Launch: Bezos Gone Wild! Amazon Selling Every Non-iPhone Smartphone for One Penny

[Kosst Amojan]

Originally Posted by kjk

August 2012? Just think of how many new and improved Android phones will be released by then

Hmm, 0?

Fell in love with Windows Phone from the first time I used it.

Anyone know of a way to upgrade early on a two year contract? Been a loyal At&t customer for years.

[OtterBooks]

Cheap or free phones with contract? This is new.

[kjk]

Originally Posted by Kosst Amojan

Hmm, 0?

Fell in love with Windows Phone from the first time I used it.

Anyone know of a way to upgrade early on a two year contract? Been a loyal At&t customer for years.

AT&T let me update every year with the iPhone up to the 4 (which I didn't get)-and then let offered my wife to update her 4 after 17 months.

I would just go in and try to make a deal in person!

[Kosst Amojan]

Yeah I know the iphone has a special upgrade path, I'll try the phone first then in store.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

I decided to look at this, since I've contemplated what I'd replace my smartphone with in the future. Turns out, a Verizon customer like me with an existing data plan who just wants the phone won't get the 1 cent deal... the phones I would buy jump up to $100.

Glad I wasn't in a hurry to get one...

[MV64]

Any "deal" involving cell phones is not a deal unless you've got a lot of discretionary money to blow. I'd much rather pony up 300 for a phone to pay 5 or 10 bucks a month for a contract that includes everything.

[Andrew H.]

Originally Posted by MV64

Any "deal" involving cell phones is not a deal unless you've got a lot of discretionary money to blow. I'd much rather pony up 300 for a phone to pay 5 or 10 bucks a month for a contract that includes everything.

Why? In this example, the contract is the better deal.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by Daithi

I don't use my phone that often, so I have T-Mobile's pre-paid plan. I pay $100 for 1,000 minutes and it takes me about 9 months to use them, so it costs me about $125 a year for my phone. The only drawback is that this doesn't work with a smartphone.

I prefer AT&T's Pay As You Go $0.10/min plan. Works out to 1000 minutes for $100 if that's how you want to use it, but can also be used to buy messaging and data packages (packages expire in 30 days but balance rolls over if you renew before expiration). I like the roll over data over T-Mobile's (now defunct) WebPass.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by Andrew H.

And I think most consumers would much rather have the carrier sell its soul to Apple than to have to sell their own souls to the carrier.

And isn't that how it works out eventually? Carriers sell their souls to Apple and in turn, the consumers sell their souls to the carrier in order to get the "iconic" iPhone.

The postpaid plans are overpriced simply because the carriers include the cost of phone subsidies in the monthly tariffs. If phone exclusivity deals weren't part of the picture, then you're more likely to see carriers competing on price and quality of service. This isn't capitalism - it's an oligopoly.

[Andrew H.]

Originally Posted by ilovejedd

And isn't that how it works out eventually? Carriers sell their souls to Apple and in turn, the consumers sell their souls to the carrier in order to get the "iconic" iPhone.

To some extent, sure. The difference is that Apple doesn't allow the carriers to put their own non-removable apps on the phone, and that updates come directly from Apple and don't have to be filtered through the carrier.

The postpaid plans are overpriced simply because the carriers include the cost of phone subsidies in the monthly tariffs. If phone exclusivity deals weren't part of the picture, then you're more likely to see carriers competing on price and quality of service. This isn't capitalism - it's an oligopoly.

But the prices *aren't* overpriced if you use the subsidy, which is $450. (Or aren't overpriced compared to pay-as-you-go plans, which is, of course, a different matter). And again, the $55/month AT&T smartphone plan (450 minutes/200 MB data) doesn't strike me as being particularly worse than paying $100/month for 1000 minutes prepaid. Particularly with the subsidy.

Prepaid data packages are roughly 2-4x as expensive for prepaid - i.e., $15/month gives you 100MB prepaid vs. 200MB on contract; $25/month gives you 500MB prepaid vs. 2GB on contract.

So I don't think that you can universally state that PAYG is the better option; it really depends on how much you use your phone. If you use your phone a lot, I don't think it's a better deal; if you use it very infrequently (especially without data), I think it clearly is a better deal.

I'm not really convinced that we have an oligopoly, either. In my market, I can choose from 4 major carriers (AT&T, Verizon, Sprint, and T-Mobile), and I've had contracts with all but Sprint. I think that's a decent amount of competition (much better than cable), particularly given number portability, and I don't think it would change much if we had 6 competitors. Or 10. I suppose things might change if we had some sort of different regulatory scheme.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by Andrew H.

To some extent, sure. The difference is that Apple doesn't allow the carriers to put their own non-removable apps on the phone, and that updates come directly from Apple and don't have to be filtered through the carrier.

All the phones I bought back when I lived in Asia don't come with that crap. Color me surprised when I moved to the US and now had to deal with all the restrictions from carriers.

Originally Posted by Andrew H.

But the prices *aren't* overpriced if you use the subsidy, which is $450. (Or aren't overpriced compared to pay-as-you-go plans, which is, of course, a different matter). And again, the $55/month AT&T smartphone plan (450 minutes/200 MB data) doesn't strike me as being particularly worse than paying $100/month for 1000 minutes prepaid. Particularly with the subsidy.

Prepaid data packages are roughly 2-4x as expensive for prepaid - i.e., $15/month gives you 100MB prepaid vs. 200MB on contract; $25/month gives you 500MB prepaid vs. 2GB on contract.

So I don't think that you can universally state that PAYG is the better option; it really depends on how much you use your phone. If you use your phone a lot, I don't think it's a better deal; if you use it very infrequently (especially without data), I think it clearly is a better deal.

I'm not really convinced that we have an oligopoly, either. In my market, I can choose from 4 major carriers (AT&T, Verizon, Sprint, and T-Mobile), and I've had contracts with all but Sprint. I think that's a decent amount of competition (much better than cable), particularly given number portability, and I don't think it would change much if we had 6 competitors. Or 10. I suppose things might change if we had some sort of different regulatory scheme.

The subsidy isn't $450. From one of Samsung's comments, it appears industry standard is just $200 or so for all manufacturers except Apple. Phone prices also get artificially inflated to make it appear as if getting the 2-year contract is a good deal. It's not the number of competitors that make it an oligopoly. It's the fact that most of them seem to have decided that keeping inflated pricing is a good idea. Another thing, what if you're not the type to change phones every 2 years or so or what if you don't need the most high-end smartphone? Most carriers aren't going to lower your monthly rate once you've paid off the phone subsidy and the monthly rate you pay is the same regardless of whether you got an LG Phoenix or a Samsung Stratosphere for $0.01.

I never said pay as you go is always a better option over postpaid. I was just saying I liked AT&T PAYG over T-Mobile PAYG. Indeed, if you tend to use your phone a lot, pay as you go is certainly more expensive.

I'd like to point to my earlier post:

Originally Posted by ilovejedd

T-Mobile actually has two types of postpaid plans - Classic and Value. With the Classic Plan, you get subsidized equipment. With the Value Plan, you bring your own device but you pay a much lower monthly fee.

Classic Plan Family
1000 Minutes $60
Unlimited Text $20
Line 1 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $20
Line 2 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $20
Line 3 Add-A-Line Fee $10
Line 3 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $20
Line 4 Add-A-Line Fee $10
Line 4 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $20
Monthly Total (before taxes): $180
2-year Total: $4,320

Value Plan Family
1000 Minutes $50
Unlimited Text $10
Line 1 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $10
Line 2 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $10
Line 3 Add-A-Line Fee $5
Line 3 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $10
Line 4 Add-A-Line Fee $5
Line 4 Unlimited Plus (2GB) $10
Monthly Total (before taxes): $110
2-year Total: $2,640

That's a difference of $1,680 - enough to buy 4 mid-range (or last year's high-end) smartphones. Another thing, data plans are optional on T-Mobile if you bring your own device and their pay per use data plans are probably one of the fairest in the market.