Can someone explain the YA label to me - Page 2

VydorScope · 09-19-2011, 06:29 AM

I think the real problem is the assignment of these labels are fairly arbitrary. I could write any thing, then publish it as YA, or OF (old fart). Most book sellers will honor the label put on it by the publisher so it ends up on the shelf with the YA/OF books regardless of the content. Sure go way out of like (like pass off erotica as children's lit) and you will have book sellers relabel you ... but if your sorta kind of close, then the label seems to just stick.

patrickt · 09-19-2011, 08:18 AM

I think the labels about audience are mostly what the author considers the target.

I'm old and when I was growing up we read books without graphic sex or violence. Hemingway, Steinbeck, Jones, Heinlein, and even Louis Lamour and Mickey Spillane. I don't know how we managed without knowing exactly, clinically, what was going on in the bedroom and how the author thought it felt to have your intestines pulled out through a tiny hole in your navel. It's amazing we ever manged to have a life, isn't it?

fjtorres · 09-19-2011, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew H.

I don't know all of those authors, but the ones I do know would be "juvenile," not YA.

YA is more adult because the violence may be more disturbing, and relationships may be a significant theme. Romeo and Juliet would be YA, I think.

True, but consider that current culture doesn't try to shelter teenagers as much as 50's culture did. For that matter 50's fiction wasn't as routinely "raw" as even today's YA markets.

The Heinlein juveniles (and Asimov's--people tend to forget the David Starr books) were the 50's SF equivalent of today's young adult market, aimed at the 15-21 age bracket; literate high schoolers and university undergrads. Heinlein explained it as "make the protagonist 17 and write him as an adult after that". Isn't that pretty much the formula for current YA fiction? (For that matter, lots of other classic SF&F works that aren't labeled juveniles follow it. Hal Clement's NEEDLE comes to mind.)

Different authors will have different ideas of what "write him/her as an adult" means but we need to remember that times change; what other eras would have considered adult material today barely rates a PG or PG13 rating in movie terms. In the SF/Fantasy genres, pretty much any pre-60s material is teenager-friendly even though the bulk of the audience at the time was adult. (Mostly because the publishers balked at more mature content.)

YA has always existed. The prominence of the label today is simply marketing and the realization that the Harry Potter cohort is a market worth pursuing.

Wait_For_It · 09-19-2011, 09:51 AM

YA is a fairly new creation. I think I had a professor tell me it's only been around for 20/30 years or so. Before that everything was either juvenile or adult.

It's really hard to define YA because there are so many "rules" that only work part of the time. Generally the protagonist is 12-19 years old and the book has less language, violence, and sex than "adult" books.

VydorScope · 09-19-2011, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrickt

I'm old and when I was growing up we read books without graphic sex or violence. Hemingway, Steinbeck, Jones, Heinlein, and even Louis Lamour and Mickey Spillane. I don't know how we managed without knowing exactly, clinically, what was going on in the bedroom and how the author thought it felt to have your intestines pulled out through a tiny hole in your navel. It's amazing we ever manged to have a life, isn't it?

I know!!! It was sooo horrible to read books like that growing up! Thankfully my 8 year old lives in a society were gratuitous sex, gore and violence are normative so he wont have to suffer so!

Barty · 09-21-2011, 12:24 AM

I like the label; it lets me know what to avoid.

Oh, I know, there are many very fine YA books. But too often I read a YA book and as good as it may be, there inevitably cones the moment when I think I'm too old fah this sh**.

Skip Wyona · 09-22-2011, 08:24 AM

The first modern book to be considered 'young adult' was 'Catcher in the Rye' which, due to it's language and theme, moved the publishing industry to create an official new book category to separate children's books from adult books. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young-adult_fiction

DiapDealer · 09-22-2011, 08:25 AM

Well if Wikipedia says it... then that's the end of it.

elemenoP · 09-22-2011, 08:47 AM

Wow! From Catcher in the Rye to Twilight... oh how far YA has fallen. Seriously, you would not consider Catcher in the Rye to be YA today. Besides the age of the protagonist, I consider YA to have a simpler writing style.

eP

Daithi · 09-22-2011, 08:55 AM

I think everyone else has pretty much covered the "What is the YA label?" I'd just like to say that I enjoy reading them. I actually hated being a teenager, but I enjoy reading books where the protagonist is a teenager. Weird.

HarryT · 09-22-2011, 11:34 AM

What I do find irritating is when people apply the "YA" label to what are clearly children's' books.

Nancy Fulda · 09-23-2011, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellmark

Yeah, pretty much no sex, there can be some violence but isn't too graphic. Adult themes, but cleaned up some to be suitable for teens.

I'd have to disagree with this. A lot of imprints are moving towards 'edgy' YA, which doesn't shy away from sex or violence, although the presentation might be different than adult works.

The YA label is a marketing strategy, nothing more. It's a publisher's way of pointing out that a book may appeal to high school readers, and it can encompass everything from simplistic teen romances to dark and gritty vampires.

As mentioned above, the age of the protagonist is a strong determining factor. (Because teenagers don't like to read about forty-year-olds. Go figure.) Fortunately, many forty-year-olds don't mind reading about teens, and a number of YA titles have appealed to readers across the board. (Anne McCaffrey's DragonSinger trilogy comes to mind.)

Nancy Fulda · 09-23-2011, 03:11 AM

Also: YA works tend to have only a single POV and only one major storyline.

Xoanon · 09-23-2011, 04:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

And I've read (am reading) some "YA" that is very, very graphically violent. Like, infant being drowned in sewage then having its face torn off and worn as a mask kinda violent.

The Monstrumologist is a fantasic series. I think in this case the Young Adult label might be hurting sales though as it is apparently a commercial flop.

fjtorres · 09-23-2011, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nancy Fulda

Fortunately, many forty-year-olds don't mind reading about teens,

A lot of forty year olds are teenagers inside their heads...
...and avoid mirrors more than vampires.

09-22-2011, 08:24 AM	#22
Skip Wyona Enthusiast Posts: 32 Karma: 21188 Join Date: Jun 2011 Device: none	What is Young Adult? The first modern book to be considered 'young adult' was 'Catcher in the Rye' which, due to it's language and theme, moved the publishing industry to create an official new book category to separate children's books from adult books. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young-adult_fiction

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09-19-2011, 06:29 AM	#16
VydorScope Wizard Posts: 3,418 Karma: 35207650 Join Date: Jun 2011 Device: iPad	I think the real problem is the assignment of these labels are fairly arbitrary. I could write any thing, then publish it as YA, or OF (old fart). Most book sellers will honor the label put on it by the publisher so it ends up on the shelf with the YA/OF books regardless of the content. Sure go way out of like (like pass off erotica as children's lit) and you will have book sellers relabel you ... but if your sorta kind of close, then the label seems to just stick.

09-19-2011, 08:18 AM	#17
patrickt Wizard Posts: 1,221 Karma: 8381518 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Oaxaca, Mexico Device: Paperwhite 4 X 2	I think the labels about audience are mostly what the author considers the target. I'm old and when I was growing up we read books without graphic sex or violence. Hemingway, Steinbeck, Jones, Heinlein, and even Louis Lamour and Mickey Spillane. I don't know how we managed without knowing exactly, clinically, what was going on in the bedroom and how the author thought it felt to have your intestines pulled out through a tiny hole in your navel. It's amazing we ever manged to have a life, isn't it?

09-19-2011, 09:51 AM	#19
Wait_For_It Member Posts: 23 Karma: 3960 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Albuquerque, NM Device: Kindle 3, Kindle Fire	YA is a fairly new creation. I think I had a professor tell me it's only been around for 20/30 years or so. Before that everything was either juvenile or adult. It's really hard to define YA because there are so many "rules" that only work part of the time. Generally the protagonist is 12-19 years old and the book has less language, violence, and sex than "adult" books.

09-21-2011, 12:24 AM	#21
Barty doofus Posts: 2,555 Karma: 13089041 Join Date: Sep 2010 Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kindle Voyage	I like the label; it lets me know what to avoid. Oh, I know, there are many very fine YA books. But too often I read a YA book and as good as it may be, there inevitably cones the moment when I think I'm too old fah this sh**.

09-22-2011, 08:25 AM	#23
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 28,880 Karma: 207000000 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	Well if Wikipedia says it... then that's the end of it.

09-22-2011, 08:47 AM	#24
elemenoP Wizard Posts: 1,717 Karma: 3790058 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: NYC Device: Kindle Paperwhite, Sony 650	Wow! From Catcher in the Rye to Twilight... oh how far YA has fallen. Seriously, you would not consider Catcher in the Rye to be YA today. Besides the age of the protagonist, I consider YA to have a simpler writing style. eP

09-22-2011, 08:55 AM	#25
Daithi Publishers are evil! Posts: 2,418 Karma: 36205264 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Rhode Island Device: Various Kindles	I think everyone else has pretty much covered the "What is the YA label?" I'd just like to say that I enjoy reading them. I actually hated being a teenager, but I enjoy reading books where the protagonist is a teenager. Weird.

09-22-2011, 11:34 AM	#26
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,560 Karma: 93980341 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	What I do find irritating is when people apply the "YA" label to what are clearly children's' books.

09-23-2011, 03:11 AM	#28
Nancy Fulda I write stories. Posts: 700 Karma: 16437432 Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Northern Germany Device: kindle	Also: YA works tend to have only a single POV and only one major storyline.