Paperwhite Second Gen: First Impressions

[Drew0020]

Originally Posted by HarryT

$100 more on a device which currently costs $109 is virtually a 100% increase. I really don't think there are too many people who'd go for that.

I think a $25-$30 increase would probably cover the cost of additional Kindle QA. Instead of removing special offers, they should sell Kindles that are inspected to the people who want to pay for the privilege.

Therefor we can cater to the people who are not willing to pay anything vs those who will pay for quality. I think its a fair trade. Personally I would want people to buy my products because they are the best and not the cheapest, but you can argue the model both ways.

[ProfCrash]

I don't know, I have bought eight total Kindles

1 K1
3 K2
1 K3
2 DXG
1 PW2

Of those Kindles, one has been returned for a screen defect and that was a K2 with the sun fade problem.

I understand that people are having problems with the PW but I don't think it is all that large a number. Problems are going to be over reported on a site like this one. I know that it doesn't help anyone who is having a problem but I think that the perception that there is a massive QC issue is probably not accurate.

We are never going to see numbers one way or the other but we need to acknowledge that the anecdotal evidence in this case is skewed. It sucks for the people with a bad screen, I hope that they get a good device soon. I don't think that it is more then 5% of the devices and I would be surprised if it was that high.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

I understand that people are having problems with the PW but I don't think it is all that large a number. Problems are going to be over reported on a site like this one. I know that it doesn't help anyone who is having a problem but I think that the perception that there is a massive QC issue is probably not accurate.

It's also very noticeable that many of the people who report problems with the PW2 are the same people who had multiple replacement PW1s also, which would strongly suggest that personal perception is an important factor in determining what constitutes a "fault". (That's not a criticism of anyone who does perceive that their PW is faulty, let me stress.)

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

I understand that people are having problems with the PW but I don't think it is all that large a number. Problems are going to be over reported on a site like this one. I know that it doesn't help anyone who is having a problem but I think that the perception that there is a massive QC issue is probably not accurate.

We are never going to see numbers one way or the other but we need to acknowledge that the anecdotal evidence in this case is skewed. It sucks for the people with a bad screen, I hope that they get a good device soon. I don't think that it is more then 5% of the devices and I would be surprised if it was that high.

I think that MR members just have standards that are WAAAY more strict than even the strictest standards a "normal" reader would have. Most people wouldn't even notice a slight color fringe, or an overly yellow or blue screen, and if they notice, they probably wouldn't care. Many may not even notice pinholes.

My standards on a computer monitor are very high, so I know how this works. I want it to have an SPVA or IPS panel, I want it to have good calibration controls, and a stand that can be adjusted in height (or at least a VESA mount so I can put such a stand on the screen).

Also I want it to have a warranty of 5 years, and it must be completely and utterly silent, even with the backlight set under 100%. (Yes, a lot of monitors make buzzing sounds with the backlight under 100%.)

My demands on a monitor puts me squarely in the top mid-range or lower high-end of manufacturers such as Eizo, Lacie, NEC, and in some cases, DELL.

I've twice tried to replace my current screen, but sent all models back again either because of banding in the panel, or buzzing on lower brightness settings; even in the Eizo's I tried. (My current monitor is a 6.5 year old 19 inch Eizo; a high-end screen at the time it was released in 2006.)

If I take a look at the crap... eh... monitors some people use, I think they would have been utterly blown away by the monitors I've sent back as "not good enough".

[Barty]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Individually inspecting each and every screen would probably significantly increase the price - it's a compromise between a the proportion of good screens, and the cost of manufacture. A large majority of owners appear to be happy, which probably suggests they've got the compromise about right.

Right. These things aren't thousand dollars camera lenses. They already figured out x% of units with flaws is acceptable, knowing of those only y% of customers would notice or care.

Remember, if Amazon makes zero dollar from their hardware, they win. I'm sure they make more than zero dollar.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Barty

Remember, if Amazon makes zero dollar from their hardware, they win. I'm sure they make more than zero dollar.

Mr Bezos has said publicly that the Kindle is sold at cost price; he'd be in trouble with the SEC if he was lying.

[Drew0020]

Originally Posted by HarryT

It's also very noticeable that many of the people who report problems with the PW2 are the same people who had multiple replacement PW1s also, which would strongly suggest that personal perception is an important factor in determining what constitutes a "fault". (That's not a criticism of anyone who does perceive that their PW is faulty, let me stress.)

I had 1 PW1 and 6 PW2. All 6 of the PW2 have had multiple (obvious) pinholes in the screen using the light between 6-15.

[Blossom]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

I think that MR members just have standards that are WAAAY more strict than even the strictest standards a "normal" reader would have. Most people wouldn't even notice a slight color fringe, or an overly yellow or blue screen, and if they notice, they probably wouldn't care. Many may not even notice pinholes.

This is probably true. They don't know any better but if you look at reviews for the HDX you will see that is not the case 300 reviews and only 170ish are 5 star the rest mostly complaining about the blue/purple borders. most people might not know what a eInk screen suppose to look like but they sure know a LCD isn't suppose to have blue haze to it! Amazon is proving that they do not care about quality control anymore. First with the PW and now the disaster that is the HDX. Trying to pass a blue border off as normal is a joke! I know LCD have light bleed but this is much worst. I wouldn't hold my breath to see PW2 problems fixed.

However the K4 newest version that is out does not suffer from any problems like the first one did. Amazon proved once they can fix screen issues. I'm sure if they cared enough they could do it again the problem is they don't. They have proven that with the HDX blue border stunt.

My third HDX will be here today so I am hoping for one that looked like the first one without the brightness controller failure. It has a faint greenish blue border that look more like light bleed.

With all that being said seeing how Amazon is releasing the new devices without really fixing issues one has to accept that those here complaining are really getting bad units. It's not they are more sensitive or picky Sparklemotion proved that when she went to a new source and finally got a flawless PW2 she was so happy she wanted to dance on her desk.

Of course don't take your PW into dark room and turn it on 22 and expect not your eyes to play tricks on you. Test your PW under normal reading conditions and see if you are happy with it or not. If not welcome to the replacement game. *sigh*

[blackcat54]

With all the reported problems with the PW2, doesn't it make sense to buy it from a local B&M to handle quality problems with a quick local return/exchange?

[jocampo]

With thousands of devices being sold, I think it is virtually impossible to have 100% of those, free of any defect or hardware issue.

Back to my HP days, I remember that the quality control standards for Inject Cartridges was around 3% bad, if I am not mistaken. As long as 3% or less were bad, we were fine. Once we moved operations outside of USA territory, where labor is cheaper, including Engineers, that percentage went up to 5%, because the profit margin due low manufacturing cost was also higher.

Anyway, what I am trying to say, is that it is impossible to bring a perfect device. Sometimes people have bad luck, or just keep getting a device from the same batch (production day) where the Kindle was actually made, which is possible as well.

Me personally, I like to get mine from Best Buy. That way, I can go back and change it the same day, without all that hassle of shipping back, wait, shipping back again, etc. But I understand that's not so easy for those outside of USA, unless they can buy it directly from any local retailer, which I do not think is cheaper anyway.

[Blossom]

Originally Posted by blackcat54

With all the reported problems with the PW2, doesn't it make sense to buy it from a local B&M to handle quality problems with a quick local return/exchange?

It does if you try multiple sources you might get from a better batch! That what Sparklemotion did. She tried 3 different sources and third time was a charm for her.

[Blossom]

Originally Posted by jocampo

Anyway, what I am trying to say, is that it is impossible to bring a perfect device. Sometimes people have bad luck, or just keep getting a device from the same batch (production day) where the Kindle was actually made, which is possible as well.

That's what I think too they keep getting from the same shipment. All HDX for example seem to come from Indiana at least all 3 of mine have.

You might have to shop around from different stores to find a decent batch of Kindles.

[Drew0020]

Originally Posted by Blossom

That's what I think too they keep getting from the same shipment. All HDX for example seem to come from Indiana at least all 3 of mine have.

You might have to shop around from different stores to find a decent batch of Kindles.

I don't buy into the bad batch theory.

In my PW2 experience, I purchased the first 2 Kindle's from Amazon and a couple from different Best Buy's. All had pinholes. I dont want to beat a dead horse, but its simply poor QA.

[jgsmith]

I wonder if the problems reported with the PW1 and PW2 have more to do with the new light technology than reduced quality control. Their competitors seem to have the identical problems.

Jim

[Drew0020]

I got my Paperwhite 2 with 3G today. Thought there were no pinholes but I was wrong ugh. 1 in the center of the screen. that I can see. Oh well. I give up with the PW2.