.

[slayda]

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

that doesn't mean i have the first clue what car he drives. nor would i buy a car just because he drives it. seriously, give me a *little* credit. that is all about the *music*. which is how it should be.

Apologies to her highness. Just couldn't resist.

Steve, the VW beetle onl;y got about 24 - 25 MPG. I know since that was my first new car back in 1965. I have a Honda SUV (small one - a CRV) that gets nearly that now.

Perhaps what we need is a great move with a very sexy male & female lead entitled "Rebel with a cause" to show us the way to alt. fuels and fuel economy.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by slayda

Apologies to her highness. Just couldn't resist.

Steve, the VW beetle onl;y got about 24 - 25 MPG. I know since that was my first new car back in 1965. I have a Honda SUV (small one - a CRV) that gets nearly that now.

True. But in 1965 most American cars were getting half that mileage. My father's 67 Pontiac Bonneville was doing good when it got 15 on the highway...

Originally Posted by slayda

Perhaps what we need is a great move with a very sexy male & female lead entitled "Rebel with a cause" to show us the way to alt. fuels and fuel economy.

Couldn't hurt.

[DixieGal]

Originally Posted by slayda

Perhaps what we need is a great move with a very sexy male & female lead entitled "Rebel with a cause" to show us the way to alt. fuels and fuel economy.

Al and Tipper Gore?

[ShortNCuddlyAm]

[mode=semi-tongue-in-cheek]For the UK market you need a car that all three presenters of Top Gear love[/mode]

[slayda]

Originally Posted by DixieGal

Al and Tipper Gore?

I said sexy not "Nobel prize winers". Feel free to replace the words in quotes with you own.