A Fairer Fair Use?

[wodin]

Originally Posted by Belfaborac

I want my ebooks to work exactly the way paper books do: pay for it, receive it, do whatever I want with it. End of story.

So if your paper book is accidentally burned, shredded or otherwise rendered unreadable, can you just restore a backup copy and be good to go?

[Giggleton]

Originally Posted by wodin

So if your paper book is accidentally burned, shredded or otherwise rendered unreadable, can you just restore a backup copy and be good to go?

Buying the right to read... Format shifting??

[SteveEisenberg]

Originally Posted by wodin

So if your paper book is accidentally burned, shredded or otherwise rendered unreadable, can you just restore a backup copy and be good to go?

Do you have fire insurance?

[wodin]

I wasn't addressing that, I was just pointing out ONE advantage to digital copies of books that I rarely if ever see discussed here. And if Belfaborac wants his/her "ebooks to work exactly the way paper books do”, then best not make backups!

[SteveEisenberg]

Originally Posted by wodin

And if Belfaborac wants his/her "ebooks to work exactly the way paper books do”, then best not make backups!

Plus, we'll have to let Barnes & Noble place their security cameras so the customers get caught when they transfer goods without paying.

P.S. And there are some former employees of our local school district who can help:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_1...85-504083.html

[wodin]

As I recall that suit, they found some flunky scapegoat to pin it on.

[wodin]

Never mind, duplicate post

[Belfaborac]

Originally Posted by wodin

So if your paper book is accidentally burned, shredded or otherwise rendered unreadable, can you just restore a backup copy and be good to go?

Are you actually saying that you didn't understand that the subject was the rights you have regarding what to do with a book after purchase? Really? Really really?

[Kumabjorn]

Originally Posted by Belfaborac

Are you actually saying that you didn't understand that the subject was the rights you have regarding what to do with a book after purchase? Really? Really really?

I think wodin was saying that if there are drawbacks with eBooks there are also limitations to pBooks. A dog can't eat your eBooks, should the dog destroy your eReader you'll still have lots of options to get your whole library back, in a house fire that would be almost impossible.

With cassette tapes you accepted lower fidelity for convenience. There are always trade offs when shifting media.

[Belfaborac]

But those points are blindingly obvious and I never claimed otherwise. I only addressed the rights I am granted or not granted in terms of the use of my books after purchase. Hence I fail to see why it was styled as a reply to me in the first place.

[StephenM]

Originally Posted by Freeshadow

As soon as there are some auth. servers or tokens involved your "as many times as you wish" changes to "as long as we don't pull the plug" and since companies have no real interest in their customers than their money this happens frequently enough. Thanks. As it's been said: we've seen it with games.
In cases of unfair use the rightholders are free to go the way everyone else mistreated is free to do.
That's what courts are for. I see no reason for being chained by them "just in case"

Does anyone remember "PlaysForSure" from Microsoft? This was their digital music DRM scheme, and a lot of people who purchased music DRM-encoded with it got seriously burned when Microsoft turned off the "PlaysForSure" servers several years ago. Suddenly, a lot of purchased music was suddenly unplayable, and this was caused by a large corporation with huge revenues, and is still around. If Microsoft can do it, so can Barnes and Noble, Amazon, Chapters, etc. What if Borders had their own DRM scheme? Would all the Borders customers now be out of luck, since they are now no longer in business?

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by StephenM

If Microsoft can do it, so can Barnes and Noble, Amazon, Chapters, etc. What if Borders had their own DRM scheme? Would all the Borders customers now be out of luck, since they are now no longer in business?

Amazon *did* do this, with ebooks, before the Kindle. They used to offer PDF ebooks; when they stopped, people lost access to their books after upgrades.

If Amazon switches to ePub, they'll probably just drop any books they no longer have the rights to (books that have switched ownership or otherwise been pulled from sale) because they won't have the permissions to provide them in a new format. Switching between mobi and epub is simple enough that they probably won't drop their entire line--but they may stop providing books to the current Kindle apps and older Kindles, and tell people that if they want access to their library, they need an updated device/app, which of course will only allow downloads of the books they still have rights to sell.

DRM is only a minor nuisance until the company providing it changes business plans, at which point it becomes "all your purchases are useless."

[wodin]

Originally Posted by Belfaborac

Are you actually saying that you didn't understand that the subject was the rights you have regarding what to do with a book after purchase? Really? Really really?

No, I'm saying that digital books and paper books are not the same, and that's the problem. You can easily copy (backup if that salves your conscience), and redistribute a digital file but you can't easily do that with paper that's more than a few pages.

You said you wanted to do everything with an ebook that you can with a pbook, but by the nature of paper you can’t do everything with a pbook that you can with an ebook. From the publishers’ and by extension the authors’ point of view ebooks are very threatening to their business model. They can’t put the jinni back in the bottle, so they have to adapt. Some are going kicking and screaming, and others are experimenting with and embracing new models.

When the dust settles we will see a very different landscape, and I for one can’t wait to see it happen.

[Belfaborac]

Originally Posted by wodin

You said you wanted to do everything with an ebook that you can with a pbook

I didn't say that at all. I said I want ebooks to work exactly the same as paper books. From the context in which it is written - that being the original question posed - that can only be misconstrued to mean that I want ebooks to be exactly like physical books if you try really, really hard.

[no.guru]

Originally Posted by Laridae

But it's precisely because they are in a different medium that the rights of the consumer have changed. Of course we, as consumers, would love it to be business as usual with what we've always considered "our property" bought and paid for.

But, consider for a moment the transaction from the producer's point of view. The fundamental difference now is that the eBook is now easily replicated, ad infinitum, at practically no cost, and with no loss of quality. That situation has never happened before with normal, material property.

And that changes everything! It's not business as usual anymore, I'm afraid. And the buffalo no longer roam the great plains either, I'm afraid, sigh!

Scare quotes around our property pretty much sums it up, doesn't it?

I reject the idea that readers are to be treated as theives by default. Our books are the ones I check out at the library.