Astak Mentor eBook readers with WiFi and Touchscreen (read-only)

[Robertb]

Originally Posted by NeweReader

This comment is for all the readers who have been complaining about the EZ Reader.

If you don't like what the EZ Reader has to offer (ie., its functions, shape, weight, screen, etc.), then don't buy it!

If you have or like the REB 1150, the Sony PRS-505/500, the Cybook Gen3, or any other ereader, including your phone, then stick with what you have or like. Don't criticize what the EZ Reader is offering because it isn't what you have, like or want. It is its own device with its own features.

Robert,

I am sure when you opened up this forum for suggestions for improving your device, I am pretty sure your intent was not for people to complain and gripe about what it doesn't have or do. I am sure you were hoping for constructive, useful, productive suggestions that could possibly make a great device even greater. I am sorry that alot of what is posted sounds like complaining and griping. There may have been valid suggestions made in some of the comments, but it sure seems they could have presented their ideas in a more constructive manner.

Most people don't go out and purchase a Magnavox TV and then send emails to Toshiba and complain that the Toshiba TVs don't have what the Magnavox TV has. This is what it seems is happening here.

I usually don't write comments like this, and I know I am probably opening myself up to be criticized but I guess I have just gotten tired of the negative comments.

I want you to know that there is at least one person who thinks your device will be just awesome and just what I am looking for, just as it is! I thank you for continuing to respond to comments, even with all the negativity. I am impressed by your continued focus on YOUR product and not the others. Please be reassured that your efforts are appreciated.

A lone voice,
Newereader

Dear Newereader and all:

Thank you to both sides! Discussion is good and I did hope for discussion. Newereader, you are a treasure, and I like your views and appreciate your concern as it is genuine. You have a friend!!

However, I now know that some people are vehement on the EBW1150 and I am now taking it more seriously. Discussion is good and I take it as always constructive. I still honestly think the EZ Reader has a superior ergonomics to almost anything out there. I love it: but I am open that others love something else as far as ergonomics.

My feeling, in all four positions listed above, is that the EZ Reader fills the bill. It is just really well planned out; and I LIKE the fact that you can turn pages from two sides and positions because it has redundant buttons. To me... that is planning ergonomically. In reality, every single one of us will hold the Reader differently. So... it will never be measured the same way in all minds.

However, I will now invest the time to try to buy a EBW1150 and see what it does. What we are all trying to do here, including Newereader, is to make the next generation of EZ Reader and Mentor as good as we can make it. It will not be so unless we rant a bit and rave a bit and get our points accross.

However>>> I still say the ideal forum for all of these comments is CES in Las Vegas (January 8-11) BECAUSE Netronix (Mentor Line) and Jinke (EZ Reader line) will be there and we have the prototypes to discuss and change. So Far... not one person has said they will be there! That is fine but that is the place to try all of these present and future devices (booth 73206) and comment and criticize or offer insight. I mean, this forum is fabulous, but how you ever going to know for sure if you do not touch and feel and toss ideas?

I am grateful for all of you!!

Robert B

[zelda_pinwheel]

Robert,
thanks again for being so open to discussion. i'm thrilled to hear that you're taking the eb1150 seriously ; as i've already said, i really do feel that the design of the eb1150 is way ahead of anything currently being manufactured for ergonomy (as do plenty of others, as you've seen), and i think you'll be able to understand why if you spend a few hours reading on it, as Xenophon recommended. it's really refreshing to see a manufacturer taking the users recommendations seriously.

as for your invitation to come and discuss these subjects in Las Vegas during CES, i would love to do that, but sadly las vegas is really far away and really expensive to get to for me, and i can't just hop over there for a few hours to take a look at Netronix's and Jinke's prototypes (believe me, i wish i could !). i imagine that the same is true for a lot of people. so forum discussion is as good as most of us can do. of course, if you wanted to ship me a prototype or two for me to test out and review, i would be absolutely thrilled to help you out and give you a very detailed report on my impressions ! you just let me know, i'll pm you my shipping address whenever you want !

thanks again for being so open with everybody here at mobileread !

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by Robertb

However>>> I still say the ideal forum for all of these comments is CES in Las Vegas (January 8-11) BECAUSE Netronix (Mentor Line) and Jinke (EZ Reader line) will be there and we have the prototypes to discuss and change. So Far... not one person has said they will be there! That is fine but that is the place to try all of these present and future devices (booth 73206) and comment and criticize or offer insight. I mean, this forum is fabulous, but how you ever going to know for sure if you do not touch and feel and toss ideas?

I am grateful for all of you!!

Robert B

Robert, do you realize how much it costs to go to CES? If I had enough money to go to CES, I would use it to go to 2 or 3 other events instead.

[Nate the great]

Huh. I thought it would be open to the public at some point. Nope.

What are the requirements for attending International CES?

International CES is not open to the general public. You must be in the consumer electronics industry to be eligible to attend the show. Our attendees are made up of more than 140,000 individuals including manufacturers, retailers, content providers and creators, broadband developers, installers, engineers, corporate buyers, government leaders, financial analysts and the media—representing the United States, Canada, Mexico and more than 140 other countries. All attendees must be at least 16 years of age. Two forms of identification are required on-site (one photo ID and one proof of business affiliation/business card).

[Lemurion]

I'm another who wishes they could go to CES - unfortunately I'm too far away and can't afford it.

[Robertb]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

Robert, do you realize how much it costs to go to CES? If I had enough money to go to CES, I would use it to go to 2 or 3 other events instead.

Dear Nate: BEA is a great show. We will be there!!

Regarding CES, airfare to Las vegas is really cheap. Also, you do not have to stay on the strip. The El Cotez and Vegas Club hotels are still available and run around $59-$79 a night. STAY in The Downtown (like me) and that is where you can still get good rates.

On our new website there will be something called "Robert B's Corner" which will discuss future shows and events and how to stay on the cheap. I ran a website for numerouys years called "Las Vegas Bob" which did nothing but point out bargains and where to stay and where to eat and such. In about two more weeks the new website will open up and I will then list it. It will also have free books, free software, tips and tricks, a miniture forum, and ways to buy the various eBooks we carry. I want to make Robert B's corner a monthly thing, very downhome and comfortable, where information (NOT selling) can be dispensed and made available in a comfortable way.

Robert B

[Robertb]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

Huh. I thought it would be open to the public at some point. Nope.

Just to clarify, all industry Trade Shows say "Open Only to the Trade". That is never the case. I applied and went for four years with a fictional business name called "Integrated Blue". Nobody is going to send you away. If you make up a weirdo business name you are "in the trade". It is not like it says. Tell them you are looking to find electronics, possibly to start a reseller business, if you must. Anybody that asked me early enough I would have sent a free invite (we got like 1,000). It really is no problem getting in.

Robert B

[AJ Starr]

Robert,

Just a comment on the ergonomics of what it appears they are talking about with the EB1100.

[Full disclosure: I do not have either, nor have I ever actually seen one]

However, from the pictures in the wiki, my impression is the ergonomic factor is the nice, full grip on the side. As a person with large hands, when I hold something small, my hand begins to cramp. As an example, when I cook, trying to hold the handly of my stirring spoons, aka wooden spoons, soon gets my thumb muscles to cramp. However, I have purchased a new silicone set that has a big handle, similiar to the handles on big screwdriver sets. It is so much easier to hang onto, without cramping.

So to my point: one of the factors I worry about is how thin the devices are, and will my hand cramp holding it for long periods. When the Kindle first came out, I specifically noticed the wider side thinking that it would be better to hold.

Robert, I agree with you 100% that thin and light is what is needed for long periods, however, trying to hold something thin for a long period will be very difficult for those of us with large, and chubby, hands. Maybe a removeable grip, preferrably silicon, that can be adjusted as needed.............

AJ

[Xenophon]

Originally Posted by Robertb

Dear Newereader and all:

Thank you to both sides! Discussion is good and I did hope for discussion. Newereader, you are a treasure, and I like your views and appreciate your concern as it is genuine. You have a friend!!

However, I now know that some people are vehement on the EBW1150 and I am now taking it more seriously. Discussion is good and I take it as always constructive. I still honestly think the EZ Reader has a superior ergonomics to almost anything out there. I love it: but I am open that others love something else as far as ergonomics.

Yay Robertb!!!! I've tried to be clear that I have absolutely no idea what the ergonomics of the EZ Reader are like, because I've not yet been able to get my hands on one. I'm not intending to "dis" Astak's current product. Rather, I'm trying to push them to make the next product as good as it can possibly be.

Specifically, what I've been trying to do is to take advantage of an almost unprecedented opportunity: Through RobertB's participation here, we have a manufacturer representative who is actually listening to feedback from his customers (and potential customers)! This is a really big deal!! It provides the opportunity to nudge RobertB on the ergonomic front, which has long been my biggest gripe about the various eInk readers.

Originally Posted by Robertb

My feeling, in all four positions listed above, is that the EZ Reader fills the bill. It is just really well planned out; and I LIKE the fact that you can turn pages from two sides and positions because it has redundant buttons. To me... that is planning ergonomically. In reality, every single one of us will hold the Reader differently. So... it will never be measured the same way in all minds.

However, I will now invest the time to try to buy a EBW1150 and see what it does. What we are all trying to do here, including Newereader, is to make the next generation of EZ Reader and Mentor as good as we can make it. It will not be so unless we rant a bit and rave a bit and get our points accross.

I'm beyond thrilled that you're going to give it a try. Recall that the screen, processor, and software have a variety of issues -- it's really a 4-year-old piece of hardware, and that's practically forever in computing. The particular thing I (and others) are pointing you at is the combination of physical ergonomics and flexibility (w.r.t. hand position, top-of-screen, etc.).

Originally Posted by Robertb

However>>> I still say the ideal forum for all of these comments is CES in Las Vegas (January 8-11) BECAUSE Netronix (Mentor Line) and Jinke (EZ Reader line) will be there and we have the prototypes to discuss and change. So Far... not one person has said they will be there! That is fine but that is the place to try all of these present and future devices (booth 73206) and comment and criticize or offer insight. I mean, this forum is fabulous, but how you ever going to know for sure if you do not touch and feel and toss ideas?

I am grateful for all of you!!

Robert B

And we are exceedingly grateful for your participation here! I certainly won't make it to CES, however. It's not so much the expense as it is an issue of vacation time -- I can't sell it as being work related.

Xenophon

[dki]

Originally Posted by AJ Starr

Robert, I agree with you 100% that thin and light is what is needed for long periods, however, trying to hold something thin for a long period will be very difficult for those of us with large, and chubby, hands. Maybe a removeable grip, preferrably silicon, that can be adjusted as needed.............

AJ

Oh, I sooo hope not... Light and thin is important up to some point, and when you reach that point, it only matters when it's foldable screen. I can only comment on Cybook - a very light and thin device. I was literally afraid to hold it without a cover (even when I saw it in the pictures, I decided that there is no point in buying it without a cover, as it would be uncomfortable). It was less comfortable to hold for a long periods of time that my RCA 1100, despite being much lighter and thinner. And I have small hands .

RCA has a bulge on one side, and it's rubberized - does not slip in your grip, and the bulge makes a good gripping point (that's where the battery is, I guess). I understand that the necessity of using a cover changes things a bit, but maybe you could design a rubberized cover that somehow resemble RCA and that fits a thin and light device? As an option? Anybody who likes light and thin, can have a different cover. I'd rather have a hefty rubberized cover, and I think that might be a cheaper way to go in the development.

And let's not forget the screen protection - Cybook cover did not have any - so even when the device was covered, during reading the screen was susceptible to scratches and pressure. I think with the eink it would be good to offer a clear plastic screen cover that could be attached to the device cover, that would not reduce print quality by much, but offer some protection (and yes, I understand that for the touch-screen that is useless). And also, you could offer those thin film covers, that only protect from scratches (my Cybook is untouched, but my RCA has scratches, as I could not find a film cover that would fit).

But, if a design of the device itself could be affected, think of the battery possibilities... Obviously, all the batteries in the ereaders on the market now are light and thin... If you could put a really large one in the bulge - it could have weeks of use, rather than days offered now. I, for instance, would go for that, rather than lightness and thinness. Also, if that could be side-lighted, to read in the dark, with larger battery this could be doable without reducing the reading time to several hours... My RCA has a good 20 reading hours in it (it's turned low), so with the new technology, you could have days even with side-lighting, if there was a way to put a larger battery in.

Sorry for a long post... Daydreaming, I think. But, Robert, you might be our only hope... Nobody else is really listening.

As for in-person participation in CES, even thought I live in the US, I really can't (vacation time is scarce and hard to come by, and I'm on the East Coast). But anytime you are in NY please let me know, I'll be delighted to lay my hands on the actual prototypes and complain...

Dorota

[Robertb]

Originally Posted by AJ Starr

Robert,

Just a comment on the ergonomics of what it appears they are talking about with the EB1100.

[Full disclosure: I do not have either, nor have I ever actually seen one]

However, from the pictures in the wiki, my impression is the ergonomic factor is the nice, full grip on the side. As a person with large hands, when I hold something small, my hand begins to cramp. As an example, when I cook, trying to hold the handly of my stirring spoons, aka wooden spoons, soon gets my thumb muscles to cramp. However, I have purchased a new silicone set that has a big handle, similiar to the handles on big screwdriver sets. It is so much easier to hang onto, without cramping.

So to my point: one of the factors I worry about is how thin the devices are, and will my hand cramp holding it for long periods. When the Kindle first came out, I specifically noticed the wider side thinking that it would be better to hold.

Robert, I agree with you 100% that thin and light is what is needed for long periods, however, trying to hold something thin for a long period will be very difficult for those of us with large, and chubby, hands. Maybe a removeable grip, preferrably silicon, that can be adjusted as needed.............

AJ

Dear AJ:

Trust me, I am not thin; and my large and cumbersome hands have fingers that are about 2.5 inches in circumference. Your point about cramping is well taken.

However, please realize that most people will hold the unit in a three-point grip and not two: the thumb, the fore finger, and along the life line on the palm (held in place by the fleshy part of the base of the thumb). I cannot talk for others... but I get cramping holding something too thick. I get no cramping sensation after a four hour flight from Chicago. To me (honestly) I think you will like the feel in your hand and not-at-all have a problem.

Robert B

[AJ Starr]

Originally Posted by Robertb

However, please realize that most people will hold the unit in a three-point grip and not two: the thumb, the fore finger, and along the life line on the palm (held in place by the fleshy part of the base of the thumb).

I guess what is in the back of my mind is all the cautions about "touching" an LCD screen.
Is the eink screen such that having your thumb rest on the screen doesn't hurt it? I keep imagine trying to keep my thumb off the screen while still holding it securely.

Is there anyway we can get more pictures of the EZ Reader, showing a hand holding it in several positions?

AJ

[SaraD]

Originally Posted by AJ Starr

I guess what is in the back of my mind is all the cautions about "touching" an LCD screen.
Is the eink screen such that having your thumb rest on the screen doesn't hurt it? I keep imagine trying to keep my thumb off the screen while still holding it securely.

Is there anyway we can get more pictures of the EZ Reader, showing a hand holding it in several positions?

AJ

Yes, please, and also pictures showing the sides, top, bottom, and back. The front is of course the most important part, but I wonder what buttons may be located on the sides (the way the voulme buttons are on my cell phone), where the SD card slot is, and where the USB connects. Very few of the websites selling e-book readers show these types of pictures and I find myself wondering.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by AJ Starr

I guess what is in the back of my mind is all the cautions about "touching" an LCD screen.
Is the eink screen such that having your thumb rest on the screen doesn't hurt it? I keep imagine trying to keep my thumb off the screen while still holding it securely.

Doesn't hurt it at all. There's a thick layer of tough plastic on top of the "real" screen.

[Slite]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Doesn't hurt it at all. There's a thick layer of tough plastic on top of the "real" screen.

Unless you apply a lot of preassure of course, then you risk breaking the glass layer under the plastic "protection" screen. But normal use shouldn't damage the screen at all. I often manage to place fingers on the screen for some reason or other, thats why I always have a microfiber cloth in my case