Ebook prices

[Fbone]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Might I point out American Booksellers Exchange? ABE.com.

(despite the name, there are quite a few used booksellers in the EU, if you're willing to pay the postage to here in the US.)

Simple search engine, lots of used booksellers list their inventory. I don't go to used bookstores any more. ABE is so much more convenient. Mailed straight to my door.

Typical cost is $4 and up (and up and up, depending on the title/demand/condition).

Abebooks is a subsidiary of Amazon. That's where the 3rd party listings on Amazon originate.

Another source although more limited is Better World Books.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by Fbone

Abebooks is a subsidiary of Amazon. That's where the 3rd party listings on Amazon originate.

Another source although more limited is Better World Books.

Abe is not where the third party listings originate... I sell on Amazon and put my books directly on Amazon... Abe is a site dedicated to bookselling which is now owned by Amazon but listing on Abe doesn't put you on Amazon automatically, you have to list on both... many sellers do use both but they are not the same...

[Greg Anos]

It's still an excellent used book source, no matter who owns them. I've used them for a decade...

[Fbone]

Actually much of the book listings probably are from Thriftbooks. I noticed they own dozens of used book "stores" in the US. The commercial used book market is smaller than what it appears.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by Fbone

Actually much of the book listings probably are from Thriftbooks. I noticed they own dozens of used book "stores" in the US. The commercial used book market is smaller than what it appears.

Maybe full time professional "shops" but otherwise the used book market has never been bigger because it's never been easier to sell books for the non-professional...

[Fbone]

Originally Posted by elcreative

Maybe full time professional "shops" but otherwise the used book market has never been bigger because it's never been easier to sell books for the non-professional...

Indeed. One just has to look for the best price. For example, Thriftbooks is offering 15% off (with code) and Better World Books 20%. Neither discounts are reflected in their Amazon or Abebooks listing. It does pay to shop around even with the same reseller.

[Pinecone]

Originally Posted by mldavis2

If you walk into any bookstore, you will find classics priced well below current sellers. Penguin Classics is an example. These are out of copyright, public domain books which are still priced for profit for the publisher and seller, yet are well below the MSRP on the other books on the shelves. Fortunately, they are also available for free online in eBook format from Project Gutenberg and other such sites. So I would expect any book that is out of copyright to be priced below books that still have strings back to the authors. This is one of the big concerns with pending U.S. copyright law which would extend copyrights out to near infinity, mainly being pushed by the huge lobbyists for Disney and others.

Again apples to oranges. Those books also sell very cheaply as ebooks, or are even free through Google Books or Project Gutenberg.

The books that were mentioned early were IN PRINT, IN COPYRIGHT books. Just older books.

If a new paperback costs $9.99. And a ebook of the same books is $9.99.

And an new printing of an old book is $9.99. Why would anyone expect the ebook version to be substantially less?

[Pinecone]

Originally Posted by tompe

And why is not the argument about lower prices for old books applicable to the paper book? It seems to me that it is and then you get a different situation.

EXACTLY.

Not disagreeing that maybe they should be, but if the pbook is selling for full price, why would the ebooks be cheaper, WITH CURRENT PRICING.

[Pinecone]

Also, no matter how old or new a book is, you have the option of finding the pbook version used.

So with that arguement, the price of pbooks should drop after the first month or so. But then the used prices would go down, so the new book prices would have to drop.

So why not just give them away?

And no matter how old or new, as long as it is in copyright, you can't legally find the ebook used.

A good case for ebook prices to be lower. But until that happens, no matter how old or new a book is, if it is in copyright, the ebook and pbook (current printing) prices will be close.

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by Pinecone

If a new paperback costs $9.99. And a ebook of the same books is $9.99.

And an new printing of an old book is $9.99. Why would anyone expect the ebook version to be substantially less?

For the same reason that I expect the paperback to cost considerably less than the audiobook: substantially lower production costs, allowing for higher volume sales at lower cost to get a broader readership to encourage future sales, and a mostly non-competing market.

Nobody thinks a paperback is a lost audiobook sale. Why think that an ebook is a lost paperback sale--rather than, like the audiobook, a case of "if it's not available in the format I want, I'll get something else instead?"

[crossi]

Why I think older ebooks should be cheaper? Just to maintain sales volume of a title. For every book title, no matter how popular, there is a limited number of people willing to read it at all. I have the Harry Potter books in my house. 3 out of 4 people in my family have been unwilling to read them in spite of their availability to them. A smaller percentage yet are willing to pay a high price. Every sale made decreases that percentage since they already own the book. Those willing to buy, but at a lower price, decreases slightly also since during the wait they could lose interest or get it from alternative sources like library, used or borrowing (paper version) from a friend. Eventually you run out of people willing to buy it at that price and must either suffer decreased sales or lower the price. This is offset right now because of the rapid growth of ebook readers and so new customers are increasing faster than the market for a particular title is declining in many cases. This situation will not continue indefinitely. Eventually the percentage of people with ereaders will plateau. Same reason inline skates or those trendy folding scooters started out really highly priced then eventually prices dropped dramatically to current levels as demand dropped. Be patient. I'm very sure prices will drop on most titles over time. Unless you just can't wait for some particular title there is no reason to pay new-release prices for them. There are plenty of well priced ebooks that are not indies even (if that matters to you) to keep you occupied in the meanwhile.

[Pinecone]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

For the same reason that I expect the paperback to cost considerably less than the audiobook: substantially lower production costs, allowing for higher volume sales at lower cost to get a broader readership to encourage future sales, and a mostly non-competing market.

Nobody thinks a paperback is a lost audiobook sale. Why think that an ebook is a lost paperback sale--rather than, like the audiobook, a case of "if it's not available in the format I want, I'll get something else instead?"

But if EVERY ebooks of newer releases are the same price as the pbook, why would the ebook of a currently in print, older pbook be less?

Not that ebooks should be less in general. This is about the case of a book that is currently in print, in copyright, but written some time ago. Why would the ebook pricing be different than a newly released book?

[Pinecone]

Originally Posted by crossi

Why I think older ebooks should be cheaper? Just to maintain sales volume of a title. For every book title, no matter how popular, there is a limited number of people willing to read it at all. I have the Harry Potter books in my house. 3 out of 4 people in my family have been unwilling to read them in spite of their availability to them. A smaller percentage yet are willing to pay a high price. Every sale made decreases that percentage since they already own the book. Those willing to buy, but at a lower price, decreases slightly also since during the wait they could lose interest or get it from alternative sources like library, used or borrowing (paper version) from a friend. Eventually you run out of people willing to buy it at that price and must either suffer decreased sales or lower the price. This is offset right now because of the rapid growth of ebook readers and so new customers are increasing faster than the market for a particular title is declining in many cases. This situation will not continue indefinitely. Eventually the percentage of people with ereaders will plateau. Same reason inline skates or those trendy folding scooters started out really highly priced then eventually prices dropped dramatically to current levels as demand dropped. Be patient. I'm very sure prices will drop on most titles over time. Unless you just can't wait for some particular title there is no reason to pay new-release prices for them. There are plenty of well priced ebooks that are not indies even (if that matters to you) to keep you occupied in the meanwhile.

No arguement. BUT, if the current printing of the pbook is the same price as newly released pbooks, why would the ebook version be less than the ebook version of the newly released pbook???????

If a newly released pbook is $10 and the ebook version is $10. And a current printing of an older book is $10, why would the ebook version be $6??????

Again, I am NOT arguing that ebooks should be the same price as pbooks. I am NOT argueing that older books should not be cheaper. Only that if book A pbook price = ebook price,, the why would book B pobook price = ebook price?

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by Pinecone

But if EVERY ebooks of newer releases are the same price as the pbook, why would the ebook of a currently in print, older pbook be less?

Ahhh! I'd missed that part.

Older books don't have the new-and-shiny sales pitch going for them. In-print pbooks have substantial production/delivery/etc. costs, so there's not much ability to discount for "not the latest thing" -- although we do see discounts, where new pbooks, even in mmpb, have shiny-pretty covers with raised lettering, and older backlist releases have flat covers, smaller type, and other cost-cutting issues to allow them to be issued at lower prices.

I believe publishers vastly understate the physical production costs, especially since none of their stated price breakdowns include the costs of dealing with returns. They also don't deal with the differences in scale: cost-per-book for a new bestseller, with 50,000 paperbacks produced, are lower than a backlist release of 5,000 copies. This means the "new-and-shiny" fee (which is about $10 of the hardcover cost; less in pback but still exists) is matched by the higher per-book cost of the older copy.

Older ebooks don't have the ability to claim "read it first! Before you've heard the spoilers!" They're not offered with fancier covers for the higher-priced version. They don't have higher per-unit costs to produce if they're only going to sell a few copies a month.

They are also more likely to be competing with an extensive used market, which means that publishing costs become irrelevant: if the ebook is priced higher than consumers are willing to pay, they've got access to the content in another format. This may not be the case with a new release; the price can be higher because the publisher has the only available copies.

(Not counting bootlegs, of course. Whole separate mess there, that publishers think they can legislate out of competing with their sales.)

[mldavis2]

Let's not overlook the amortization of advertising that must be overcome with new releases - something older books have already done, hopefully. At any rate, older books are seldom advertised after initial release unless noted on the cover of a newer release as an author's previous successful work to entice buyers to pick a copy of the latest and greatest.