Google’s e-book deal could slow rise of Amazon Kindle in Europe

[murraypaul]

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Agreed but geographically they are tied to Europe. Which is why I think people are always a bit confused by the UK. It is also why there tends to be tension between those governments. France and Germany know that they have to be able to work with the UK but are not thrilled with how close the UK is with the US and other former colonies.

And while I'm no fan of Thatcher, I think see did quite accurately sum up Britain's historical approach to Europe:

But we British have in a very special way contributed to Europe.

Over the centuries we have fought to prevent Europe from falling under the dominance of a single power.

British foreign policy for centuries was devoted to preventing a united Europe. In any European war we would generally ally with the weaker side, in order to prevent the stronger side from gaining, thus preserving a balance of power.
We wanted Europe to have internal discord and wars, but didn't want anyone to ever actually win. The more energy they expended in fighting each other, the less left to fight us.
A truly united Europe has always been seen as a serious threat to the UK. That used to be a military threat, now an economic threat. Already there have been moves to try and force Euro-denominated trading to take place in Euro-zone countries only, a clear poke at London.
At some point Europe is going to get fed up with the UK, decide to move forwards to a true federation, and require the UK to either join or leave completely, and neither is a palatable choice. We want to be in enough to exert control, but not enough to be controlled.

As always, Yes Minister put it better:

Sir Humphrey: Minister, Britain has had the same foreign policy objective for at least the last five hundred years: to create a disunited Europe. In that cause we have fought with the Dutch against the Spanish, with the Germans against the French, with the French and Italians against the Germans, and with the French against the Germans and Italians. Divide and rule, you see. Why should we change now, when it's worked so well?
Hacker: That's all ancient history, surely?
Sir Humphrey: Yes, and current policy. We 'had' to break the whole thing [the EEC] up, so we had to get inside. We tried to break it up from the outside, but that wouldn't work. Now that we're inside we can make a complete pig's breakfast of the whole thing: set the Germans against the French, the French against the Italians, the Italians against the Dutch. The Foreign Office is terribly pleased; it's just like old times.
Hacker: But surely we're all committed to the European ideal?
Sir Humphrey: [chuckles] Really, Minister.
Hacker: If not, why are we pushing for an increase in the membership?
Sir Humphrey: Well, for the same reason. It's just like the United Nations, in fact; the more members it has, the more arguments it can stir up, the more futile and impotent it becomes.
Hacker: What appalling cynicism.
Sir Humphrey: Yes... We call it diplomacy, Minister.

Hacker: Europe is a community of nations, dedicated towards one goal.
Sir Humphrey: Oh, ha ha ha.
Hacker: May we share the joke, Humphrey?
Sir Humphrey: Oh Minister, let's look at this objectively. It is a game played for national interests, and always was. Why do you suppose we went into it?
Hacker: To strengthen the brotherhood of free Western nations.
Sir Humphrey: Oh really. We went in to screw the French by splitting them off from the Germans.
Hacker: So why did the French go into it, then?
Sir Humphrey: Well, to protect their inefficient farmers from commercial competition.
Hacker: That certainly doesn't apply to the Germans.
Sir Humphrey: No, no. They went in to cleanse themselves of genocide and apply for readmission to the human race.
Hacker: I never heard such appalling cynicism! At least the small nations didn't go into it for selfish reasons.
Sir Humphrey: Oh really? Luxembourg is in it for the perks; the capital of the EEC, all that foreign money pouring in.
Hacker: Very sensible central location.
Sir Humphrey: With the administration in Brussels and the Parliament in Strasbourg? Minister, it's like having the House of Commons in Swindon and the Civil Service in Kettering!

[murraypaul]

To go all pop-psychology on you, I think a lot of the problem with the UK attitude towards Europe is the arrogance of the unbeaten. We haven't lost a war in too long, and are fixated in our national self view as plucky Britain standing alone against the world, bloody but unbowed. We haven't really lost a home game in almost 1000 years.
If you look at all the other major European powers, there is still a reasonably recent memory of defeat, and a much stronger desire to work together to avoid anything similar.

[Kumabjorn]

There is a similar attitude prevailing in Sweden. We have avoided conflict for more than 300 years, other nations simply don't understand peace.

[GlenBarrington]

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Dude, 50% of American's cannot located to US on a the globe. I had a set of students, five in the group, turn in a paper on the UK and list Germany as a country that borders the UK. These were college students. Five of them in one group turning in one paper. They actually argued with me when I deducted points for their answer. I had to pull down a map and point out Germany and the UK, the countries in between Germany and the UK, nevermind the large expanse of water.

They took their complaint to the department chair. I have never seen a grown man laugh so hard in my life.

But, I think most Americans would say that the UK is located in Europe and some of us would chuckle and mention that who in the EU but not using the Euro, continental Europe vs Europe thing.

I don't believe you, I think you made that 'statistic' up. Document your claim with some reputable research. What that means is you can't document it by using a quote from someone else who hasn't documented such a claim. That's how proof works. You opened your yap, now back it up. . .

[Fluribus]

Originally Posted by stonetools

What's a UK?

Those sheepskin boots that come from Australia.

[plib]

Originally Posted by GlenBarrington

I don't believe you, I think you made that 'statistic' up. Document your claim with some reputable research. What that means is you can't document it by using a quote from someone else who hasn't documented such a claim. That's how proof works. You opened your yap, now back it up. . .

Survey reveals geographic illiteracy." "Sweden scored highest; Mexico, lowest. The U.S. was next to last."

Not 50% perhaps, but still pretty appalling - in all countries. Still the US did beat Mexico. (They probably knew where Acapulco was from Spring Break)

[Indio777]

Originally Posted by MikeB1972

You think they have problem with the UK - how many Americans know Russia is in Europe?

And lets not get started on Kazakhstan.

Actually, I've always thought Kazakhstan was in Central Asia, along with the other former-USSR "stans." Oops.

Russia is in Europe (at least the western part where most of the population is) but isn't also considered a transcontinental state in the sense that parts of it are in Central and Northern Asia?

[Yapyap]

Originally Posted by Indio777

Actually, I've always thought Kazakhstan was in Central Asia, along with the other former-USSR "stans." Oops.

Russia is in Europe (at least the western part where most of the population is) but isn't also considered a transcontinental state in the sense that parts of it are in Central and Northern Asia?

I am pretty sure Kazakhstan is generally considered Asian (Central Asian, yes) for most purposes, much the same way Turkey is generally considered Asian, even though both countries have a small part of their territory geographically in Europe.

With Russia, there is so much of it in Europe (including St Petersburg, Moscow and most other important centres of population), that it's generally considered part of Europe. (Besides, the actual Rus part of Russia is geographically in Europe - most of what's on the other side of the Urals is Siberia, which has only been part of Russia for a few hundred years.)

[Lynx-lynx]

Originally Posted by HarryT

I really have to take issue with:



eBook sales in the UK are far from "miniscule", to my mind.

Wow - I never think of GB in Europe, Briton stands outside Europe I thought - are you saying that Britons call themselves Europeans?

[Lynx-lynx]

Originally Posted by Kumabjorn

Yes, Britons always talks about Europe as an entity outside GB. So in that sense the article seems correct. But to be more precisely, eBook sales are miniscule in non-English speaking countries. This isn't related to continets, right Aussies?

Hi Kumabjorn, I'm not sure I understand your question ..... (but yes we are a Continent, as well as a country)

For info I've just done a search to try and find ebook sales as a proportion of all books sales here in Aus, but apparently it's not collected openly as is paper book quantum.

Hmmm ....

[Kumabjorn]

Originally Posted by Lynx-lynx

Hi Kumabjorn, I'm not sure I understand your question ..... (but yes we are a Continent, as well as a country)

Being an English speaking nation I figured you would also have a fairly decent percentage of the population reading eBooks. It seems to be popular in Canada, so I thought it would be so also in Australia and NZ.

[Lynx-lynx]

I know I've joined this party very late .... and most of the party goers have probably had enough and are getting ready to leave ... but ....

I regard Australia as being in the South Pacific, along with New Zealand and Fiji, and Tahiti and Hawaii etc.

In that sense, I regard myself as a South Pacific Islander.

Interestingly, because of geographic remoteness issues FIFA (the international soccer/football body) has placed us in an inter country league with countries like:

Iraq
Uzbekistan
Syria
Jordan
China
Japan
Korea
Saudi Arabia
UAE
India
etc

Which must make our competition one of the most culturally diverse of all the FIFA contests.

[Lynx-lynx]

Oh and on another matter .....

To our Austrian members I wholeheartedly agree with the t-shirts some of your country folk wear when visiting overseas:

Austria
No Kangaroos

Yep folks, it's us here in Australia that have the kangaroos!!!

(The first time I saw that t-shirt was on an Austrian fellow traveller on a Nile River boat in Egypt. He (and some of the group he was with) said that their Austrian identity was being subverted by people not properly understanding them say Austria in response to 'where are you from'. For what ever reason people heard them say Australia)

[stonetools]

Originally Posted by Lynx-lynx

Oh and on another matter .....

To our Austrian members I wholeheartedly agree with the t-shirts some of your country folk wear when visiting overseas:

Austria
No Kangaroos

Yep folks, it's us here in Australia that have the kangaroos!!!

(The first time I saw that t-shirt was on an Austrian fellow traveller on a Nile River boat in Egypt. He (and some of the group he was with) said that their Austrian identity was being subverted by people not properly understanding them say Austria in response to 'where are you from'. For what ever reason people heard them say Australia)

Lots of Americans think "Edelweiss" is the Austrian national anthem... when they think of Austria at all.

[Scott Nicholson]

This doesn't sound that different from Google Books in the U.S., which suck and nobody every sells or buys. If you liked scanned public-domain works, it is great, but I don't see any game-changers here. A positive is that digital books are getting some play, but I doubt it is Google that becomes a leader in any way.

Nice to see that Google is finally being recognized as the world's most blatant and visible digital pirate, though.