Today I visited a Dutch book store. The Horror!

[Katsunami]

While I was in the city to get some last-minute Christmas stuff, I decided to venture into one of the larger book stores in the city's center. (Hm. If you come from London or other big cities, you might call it a village, but still...)

It was busy, but that was not the problem. The problem was that I actually didn't like (the) books. The fantasy section had quite a lot of books in it, so I flipped through a few of them and read some paragraphs.

- They were *huge*. Most were paperbacks, but as large as a big hardcover. (Are those the Trade Paperbacks? I don't know the term for them.) After reading on a Kindle for almost two years now, I've actually... uh... forgotten how large 1.000+ page book can be, especially if it's a hardcover-sized one.
- I flipped through a few of them, but on opening I always thought: "Put it back! You'll crinkle it! The spine will break!" I was actually afraid to open the books more than a little bit, as they started resisting after being opened about 30 degrees or so, especially the larger paperbacks.
- The prices! Oh MY GAWD, TEH PRAISEZ! Those "big paperbacks" could cost up to €25, and even €30 for the biggest ones (with regard to size and author name). Hardcovers would go up to €35. It makes an ebook at €9.99 look very attractive...
- And the worst of all: The translation. I've read some paragraphs, and while the Dutch language was fine in itself, it... just... doesn't... jive. Not for reading Fantasy. It just doesn't. Period. Reading Fantasy in Dutch feels all wrong. Even the "darker" fantasy by George R.R. Martin and Stephen King reads like some sort of badly written stuff that's supposed to be scary for children. If you read Dutch:

"De donkere figuur benaderde de wachter van achteren, en sneed hem zijn keel door voordat hij wist wat er gebeurde. Een seconde later was de moordenaar weer in de schaduwen verdwenen."

The English translation would be something like this:

"The dark figure moved up behind the guard, and slit his throat before he knew what was happening. A second later, the assassin had slipped back into the shadows again."

These sentences are exactly the same, but the Dutch one just feels all wonky. First, it seems to miss all the tension the English one has (at least, for me). Second, "moordenaar" (killer) is not the right word. In Dutch, a "moordenaar" is just someone who kills others; but an assassin is someone who is hired to kill, and who's "job" it is to kill others. Maybe "huurmoordenaar" (hired killer / hitman) could have been used, but that would have been wrong also. Assassin is the correct word, but as far as I know, there is no Dutch counterpart.

It's hard to express what I'm missing Dutch as compared to English, but I missed it in each paragraph I read (in several different books).

Meh. Mini-rant... I now officially don't like large paper books, and I hate Dutch translations even more than I did already

[Shimarenda]

The English sentence is quite pedestrian. It might be acceptable for a newspaper article.

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Shimarenda

The English sentence is quite pedestrian. It might be acceptable for a newspaper article.

It's a direct translation of the Dutch sentence; I don't know the original English one. However, I think the English one is just better. It's more based on a feeling than on some sort of objectivity, apart from the word assassin, which I think can't actually be translated into Dutch very well.

[HarryT]

Yes, the big ones are trade paperbacks.

[Zetmolm]

'Assassin' can quite well be translated as 'sluipmoordenaar', a word which would also fit the atmosphere of the paragraph quite well.

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Zetmolm

'Assassin' can quite well be translated as 'sluipmoordenaar', a word which would also fit the atmosphere of the paragraph quite well.

That would indeed come quite close. Thanks. Didn't think of that word at all

[sabredog]

I certainly feel the same way about those big books. I purchased two hardcover non fiction books about the "Eureka Stockade" by Peter FitzSimons, one for myself and one for my father. We both like the same author and they were a quarter of the normal A$50. They are so cumbersome and heavy. You do forget those things after reading ebooks for so long.

[Geralt]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

After reading on a Kindle for almost two years now, I've actually... uh... forgotten how large 1.000+ page book can be, especially if it's a hardcover-sized one.

Yeah me too. Cant imagine reading big hardbacks or paperbacks after 2 years of kindle.

- And the worst of all: The translation. I've read some paragraphs, and while the Dutch language was fine in itself, it... just... doesn't... jive. Not for reading Fantasy. It just doesn't. Period.

IMO, all literature, not just fantasy, should be read in original. It doesn't matter if its in Dutch, English or Chinese. If you read in original you're closer to authors thoughts and vision.
Fantasy isnt even the one that looses most with translation. It's poetry.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

While I was in the city to get some last-minute Christmas stuff, I decided to venture into one of the larger book stores in the city's center. (Hm. If you come from London or other big cities, you might call it a village, but still...)

<snip>

Meh. Mini-rant... I now officially don't like large paper books, and I hate Dutch translations even more than I did already

I've been reading electronically since 2001(?) or so. I do feel exactly what you wrote down above. Both in the feel of books and in the horrible translations in Dutch. For me, the Dutch language will always be linked to my childhood and thus children's book. I've been only reading English (mostly SF and Fantasy) since I was around 17.

Originally Posted by Geralt

IMO, all literature, not just fantasy, should be read in original. It doesn't matter if its in Dutch, English or Chinese. If you read in original you're closer to authors thoughts and vision.
Fantasy isnt even the one that looses most with translation. It's poetry.

I can only read English and Dutch fluently. I could probably fight my way through a German book and maybe read about 10% of a French one, so that's simply not an option. So, I just read the English translations...

And Poetry I've never been able to read.

[JohnRR]

€25-€35 for a trade paperback? Is this the normal price in the Netherlands?

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by JohnRR

€25-€35 for a trade paperback? Is this the normal price in the Netherlands?

It seems so, at least in the store where I was. A trade paperback cost around €24.95, with the biggest ones going up to €29.95. Think about the big names such as George R.R. Martin, Stephen King, Robert Jordan, and books of 1000+ pages.

The even more expensive ones were the hardcovers.

I've already paid €29.95 for my hardcover of Musashi, about 12 years ago (in a local book store that ordered it for me, just before I started ordering stuff online), while my hardcovers of Shogun and IT (translated to Dutch) cost around fl 59.95 (€27.50) around 15 years ago (just before I had internet).

A dance with dragons, hardcover, English, €22.95.

Een dans met draken, hardcover, Dutch, €19.95.

First: this is online. Stores are much more expensive.
Second: The dutch version is only Part I. If you want the entire book, you'll need to also get Part II, which is another €19.95. That brings the total to €39.90 for the hardcovers (in Dutch). At local stores the combination will probably cost €45.

When buying this book online, you have to be very careful, because it's not always clearly stated that the book you are buying is Part I or Part II only, and not the full book. This is true for either paper or e-book versions. Many shops just use the same cover image and same description for each book, and the only differentiator is the price: the most expensive one is the entire book. (At least bol.com does it correctly.)

Oh, for people who are complaining that their e-readers are too heavy: the full hardcover version of A Dance With Dragons weighs in at 1.39 kg, about 5 times as heavy as a Kindle + Cover

[WillAdams]

Not so great in the rest of the world either --- a number of books I want are out-of-print, and a series I started reading in paperback in 1982 or so, projected @ 24 books, is now only available in the trade sizes, so the new ones won't fit on the shelf w/ the others.

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by WillAdams

Not so great in the rest of the world either --- a number of books I want are out-of-print, and a series I started reading in paperback in 1982 or so, projected @ 24 books, is now only available in the trade sizes, so the new ones won't fit on the shelf w/ the others.

This enforced jump to trade paperback/higher prices seems to be universal. It seems to have introduced another minimum 12 month period in the time needed to wait for a MMPB. Maybe the publishing industry is feeling the pinch and they need the extra money, but I'm just feeling their greed and keeping a tighter grip on my wallet. Shenanigans is what I say.

[Terisa de morgan]

You can replace Dutch with Spanish, and my feelings (and scenario) exactly.

[GlenBarrington]

Originally Posted by Terisa de morgan

You can replace Dutch with Spanish, and my feelings (and scenario) exactly.

When I was in the US Air force, one of my friends was originally from Ecuador. He claimed that when he cursed or swore using foul language, he only used English.

He claimed he could get the MEANING of his feelings across in Spanish, but that he never felt quite as satisfied emotionally as when he swore in English. He said Spanish was too "pretty" to be an effective language for blasphemy.