Chinese writers say Apple is online book pirate

[wannabee]

Originally Posted by murraypaul

And, as I understand it, what is happening is that some third parties are taking the IP and submitting books to the iBookstore. The complain against Apple is that they are too slow to respond in taking the material down when complaints are received. I don't think anyone is saying that Apple themselves are stealing the IP.
The real surprise is that anyone is trying to make money selling books through the iBookstore

iBookstore is second behind Amazon in books sales for our titles. They are 50 to 1 against B&N. All the rest are even lower.

[MrsJoseph]

Originally Posted by wannabee

iBookstore is second behind Amazon in books sales for our titles. They are 50 to 1 against B&N. All the rest are even lower.

Really? I have to admit to avoiding the iBookstore like the plague. I'm rather surprised.

[CommonReader]

Originally Posted by MrsJoseph

I realize that. But how many IP rights holders have been infringed upon by the Chinese? Many. I'm sure many more than are in this suit.

Thus, my feelings of irony.

The US herself is no white knight. In both World Wars the US simply grabbed German patents on a huge scale. (Germany herself was quite happy to copy English technology during the industrial revolution - just as everyone else) The Neem tree patent controversy showed that the US is still quite happy to grab other nations' IP. You'll probably have a hard time to find a country that's innocent in this regard.

To my knowledge all apps that are being sold via Apple's store have to be approved by Apple first. They also take 30% of the sales revenue for themselves. That seems sufficient reasons to me to hold them responsible for IP violations.

[Ninjalawyer]

Originally Posted by CommonReader

To my knowledge all apps that are being sold via Apple's store have to be approved by Apple first. They also take 30% of the sales revenue for themselves. That seems sufficient reasons to me to hold them responsible for IP violations.

Just so I understand, you're saying Apple should be responsible for IP violations because it makes money by running a digital storefront? Checking for IP violation is a lot harder than you think and difficult even when you spend a lot of time doing it; it's not particularly feasible for Apple to check every app to make sure something the app writer didn't sneak in something that's covered by someone else's copyright.

[CommonReader]

You don't know what I think. I am well aware of the fact that ascertaining IP rights isn't always straightforward. However, if I understand the report correctly some books were provided illegally not just once, but several times. This indicates a cavalier attitude of Apple towards other peoples' IP. Apple is raking in billions with the iPad and the iTunes store. How much money is being spent on securing that the apps do not violate other peoples' IP? Apple cannot claim that it is just a file hoster that has to do no checks on the files it provides for download, as the app- and iTunes store is run entirely under Apple's control.

BTW, I know that comments on Yahoo news are mostly provided by yahoos, but I do note the very thinly veiled xenophobia in the comments on that story - the same xenophobia that was expressed by Washington lawmakers when they defended SOPA and PIPA. The deplorable American victims and the devious foreign pirates, just as if Western individuals and companies weren't big in IP violations as well.

[murraypaul]

Originally Posted by CommonReader

You don't know what I think. I am well aware of the fact that ascertaining IP rights isn't always straightforward. However, if I understand the report correctly some books were provided illegally not just once, but several times. This indicates a cavalier attitude of Apple towards other peoples' IP. Apple is raking in billions with the iPad and the iTunes store. How much money is being spent on securing that the apps do not violate other peoples' IP? Apple cannot claim that it is just a file hoster that has to do no checks on the files it provides for download, as the app- and iTunes store is run entirely under Apple's control.

Wouldn't the same apply to Kindle books?

[CommonReader]

I don't know. Does Amazon subject the Kindle books to some sort of approval process or can anyone just put his ebook into the Amazon store? This might make a difference. However, as we only have the facts from a Yahoo news report and as we don't know about Chinese law and lawsuits (well, at least I don't know anything about that) this is just idle speculation anyway.

I don't like this "pot calling the kettle black" argument, though. These are Chinese authors. Why should they be answerable for IP infringements committed by Chinese industrial companies in any way? By applying this kind of logic, am I entitled to whack any American I happen to come across just because I dislike what the US has done in Iraq?

[MrsJoseph]

Originally Posted by CommonReader

The US herself is no white knight. In both World Wars the US simply grabbed German patents on a huge scale. (Germany herself was quite happy to copy English technology during the industrial revolution - just as everyone else) The Neem tree patent controversy showed that the US is still quite happy to grab other nations' IP. You'll probably have a hard time to find a country that's innocent in this regard.

To my knowledge all apps that are being sold via Apple's store have to be approved by Apple first. They also take 30% of the sales revenue for themselves. That seems sufficient reasons to me to hold them responsible for IP violations.

At what point did I claim the US was a white knight? At what point did I even say that the IP infringement was even US centric? It seems you are reading what you want into my statement.

Originally Posted by CommonReader

I don't like this "pot calling the kettle black" argument, though. These are Chinese authors. Why should they be answerable for IP infringements committed by Chinese industrial companies in any way? By applying this kind of logic, am I entitled to whack any American I happen to come across just because I dislike what the US has done in Iraq?

But the pot is calling the kettle black. You might not like it, but there it is. China and Chinese businesses are consistently infringing the IP rights of countless other individuals/countries with no one being able to really stop them.

So yes, there is great irony here.

[CommonReader]

Originally Posted by MrsJoseph

But the pot is calling the kettle black. You might not like it, but there it is. China and Chinese businesses are consistently infringing the IP rights of countless other individuals/countries with no one being able to really stop them.

So yes, there is great irony here.

I don't see how some individual Chinese authors constitute "China" or "Chinese businesses". Unless these authors themselves have infringed someone else's IP there is no reason to consider it as somehow ironic that they sue against infringement of their own IP. Otherwise it would also be ironic if an American who travels abroad complains about being victim of a violent crime, because - you know - the US is inflicting violence on countless countries and people across the globe and no one seems to be able to really stop them. Each of these claims is absurd.

[MrsJoseph]

Originally Posted by CommonReader

I don't see how some individual Chinese authors constitute "China" or "Chinese businesses". Unless these authors themselves have infringed someone else's IP there is no reason to consider it as somehow ironic that they sue against infringement of their own IP. Otherwise it would also be ironic if an American who travels abroad complains about being victim of a violent crime, because - you know - the US is inflicting violence on countless countries and people across the globe and no one seems to be able to really stop them. Each of these claims is absurd.

[HansTWN]

I smell the one of the usual publicity stunts by China. You put pressure on me (no matter how well deserved)? I will try to find some place that hurts you and hit back. The Apple trademark lawsuit and this are most probably orchestrated efforts from way up in the Chinese government to negotiate advantages in other areas. I hope people don't fall for this again and again. Remember, everything is politics in China's dealings with the outside world.

[Ninjalawyer]

Originally Posted by CommonReader

I don't see how some individual Chinese authors constitute "China" or "Chinese businesses". Unless these authors themselves have infringed someone else's IP there is no reason to consider it as somehow ironic that they sue against infringement of their own IP. Otherwise it would also be ironic if an American who travels abroad complains about being victim of a violent crime, because - you know - the US is inflicting violence on countless countries and people across the globe and no one seems to be able to really stop them. Each of these claims is absurd.

Misconstruing humour as a legitimate argument, randomly bringing up U.S. patent theft in WWII for no particular reason, failing almost (but not quite) to come up with any relevant or coherent thoughts...

[CommonReader]

One man's "humour" is the other man's idea of jingoism and xenophobia. This "humour" is closely related to wide eyed wonderment about "why do they hate us?". There has been too much official rhetoric from the US that ties IP violations to "foreigners" to make this all that funny.
If you believe that individuals have a right to defend themselves against cavalier treatment of their rights by large companies then Chinese authors have as much legal standing as anyone else.

[Sil_liS]

The irony in this story matches the one presented in the How piracy built the U.S. publishing industry thread, but it's less than the irony in the Book Author is "Pirate" thread from over a year ago.