Has Sony lost the e-book battle against Amazon?

[pilotbob]

Originally Posted by acidzebra

While I don't necessarily agree with the original hypothesis, by what are you measuring "winning"? Obviously, income/revenue is not a good indicator in a free product. But what about "running most of the WWW"? Does that work?

Winning would be overwhelming percentage of machines using it.If it is true... but it isn't actually. Its more like 40% with 40% to MS.

But, on the desktop Linux is less than 1% or so.

BOb

[Alisa]

Originally Posted by acidzebra

You realise that in Japan and large swaths of Europe there are already better/higher-speed cellular networks than EVDO, right? I think it is not so much a network availability issue (except for the roaming stuff which is still a mess everywhere) as it is of differing copyright laws, messy international law, and publishing rights messes.

There are also partnerships with carriers that would need to be made. I don't think folks would be so keen on Whispernet if they had to deal with Sprint themselves and pay a monthly fee. One of the selling points is that Amazon takes care of all of that for you and rolls it into the price of the content.

[acidzebra]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

Winning would be overwhelming percentage of machines using it.If it is true... but it isn't actually. Its more like 40% with 40% to MS.

You are right there, BOb, my data was obviously, er, out of date (although it is more 50% - 35% in favor of linux, and should the google/ platform be counted, a little more).

http://news.netcraft.com/archives/we...er_survey.html

(I take comfort in the fact that the big and reliable by and large still run linux or some other free flavored OS)

And sure, linux on the desktop is an utter minority (we are a proud minority, though). But the windows Vista fiasco is sure to entice more people to check out Apple, Linux, and the rest. Which hopefully will drive development, and so on. Who knows. And of course the embedded market is a different story again.

Originally Posted by Alisa

There are also partnerships with carriers that would need to be made.

Good point, and as a network admin with offices in countries all over Europe and beyond I know what a mess carriers here are. Almost no cross-border agreements (well, with stiff roaming charges) so the Kindle would have to be sold per-country and in each country they would have to negotiate a partnership with someone.

[=X=]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

So, why isn't Linux winning?

BOb

Okay what I said was more tongue and cheek, but since you asked

Winning is a vague term here, but the OS wars have been fought on many platforms and are nowhere near being over. Servers, Desktops, and embedded systems to name a few of the major sectors.

Linux has dominated the Server field for serveral years now, the embedded side has many players, but Linux is a major player here. One area that Linux nor any OS has made a dent is on the Desktop, Microsoft is still the undisputed champ. Though Linux continues to make inroads to it.

BTW Microsoft's biggest fear is not Linux but Google.

=X=

[nekokami]

And Google runs on?

Yeah, I know, it's not the same thing.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I know what would satisfy a lot of people.... Take the 505, add in the wifi, give it a detachable keyboard, and add in AZW/Mobipocket support to what we already have and you've got a winner that should satisfy 505 lovers and Kindle lovers. So we'd have a device that supports BBeB, ePub, PDF, Mobipocket (no-DRM), & AZW.

Originally Posted by rhadin

This device is already available from 100s of vendors. It's called, among other things, a laptop computer.

I'm not talking about a laptop. I'm taking the 505 and Kindle and making a 6" eink device that would be better then either of them. And having the optional detachable keyboard would work even better then what the Kindle has now. When you don't need it, it makes the device smaller and lighter.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

Yes, it's been used. For what it's worth, the Kindle is the victim of moronic promoters in that respect... they don't know how to take a good picture. Not only have I seen a good picture of the Kindle, but I've seen it up-close, and it's not nearly as fugly as it seems in Amazon's promotional material. Take a look at the pic below.

And despite that, and the fact that there was no store to see one before you bought one, its promotion has kicked Sony's a$$.

Can a photo be taken were the Kindle doesn't look like a wedge?

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

Well, this is how OS/2 lost to Windows and Betamax lost to VHS... so marketing is important... it doesn't really matter which is the better product now does it? Sony learned it's lesson which is why Blu-Ray beat HD-DVD, right?

BOb

Actually, marketing has nothing to do with beta vs. VHS. What one the battle was that porn came out on VHS first (or was it more porn came out on VHS?). But anyway, VHS won because of porn.

[SanAntone]

I have to agree that Sony blew it. I've been an ebook reader for years, on the Rocket Ebook and then the Palm platforms. I wanted a Sony Reader pretty badly...until I started looking closer. (I'll agree that the engineering and design is very good).

Here's what I found in my situation:
No Mac compatibility. Why? How hard is it to make your website for downloads compatible with a Mac?

Lack of content. No significant effort to provide lots of current best sellers. I'm not interested in Project Gutenberg books. I want to find a new book I've heard about or read a review on and buy it easily.

Tethered to a computer. This was genius on Amazon's part. I can take my Kindle anywhere (coffee shop, car shop, pool area, etc) and download a magazine or book if the mood strikes me. No worries about Mac or PC. No worries about transferring files over.

Great customer support. Amazon has it. Sony used to have this. I used to have Sony Computers, Minidisc, Televisions...everything. No more. I went into a Sony Style store when the Reader had been out for a month and was seriously looking at it. I asked if it was Mac compatible...no one in the store knew. "I think so" was the answer. Hmmm.

Just my thoughts.

[bobbarkerissatan]

Originally Posted by nekokami

And Google runs on?

Yeah, I know, it's not the same thing.

...any system with a web browser.

[acidzebra]

Originally Posted by nekokami

And Google runs on?

Yeah, I know, it's not the same thing.

the Google backed does run (AFAIK) on a highly customized linux variant. And speaking of Google, by that Netcraft survey I posted earlier they have carved out a 6% niche of all servers on the net for themselves in a mere two years.

They are like the freaking borg, I tell you. Boorgle.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Actually, marketing has nothing to do with beta vs. VHS. What one the battle was that porn came out on VHS first (or was it more porn came out on VHS?). But anyway, VHS won because of porn.

That's an urban myth; see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Videotape_format_war

...Sony, being the first producer to offer their technology, thought it would establish Betamax as the leading format. This kind of lock-in and path dependence is exactly what economists point out as the Betamax weak link.

Further driving the VHS format was its inherent 2 hour playback time - a much better fit for Hollywood movies and which spawned the huge video rental business that flourished in the 90's. Being able to watch Hollywood rental movies was a major reason for North American consumers to purchase a VCR. To their credit, executives at JVC foresaw this and thus the VHS format's Standard Play time of 120 minutes was VHS's design goal right from the beginning. On the other hand virtually all commercially pre-recorded Beta titles were done in Beta II (half) speed in order to achieve a 2 hour playback time with some loss of picture quality.

What Sony didn't take into account was what the consumers wanted. Sony believed that having better quality recordings was the key to success, whereas it soon became clear that consumer desire was focused more intently on recording time and compatibility for easy transfer of information.

[TadW]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Actually, marketing has nothing to do with beta vs. VHS. What one the battle was that porn came out on VHS first (or was it more porn came out on VHS?). But anyway, VHS won because of porn.

Marketing has all to do with it. Why do you think certain industries (like the adult industry9 jump on one wagon, but not the other? Have you not heard about the hundreds of millions of dollars paid by Toshiba (HD DVD) and Sony (Blu-Ray) to various movie houses in hope for the latter to support their format?

[Chuckwade87]

I'm also pretty confident in Sony, for the fact that they prolly arent going to just sit back and watch Amazon's Kindle sell off the shelves either.
I would give Sony a few months or so and they will prolly release some new plans. But for sure the Amazon Kindle has won this round of the fight, we just need to see what Sony does in return.
Its been stated in here that the Kindle is ugly. I would have to agree, Its a face only a mother could love. And it isnt the best pdf viewer, but considering that most of the newer books from amazon are also being offered in kindle.
I would really like to be able to view comics and stuff like that on the Kindle but havent figured it out yet. Can you view comics and the like on the Sony?

[TadW]

I think the form of the device is irrelevant. It's even irrelevant if Sony manages to bring out a new device with similar connectivity like the Kindle. Key to success is the store. Why do you think Apple has put so much focus on their iTunes stores? App Store has already been responsible for 60 million downloads! This is where the big money comes from, not from the selling of hardware.

To succeed, Sony would have to come up with a one stop shop that even tops Amazon - something, given Amazon's long history and experience in online book retailing, I find impossible to do. Hence Sony's days in the e-book biz are numbered... unless, perhaps, if they concentrated on the hardware and became exclusive hardware supplier to Amazon, they could still stand a chance...