Selecting an ebook reader

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Wat is wrong with having the option of an integrated walled garden? I can read any non-DRMed book on my Kindle -- no one is forcing you to only read books from the garden.

Originally Posted by rcentros

I still don't get the "walled garden" argument. Kindles can read non-DRM mobi books from anywhere. Nooks can read any non-DRM ePub books from anywhere. Where's the wall? It seems with Kindle or Nook you get more choice. All the non-DRM books for each format, plus the DRM books at Amazon or Barnes & Noble that the other eReaders can't read -- or, at least, they can't read before applying Calibre and Apprentice Alf.

Wot is wrong? Having to navigate past all the trying-to-sell-books-to-you stuff (which is most certainly part of the walled garden ecosystem, and is part of the eReader) to get to what you want to read. I buy an eReader to read, not to be advertised at.

This is part of what turned me off the Nook ST, when I looked at it before buying my Onyx.

Another problem I have with the whole walled garden ecosystem concept is Amazon's ability to arbitrarily remove eBooks from your reader. You may own the physical Kindle, but every digital bit that sits on it belongs fully and wholly to Amazon.

[Apache]

Mr. Alf tear down that wall.
Apache

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

Wot is wrong? Having to navigate past all the trying-to-sell-books-to-you stuff (which is most certainly part of the walled garden ecosystem, and is part of the eReader) to get to what you want to read. I buy an eReader to read, not to be advertised at.

This is part of what turned me off the Nook ST, when I looked at it before buying my Onyx.

Another problem I have with the whole walled garden ecosystem concept is Amazon's ability to arbitrarily remove eBooks from your reader. You may own the physical Kindle, but every digital bit that sits on it belongs fully and wholly to Amazon.

That is why I hate Nook and Kobo, because of the cluttered home screen. The Kindle does not advertize.

Regarding Amazon's (and presumably other vendors') ability to delete books... Is there any reason to think they can do that to a sideloaded, not-from-amazon book? Is there any reason to assume that Onyx cannot do the same?

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

Wot is wrong? Having to navigate past all the trying-to-sell-books-to-you stuff (which is most certainly part of the walled garden ecosystem, and is part of the eReader) to get to what you want to read. I buy an eReader to read, not to be advertised at.

So ... when you buy books, you buy them from companies that don't advertise? How do you even know they exist? And, with Kindle, if you find the ads too intrusive, just pay the extra $20 and get rid of them. The ads are why the Kindle was cheaper in the first place. Not sure what your issue was with the Nook Simple Touch. I'm guessing you're a lot touchier than I am on this subject. I personally don't mind a few ads to get a cheaper, quality eReader.

[doubleshuffle]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

The Kindle does not advertize.

Neither does my Kobo. Who told you it did?

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by doubleshuffle

Neither does my Kobo. Who told you it did?

But if memory serves me correct, it does have a cluttered homescreen full of stuff that isn't your book list. I should've been more specific.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

That is why I hate Nook and Kobo, because of the cluttered home screen. The Kindle does not advertize.

I hardly ever see my Home Screen in my Nook Simple Touch. My nook either opens to the book I'm reading, or to the Library view. And, by the way, those books at the bottom of the Home screen are not "ads," they're "recommendations."

But, seriously, I hardly ever see my Home Screen in the Nook. It's kind of a different deal than what you have with the Kindle. When you push the "Nook" button, you can go directly to Home, or your Library, or the Shop, or Search or Settings. The only "ads" (ahem, "suggestions") you'll see is on the Home screen (and the Store, of course). And you really never have to go there. With the Kindle the Home Screen is how you get to everything else.

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Regarding Amazon's (and presumably other vendors') ability to delete books... Is there any reason to think they can do that to a sideloaded, not-from-amazon book? Is there any reason to assume that Onyx cannot do the same?

Probably not, but (i) you cannot be certain & (ii) the whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth, even if it doesn't happen to me personally.

[doubleshuffle]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

But if memory serves me correct, it does have a cluttered homescreen full of stuff that isn't your book list. I should've been more specific.

Doesn't look cluttered to me at all. It's very intuitive - shows the bok that was last opened in a big tile, and other recently opened books and collections in smaller tiles. And the book list proper is exactly one touch away. But it's all a matter of taste, of course.

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by rcentros

So ... when you buy books, you buy them from companies that don't advertise?

Generally, yes.

How do you even know they exist?

The same way that I made my first internet purchase before the first commercial webpage existed, let alone internet advertising -- by knowing what I wanted and going looking for it. (Incidentally, that purchase was made via a Telnet connection, when the World Wide Web was in its infancy and little more than a toy.)

Some of us don't need to be told what to want/buy/think!

And, with Kindle, if you find the ads too intrusive, just pay the extra $20 and get rid of them. The ads are why the Kindle was cheaper in the first place. Not sure what your issue was with the Nook Simple Touch. I'm guessing you're a lot touchier than I am on this subject. I personally don't mind a few ads to get a cheaper, quality eReader.

And I'm not sure why you (and everybody else) are making such a fuss about what was my fourth and least point of preference for Onyx and Pocketbook.

Not all closed-ecosystem eReaders have all the drawbacks that I associate with the genre, but that doesn't mean that they don't have some of them (including some that I haven't even noted yet -- like lack of a mSD port).

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by rcentros

I hardly ever see my Home Screen in my Nook Simple Touch. My nook either opens to the book I'm reading, or to the Library view. And, by the way, those books at the bottom of the Home screen are not "ads," they're "recommendations."

But, seriously, I hardly ever see my Home Screen in the Nook. It's kind of a different deal than what you have with the Kindle. When you push the "Nook" button, you can go directly to Home, or your Library, or the Shop, or Search or Settings. The only "ads" (ahem, "suggestions") you'll see is on the Home screen (and the Store, of course). And you really never have to go there. With the Kindle the Home Screen is how you get to everything else.

On my Kindle I can get everywhere from the universal Menu overlay.

The Home screen is where you go for the combined book list with integrated collections grouping.

As doubleshuffle points out, it's all a matter of taste. But my taste prefers the Kindle UI over the screenshots and stuff I've seen for the Kobo, and the experience holding my friends' Nooks.

[Lemurion]

I have a Nook HD+. I can read anything I want on it, Kindle, Nook, and Kobo... It even does Scribd. Sure there are walled gardens, but they can play together on the right device.

[applewine]

I think the original nook simple touch is the best e-reader if you are OK with not having direct-transfer of books from overdrive and relying on a computer.

I do not own an e-reader (though I did own a kindle 3 keyboard that broke) other than desktop apps and an iPhone, however this is my conclusion and I may get one if I want a more specialized device for reading.

These are the primary reason I like the Nook Simple Touch:
1. Page turn buttons
2. A nice contoured back for holding, not too thin.

If the tablet readers were thicker, had a countered back and page turn buttons I might be more likely to go with one of them.

The downside is you can't check out books from overdrive on the device. You have to rely on a computer to load them into your reader.

Interestingly I think that means that if you return the book early you will still be able to read the book on this type of device until the original expiration date, because it does not verify the book has not been returned early.

I also noticed that on Overdrive Media Console and Adobe Digital Editions they do not check to see if the book has been returned early, and will let you keep reading the book after it has been returned using another device. If you have multiple copies downloaded then your library will consider the book returned if you return it on one device, but the other devices do not check to see if the book is still checked out. This means you can check out many more than the maximum for your library. The only app reader I have seen which correctly checks to see if the book is still checked out is the BlueFire reader.

I am a little worried, because this sounds like a violation of the property rights. I do not know how the "early check-in" was thought to work with all devices and apps. Apparently some apps and devices do not check.

I only use eBooks for library access and occasionally some journal subscriptions. I decided not to go with the middle-ground that Amazon and Nook are offering where they sell you a 24/7 access for unlimited check-outs of a specific book from their library. That is what they are selling with their e-books. Maybe that is too up-tight, but I prefer to have the paper book copy as the primary and I think e-book access is a good compliment for easy access anywhere.

However, I think e-books are best suited for either a free add-on for a printed book or a library subscription like overdrive.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

Probably not, but (i) you cannot be certain & (ii) the whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth, even if it doesn't happen to me personally.

Just as long as you acknowledge your irrational bias.

Originally Posted by Hrafn

Generally, yes.

The same way that I made my first internet purchase before the first commercial webpage existed, let alone internet advertising -- by knowing what I wanted and going looking for it. (Incidentally, that purchase was made via a Telnet connection, when the World Wide Web was in its infancy and little more than a toy.)

Some of us don't need to be told what to want/buy/think!

And I'm not sure why you (and everybody else) are making such a fuss about what was my fourth and least point of preference for Onyx and Pocketbook.

Not all closed-ecosystem eReaders have all the drawbacks that I associate with the genre, but that doesn't mean that they don't have some of them (including some that I haven't even noted yet -- like lack of a mSD port).

I like hitting on every point that people make, it's more thorough.

Regarding the microSD card and lack thereof, I'd like to quote myself on a different thread:

Originally Posted by eschwartz

And since the 3.5GB in the Kindle Touch can hold about 3,000 average-sized books, you don't need expandable memory. If you read 100 books A DAY you will still have one month of reading on your Kindle. At a more reasonable but still exorbitant 3 books a day, you will have nearly 3 YEARS worth. I'm sure somewhere along the way you can get to a computer and swap them for new ones.
(Same logic applies to every other eReader, including the Kindle Paperwhite which has (shudder) a measly 1.5 GB and about a year's worth of books.)

[applewine]

The new nook glow is good too. I find that the light weight is the reason to go with e-ink. With that glow light on all the time the screen really jumps at you too. You don't even have to use it only when it is dark, it just helps the image.

I think I liked the back better on the old Nook simple touch though and maybe the sides were bigger on the old one and maybe buttons were better, but maybe not much missed. I don't know since I didn't own it.