Spanish Booksellers' Assoc. suing Amazon for not respecting the fixed price of books

[Terisa de morgan]

Originally Posted by andreabc

I'm thinking it won't be long for someone to realize that there's another Spanish edition coming out in August for the international market (10€ w/free shipping from The Book Depository).

Yes, it's the same translation but quite cheaper. However, I'm afraid I go with the expensive version. As I don't buy paperbooks now, and this is one of the few series I follow in paper format (this one, Vorkosigan Spanish edition and Anita Blake), I'm going to spoil myself buying the expensive one, and all the covers will be the same. If it wasn't this case, I would buy the other one.

[andreabc]

Originally Posted by Terisa de morgan

and all the covers will be the same. If it wasn't this case, I would buy the other one.

I also try to stick to the same edition/covers when buying books from a series... which is another reason why these days I'm more likely to buy a book if it's a stand-alone novel.

In any case, I'm sure that some Spanish fans of ASOIF would go for the cheap edition if they knew about it... (I've been hearing a lot of grumbling over on twitter.) Personally, I'm waiting until the entire series is finished before reading the books.

[ProfCrash]

Originally Posted by andreabc

I also try to stick to the same edition/covers when buying books from a series... which is another reason why these days I'm more likely to buy a book if it's a stand-alone novel.

In any case, I'm sure that some Spanish fans of ASOIF would go for the cheap edition if they knew about it... (I've been hearing a lot of grumbling over on twitter.) Personally, I'm waiting until the entire series is finished before reading the books.

Smart move. It will be less frustrating that way.

[Terisa de morgan]

Originally Posted by andreabc

Personally, I'm waiting until the entire series is finished before reading the books.

I've said I'm buying it, not I've read the books (my mother has done it, however)

[Fbone]

The Spanish edition should cost a little more as you need to pay translators.

[HansTWN]

Originally Posted by stonetools

And maybe some businesses go out of business, despite being well run, because the playing field is unfairly tilted against them. You can't simply conclude that just because a company goes out of business that it is poorly run or employing the wrong business model. That's why more analysis is needed. What we're getting here is slogans and stereotypes.
"Entropy rules?" Give me a break.
Now it maybe that "Nothing can be done." But if so, we are losing a lot. Look at the passing of record stores. I discovered more new music in an afternoon of browsing in a record store than I have in 10 years on the Internet. Browsing in a B&M book store tends to be just better for discovering new stuff.
Then of course there is whole economic argument. How much does Amazon contribute to the Spanish economy or building up local Spanish infrastructure? My guess is zero.
If you think in slogans, you miss these points.

So, according to you, if something is done about the sales tax issue then the playing field is even and you would fully support the return to a whole sale model.

[andreabc]

Originally Posted by HansTWN

So, according to you, if something is done about the sales tax issue then the playing field is even and you would fully support the return to a whole sale model.

In the EU, Amazon collects VAT for all physical goods according to the destination country. I'm not sure about the VAT for ebooks, (it might be the Luxembourg rate?)

Corporate tax (the whole Luxembourg thing) is another issue.

[Andanzas]

I haven't read anything about this in the Spanish media. As far as I know, nobody has sued Amazon in Spain so far. We'll see if it happens, but so far is just one guy talking.

In Spain book prices are set by the publishing houses. When an ebook is discounted in Amazon, Amazon shows the usual disclaimer about the price being set by the publisher. Right now Alfaguara (one of the main literary publishers in Spain) is having a sale of certain titles:

El editor ha reducido el precio de venta de este eBook sólo del 25 al 31 de mayo de 2012.

How is he going to sue Amazon if the prices are set by the publishers?

If you take a look at the bestseller list at Amazon Spain, you'll see lots of cheap ebooks written in Spanish or translated into Spanish, which means that there are publishing houses and writers who are embracing the change or at least trying to adapt to it. On the other hand, booksellers resent the new environment, and lots of readers are switching to ebooks. Big news. That's pretty much like everywhere else, isn't it?

[murraypaul]

Originally Posted by andreabc

In the EU, Amazon collects VAT for all physical goods according to the destination country.

This isn't correct (or is technically correct, but misses the point).
If the item is cheap enough (I believe the limit is GBP 18 for UK customs), the item is exempt from import duty.
So if you order a DVD from Amazon, it will be shipped from their Jersey outfiit (Indigo Starfish), which is not part of the EU, so it is not required to collect VAT, and the item is cheap enough that it (on your behalf) is not required to pay import duty, so no taxes are paid.
(Technically Indigo Starfish are an "independent preferred merchant")

[djulian]

Originally Posted by teh603

A book sold for a higher price commands more tax revenue, which can be used by the government to pay off debt. At least in theory.

True, but there's a point at which the prices are so high that the net taxes are actually reduced.

Originally Posted by stonetools

How much does Amazon contribute to the Spanish economy or building up local Spanish infrastructure? My guess is zero.

Unless you consider the benefits to a population when more people read (which seems to happen when prices for popular books remain low). Reading can improve creativity, it can drive new concepts, it can unify disparate social groups--all of these have a positive effect on an economy (though not necessarily one which is easily quantifiable).

[andreabc]

Originally Posted by murraypaul

This isn't correct (or is technically correct, but misses the point).
If the item is cheap enough (I believe the limit is GBP 18 for UK customs), the item is exempt from import duty.
So if you order a DVD from Amazon, it will be shipped from their Jersey outfiit (Indigo Starfish), which is not part of the EU, so it is not required to collect VAT, and the item is cheap enough that it (on your behalf) is not required to pay import duty, so no taxes are paid.
(Technically Indigo Starfish are an "independent preferred merchant")

OK, yes, but that is a UK-specific thing (a loophole that was going to be closed, right?)
IndigoStarfish doesn't sell through amazon.es or ship to Spain.

[stonetools]

Unless you consider the benefits to a population when more people read (which seems to happen when prices for popular books remain low). Reading can improve creativity, it can drive new concepts, it can unify disparate social groups--all of these have a positive effect on an economy (though not necessarily one which is easily quantifiable).

If I were Spanish, I would take taxes that could be used to build a library or school, thanks.

[stonetools]

Originally Posted by HansTWN

So, according to you, if something is done about the sales tax issue then the playing field is even and you would fully support the return to a whole sale model.

It would be a start. Its not really a problem that could be solved with one click.
The whole sale/agency dispute is really more about publisher/retail dynamics and again can't be solved with one click.

[Fluribus]

Originally Posted by stonetools

Sure if you are one of the entitled folks who can afford a computer, an Internet connection , and (multiple) reading devices. What if you don't have any of that , but just want to buy a book from a local bookstore? Sucks then, doesn't it?

Those people can't afford to pay 46 euros (about $58) for a book from the local store. I certainly couldn't afford those prices.

How does it help poor folks to eliminate providers who charge less?!

Yes, it does suck to be poor. It also sucks to be crippled. Adding increased prices increases the amount of suckage.

[ProfCrash]

I make good money and I would not buy a book for $58.