DRM Good or Bad? - Page 16

ApK · 03-28-2012, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anamardoll

But you delete them from your device when you're done -- it's on the honor system.

[...]
DRM is not even remotely necessary for libraries to function. It may be desirable, but that's a matter of opinion. (One I don't agree with.)

Libraries have been lending mp3 music and audiobooks in this way for quite a while.

So clearly the libraries are ok with no technological enforcement of due dates. However, the 'not even remotely necessary' becomes "absolutely necessarily" when you factor in that the publishers would not allow the books to be lent otherwise.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

How is DRM helping your bottom line? Who is buying your work because of DRM, who wouldn't buy it otherwise?

I would suspect that the people on MR are pretty savy when it comes to DRM, but would Joe Public know DRM from a whole in their head and would they care? Once they had read the book, would they want to transfer it to another device? I'm not sure.

Elfwreck · 03-29-2012, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Nemo

I would suspect that the people on MR are pretty savy when it comes to DRM, but would Joe Public know DRM from a whole in their head and would they care? Once they had read the book, would they want to transfer it to another device? I'm not sure.

Mostly? They don't care. It comes up when they decide they're tired of their Kindle 2 and want to "upgrade" to a Nook Color--and find out their library can't be swapped over. Or they have a Kindle Fire and decide to get a Kobo because it's on sale and they've heard about the amazing battery life.

Authors should be concerned about this, because while many people are content to abandon their previous library when they acquire a new device, that means they're no longer looking at those books in their current to-read collection, and no longer thinking about them when they consider, "what should I recommend to my buddy who wants something good to read this weekend?" Out of sight, out of mind; books they read and abandon aren't handed along, even by suggestion, to new readers.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Mostly? They don't care. It comes up when they decide they're tired of their Kindle 2 and want to "upgrade" to a Nook Color--and find out their library can't be swapped over. Or they have a Kindle Fire and decide to get a Kobo because it's on sale and they've heard about the amazing battery life.

Authors should be concerned about this, because while many people are content to abandon their previous library when they acquire a new device, that means they're no longer looking at those books in their current to-read collection, and no longer thinking about them when they consider, "what should I recommend to my buddy who wants something good to read this weekend?" Out of sight, out of mind; books they read and abandon aren't handed along, even by suggestion, to new readers.

OK the way I see it, and I may be wrong, it has been said before,

is if you have your ebook library in Calibre, which is in a folder on your hard disc and let's say you add a mobi to your library. If you change your ereader and want to reread it, you plug in your ereader and drop the book onto the device icon and Calibre will convert it to your new format. So does Calibre break the DRM or will it just not convert it? Because it converts secured PDF's which is similar.

pdurrant · 03-29-2012, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Nemo

So does Calibre break the DRM or will it just not convert it? Because it converts secured PDF's which is similar.

Calibre does not break DRM during conversions. In fact, calibre doesn't break DRM at all. If you think you've seen standard calibre convert a secure PDF you're mistaken.

There are third-party calibre plugins that remove DRM, but these only remove DRM on import into calibre, not during conversion.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

If you think you've seen standard calibre convert a secure PDF you're mistaken.

Sorry to disagree once again, but I've done it. But just to be sure I'll go and try it again and let you know.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

If you think you've seen standard calibre convert a secure PDF you're mistaken.

OK I opened a PDF in Adobe Acrobat Pro. I secured it with a password and saved it. I took it in to Calibre version 0.8.43 and converted it to mobi format and loaded onto my Kindle. You had me going there for a minute.

ApK · 03-29-2012, 01:50 PM

A password protected PDF is a totally different beast than an Adobe Digital Editions DRM protected PDF.

Elfwreck · 03-29-2012, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Nemo

OK I opened a PDF in Adobe Acrobat Pro. I secured it with a password and saved it. I took it in to Calibre version 0.8.43 and converted it to mobi format and loaded onto my Kindle. You had me going there for a minute.

Does it work with a PDF that needs a password to open, rather than one that needs a password to edit?

pdurrant · 03-29-2012, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Nemo

OK I opened a PDF in Adobe Acrobat Pro. I secured it with a password and saved it. I took it in to Calibre version 0.8.43 and converted it to mobi format and loaded onto my Kindle. You had me going there for a minute.

Did you enter the password into calibre? If so, how? If not, how do you think the password protection was defeated? If you tried to open the original PDF in some other PDF viewer, did you get a warning that the file was password protected and couldn't be viewed?

When I try to do that, I get a big

"Cannot convert password.

This book is locked by DRM. To learn more about DRM and why you cannot read or convert this book in calibre, click here.

A large number of recent, DRM free releases are available at Open Books."

dialog.

I suspect that you did not correctly apply a password that encrypted the contents of the PDF, or you accidentally imported the non-drm version, or you have previously imported the non-drm version, and then imported the drm version, thinking it would replace the earlier copy (it doesn't).

Calibre does not contain any DRM removal code, nor can it view or convert password protected PDFs.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApK

A password protected PDF is a totally different beast than an Adobe Digital Editions DRM protected PDF.

Er... Yes

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Does it work with a PDF that needs a password to open, rather than one that needs a password to edit?

Why would you want to set your pdf so that you can only open it with a password, that would really upset people and defeat the object.

pdurrant · 03-29-2012, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin Nemo

Why would you want to set your pdf so that you can only open it with a password, that would really upset people and defeat the object.

That's what a password protected PDF is. It needs a password to decrypt the contents.

If the PDF you tried didn't need a password to open, then yes, calibre could convert it. Because it was not encrypted.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

Did you enter the password into calibre? If so, how? If not, how do you think the password protection was defeated? If you tried to open the original PDF in some other PDF viewer, did you get a warning that the file was password protected and couldn't be viewed?

When I try to do that, I get a big

"Cannot convert password.

This book is locked by DRM. To learn more about DRM and why you cannot read or convert this book in calibre, click here.

A large number of recent, DRM free releases are available at Open Books."

dialog.

I suspect that you did not correctly apply a password that encrypted the contents of the PDF, or you accidentally imported the non-drm version, or you have previously imported the non-drm version, and then imported the drm version, thinking it would replace the earlier copy (it doesn't).

Calibre does not contain any DRM removal code, nor can it view or convert password protected PDFs.

Perhaps we're talking at cross purposes again. The only reason I have secured PDF's in the past is to make it harder for people to make changes to the document and then re sell it. So it prohibits copying and pasting and altering the document. It doesn't stop people from opening the document and reading it. I don't see any sense in having that kind of prohibition, because you really want them to be able to read it without hindrance.

When I converted it in Calibre, I didn't get any dialogue box asking me for a password or telling me that I couldn't convert. It just went through the process and converted it to mobi.

I don't know what level of security you are putting on your PDF's and I equally don't know how Calibre converted this one. But if you follow the steps that I did, instead of calling me a liar out of hand, you might find that it works for you too.

Justin Nemo · 03-29-2012, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

That's what a password protected PDF is. It needs a password to decrypt the contents.

If the PDF you tried didn't need a password to open, then yes, calibre could convert it. Because it was not encrypted.

I didn't say it was encrypted, I said it was secured.

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03-29-2012, 01:50 PM	#233
ApK Award-Winning Participant Posts: 7,389 Karma: 68329346 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: NJ, USA Device: Kindle	A password protected PDF is a totally different beast than an Adobe Digital Editions DRM protected PDF.