Microsoft Surface Pro review - Page 2

tubemonkey · 02-06-2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pl001

And the removal of the start button was simply ridiculous and arrogant. If you need the desktop, you probably want the start button.

No start button? How do you find stuff?

Pookeysgirl · 02-06-2013, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

No start button? How do you find stuff?

I'd like to know this as well. I'm looking into getting a laptop to replace my desktop and I'm having a hard time finding one that's in my price range with Windows 7 on it. I really don't want to get W8 but might have no choice.

pl001 · 02-06-2013, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

No start button? How do you find stuff?

Windows Explorer is still there. Or you can copy stuff to the desktop. What they are trying to do though is force you to pin stuff to the Metro Start screen or use the search feature.

You don't technically need the start button it but it sure is nice. I'm willing to bet a lot of Win 8 devices are getting returned due to people getting frustrated with this kind of thing.

HarryT · 02-06-2013, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

No start button? How do you find stuff?

Using the Metro start screen. Which is a LOT more flexible than the "Start" menu.

Sydney's Mom · 02-06-2013, 12:36 PM

Thanks, HarryT. My husband is getting one of these, with the type cover and probably the video adapter. He said a lot of his collegues use ipads, but due to the fact that his business runs on Windows, an ipad would have limited use (email only). I hope I can avoid getting one - I really need another Ultrabook. The Microsoft store has the new Acer, but it seems a little pricey. But, I am freezing and rebooting several times a day, so I think my hard drive is going.

taustin · 02-06-2013, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pookeysgirl

I'd like to know this as well. I'm looking into getting a laptop to replace my desktop and I'm having a hard time finding one that's in my price range with Windows 7 on it. I really don't want to get W8 but might have no choice.

Dell has more computers with Windows 7 available than Windows 8. In many cases, 7 is the only option.

wodin · 02-06-2013, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

No start button? How do you find stuff?

There are several Start Button replacement apps, both paid and free. My Samsung ATIV Smart PC comes with one preloaded.

fjtorres · 02-06-2013, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murraypaul

It looks like a nice device, but is really an alternative to a laptop rather than an iOS/Android tablet.

Considering there are a zillion of the latter and very few of the former...

pl001 · 02-06-2013, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Using the Metro start screen. Which is a LOT more flexible than the "Start" menu.

How is it more flexible? It's just a bunch of tiles with very limited configuration options. Not a whole lot different than a traditional desktop with icons. Except the Live Tiles, which are neat but not all that useful, especially compared to Android Widgets.

HarryT · 02-06-2013, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pl001

How is it more flexible? It's just a bunch of tiles with very limited configuration options. Not a whole lot different than a traditional desktop with icons. Except the Live Tiles, which are neat but not all that useful, especially compared to Android Widgets.

It's more flexible because it IS tiles, which you can freely rearrange as you wish - more flexible than icons on the desktop (eg you're not limited to the dimensions of the physical screen), and a LOT more flexible than the "Start" menu. Yes, it's clearly inspired by tablet UIs such as the iPad and Android.

pl001 · 02-06-2013, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murraypaul

It looks like a nice device, but is really an alternative to a laptop rather than an iOS/Android tablet.

Depends on your needs. My RT has replaced my laptop in the sense that for personal mobile use it does everything I need it to. I still have my old laptop though as my main computer to store and work with pictures and video. If I had a desktop or home server, then yes even the RT would replace my laptop completely.

The Pro could replace my business laptop, if I decided less power and the small screen were an acceptable tradeoff for size. For me, I don't think it is. I'd rather have something in-between like a Lenovo Yoga.

pl001 · 02-06-2013, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

It's more flexible because it IS tiles, which you can freely rearrange as you wish - more flexible than icons on the desktop (eg you're not limited to the dimensions of the physical screen), and a LOT more flexible than the "Start" menu. Yes, it's clearly inspired by tablet UIs such as the iPad and Android.

OK, I'll grant you that it is more flexible if you have more icons than would fit on a single screen. But I can fit 187 icons on my 19" desktop. I certainly don't want the ability to add more instead of the start button. What makes sense on a tablet or phone doesn't always make sense on a PC.

The start button menu can be configured in many different ways. You can even rename stuff so it makes sense to you (A novel idea I'm sure with the youngest iOS and Android generation). Combined with icons you can have both one click access to your frequent stuff and easy access to everything else through a logical menu. It's hard to get more flexible than that. In my opinion anyway.

In any case, my point is that it was ridiculous to exclude that in an OS meant to be used on PCs.

Penforhire · 02-06-2013, 02:45 PM

Another review at my favorite tech site -- http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/...faster-louder/

xendula · 02-06-2013, 03:25 PM

It's fine if they thought that tiles were better, but they should have given us a choice, by leaving the start button in addition to the tiles.
Unless I am doing something wrong, the only way to get to my software in desktop mode so I can switch back and forth between apps while in desktop mode, is to create desktop shortcuts, and I hate cluttered desktops.

But back to the Surface - I like that it has the touch type cover to protect the screen when not in use. That's an advantage it has over the Ativ 700.

wizwor · 02-06-2013, 04:37 PM

The metro screen is the start menu spilled across your desktop. That's the best way to think of it. Even if you are in the desktop mode, hovering where the start button used to be brings up the metro icon and clicking that puts you in the desktop.

If you want a start menu on the desktop side, simply right click the task bar and select Toolbars then New Toolbar. In the dialog that comes up, browse to...

C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs

and click Select Folder. Now you will have a task called Programs with a chevron. Click the chevron for your start menu.

Now you can safely clean up your Desktop and get back to work!

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02-06-2013, 12:36 PM	#20
Sydney's Mom Wizard Posts: 2,899 Karma: 6995721 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Idaho, on the side of a mountain Device: Kindle Oasis, Fire 3d Gen and 5th Gen and Samsung Tab S	Thanks, HarryT. My husband is getting one of these, with the type cover and probably the video adapter. He said a lot of his collegues use ipads, but due to the fact that his business runs on Windows, an ipad would have limited use (email only). I hope I can avoid getting one - I really need another Ultrabook. The Microsoft store has the new Acer, but it seems a little pricey. But, I am freezing and rebooting several times a day, so I think my hard drive is going.

02-06-2013, 02:45 PM	#28
Penforhire Wizard Posts: 2,230 Karma: 7145404 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Southern California Device: Kindle Voyage & iPhone 7+	Another review at my favorite tech site -- http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/...faster-louder/

02-06-2013, 03:25 PM	#29
xendula eBookworm Posts: 2,300 Karma: 4525746 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: East Coast brrrrr Device: Kindle 4B/K ~ Nexus 7 ~ Kindle Paperwhite 1&2 ~ iPad Air	It's fine if they thought that tiles were better, but they should have given us a choice, by leaving the start button in addition to the tiles. Unless I am doing something wrong, the only way to get to my software in desktop mode so I can switch back and forth between apps while in desktop mode, is to create desktop shortcuts, and I hate cluttered desktops. But back to the Surface - I like that it has the touch type cover to protect the screen when not in use. That's an advantage it has over the Ativ 700.

02-06-2013, 04:37 PM	#30
wizwor Wizard Posts: 1,068 Karma: 23867385 Join Date: Nov 2011 Device: kindle, fire	The metro screen is the start menu spilled across your desktop. That's the best way to think of it. Even if you are in the desktop mode, hovering where the start button used to be brings up the metro icon and clicking that puts you in the desktop. If you want a start menu on the desktop side, simply right click the task bar and select Toolbars then New Toolbar. In the dialog that comes up, browse to... C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs and click Select Folder. Now you will have a task called Programs with a chevron. Click the chevron for your start menu. Now you can safely clean up your Desktop and get back to work!