Ebook prices

[JimKal]

Originally Posted by mldavis2

Might be hard to hold on to that "never" price of $8 unless you adjust for inflation. Never say "never."

Never say never. I think we are entering quantum territory. But, you are right. Never say never is "always" a good rule to follow as well.

[Pinecone]

Originally Posted by JD Gumby

$9.99-$12.99 for most end mass-market paperback (ie, normal ones, not trade paperbacks as big as hardcovers) here in Canada. (exceptions apply, of course, for the publishers like Harlequin that throw out a LOT of books in a short time)

Iwas talking about the books mentioned, that were written some time ago, and no ebooks at normal ebooks prices.

The comment was made they are still in print. So if I got o a book store or Amazon and order a copy of the book in the latest printing, what is the price? Why would anyone expect the ebooks to be substantially less than a currently in print, latest printing pbook?

[Pinecone]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Publishers who believe that backlist ebooks are competing with new-printing pbooks are delusional. They're competing with penny-plus-shipping Amazon used books, with Bookmooch.com, and with local yard sales. Publishers never got royalties from those sales; it shouldn't surprise them or affect their bottom line when those would-be buyers turn to torrents and file-exchange sites for a copy that's within their price range. The publishers still have the same level of profit: zero.

They have an opportunity to get profit from those readers--by competing with used book prices, not new ones. Otherwise, they can continue to fail to get income from 3/4 of the readers of any particular book.

Agreed.

But the books mentioned are still in print. The poster mentioned continuously in print.

I was thrilled to discover that three Victoria Holt titles are now available as e-books: Mistress of Mellyn (1960), Bride of Pendorric (1963), and On the Night of the Seventh Moon (1972). And the price for these books from 39, 48, and 51 years ago? A whopping $9.99 apiece.

I love these old Victoria Holt books; I'd love for her whole backlist to be made available. I'd buy them all again for my e-reader at, say $5 apiece. But at $10 a pop? For books that have been continuously in print for so many years? The publisher needs a reality check.

[mldavis2]

Originally Posted by Pinecone

Why would anyone expect the ebooks to be substantially less than a currently in print, latest printing pbook?

Because we should not be paying for paper, ink, printing, binding, transportation, stocking, inventory and brick and mortar overhead. Preparation of an eBook is a one-time event, followed by an infinitesimal amount of storage space and server time.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by mldavis2

Because we should not be paying for paper, ink, printing, binding, transportation, stocking, inventory and brick and mortar overhead. Preparation of an eBook is a one-time event, followed by an infinitesimal amount of storage space and server time.

So... the physical production costs of a pbook are a trivial proportion of the cost of the book, they always have been with printing presses as has been discussed and pointed out numerous times across the forum... guess it's back to

[ficbot]

Originally Posted by elcreative

So... the physical production costs of a pbook are a trivial proportion of the cost of the book

But a portion nevertheless, accounting for, by the publisher's own repeated estimations, 10-15% of the cost. So ebook customers imho are right to expect the price to reflect this lower production cost.

[JD Gumby]

Originally Posted by Pinecone

Iwas talking about the books mentioned, that were written some time ago, and no ebooks at normal ebooks prices.

The comment was made they are still in print. So if I got o a book store or Amazon and order a copy of the book in the latest printing, what is the price?

About the same, really, though older stuff in the 200-page range will probably be $7.99 here.

Why would anyone expect the ebooks to be substantially less than a currently in print, latest printing pbook?

Because the digital transportation cost is not even a penny per megabyte from publisher to the store that will be distributing it for a further less-than-a-penny-per-meg, with no real carriage costs for storing that data indefinitely. Paper books can weigh up to 3.5lbs (to use the weight of a hardcover copy of Stephen King's "Under the Dome", or perhaps higher for the larger coffee table books) and take up shelf space that prevents the store from displaying anything else until the book sells or has to be withdrawn to be replaced with something that might sell.

There might be costs to produce an epub, but the costs would be FAR lower than the production of a physical product since the latter has lots of costs (paper, ink, maintenance for the printing presses, etc.) after the editing and production of the electronic file that would be then fed into the ePub creator and the typesetting system.

Frankly, the ONLY reason that ebook prices are anywhere near the paperback prices and beyond is greed, pure and simple - all the savings from not having to produce the physical product are being pocketed by the publishers.

[Catlady]

I'm not talking about production costs or relative prices of paper books and e-books. I'm talking about expanding the customer base by setting the price low enough to entice people who already own the book in paper to buy it again digitally.

These Victoria Holt books are 40-50 years old, they are not literary classics, the author is deceased so there are no new releases that remind readers of the backlist--but there is potentially a big audience of people like me who devoured these books year after year and now would like to have them on their newfangled e-readers--but not enough to spend $10 apiece. Most new e-book versions of mass-market paperbacks seem to be around $7 or $8--why should these old books cost so much more?

[mldavis2]

Originally Posted by ficbot

But a portion nevertheless, accounting for, by the publisher's own repeated estimations, 10-15% of the cost. So ebook customers imho are right to expect the price to reflect this lower production cost.

Where does the 10% figure come from? Is that the cost of just ink, paper, assembly - the physical product? Is it for all books averaged, or just hardcovers or just paperbacks (not likely). Surely that does not include shipping, paying the clerk to physically unpack and stock shelves, pay the shelf space in the B&M store, pay the checkout counter clerk's wages, pay for return of unsold copies, etc. On a $15 paperback, that would amount to just $1.50 per book for everything over and above the author's cut, editing and printing. Admittedly, these costs would be somewhat lower for an online operation like Amazon. The real question is: can we rely on "publisher's repeated estimations" for those numbers, or does the truth lie elsewhere? I have no idea, just sayin ... an eBook should not be priced the same as a pBook.

And we have enough dead horses already, so I cease and desist.

[elcreative]

Originally Posted by mldavis2

And we have enough dead horses already, so I cease and desist.

Obviously not but here's a few more for those that need them...

Maybe that'll be enough...

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Catlady

I'm not talking about production costs or relative prices of paper books and e-books. I'm talking about expanding the customer base by setting the price low enough to entice people who already own the book in paper to buy it again digitally.

I honestly don't think publishers are worried about reselling the same books to those who already have them in another format... if you think about it, it doesn't sound logical. (To them, at any rate... not to a collector, a very different animal altogether.) You already have that series; now they want you to move on and buy another series.

They want to sell the series to new readers, and so market and price the books as new according to what they want to profit from those new reader purchases.

[JimKal]

Here is an example that just doesn't make any sense to me. From the Amazon website:
Micheo Kaku's "Physics of the Furture". The hardcover is $16.63, The Kindle version is $14.99, the paperback is $9.75. It seems almost perverse to set the e-book price so much higher than the paperback price. Ultimately, I think, some publisher will realize the real advantages of e-books: no paper, no printing press, almost $0 cost of distribution, no overstock.

Sadly, until that time we will be faced with inexplicable pricing schemes. Even more sadly, for an obstinate person, as I can be from time to time, it means that we just won't buy something that we would have otherwise bought. I suspect there are many who use e-reading devices who share this same reaction to pricing that perplexes and annoys us.

[Hellmark]

Originally Posted by Catlady

I'm not talking about production costs or relative prices of paper books and e-books. I'm talking about expanding the customer base by setting the price low enough to entice people who already own the book in paper to buy it again digitally.

These Victoria Holt books are 40-50 years old, they are not literary classics, the author is deceased so there are no new releases that remind readers of the backlist--but there is potentially a big audience of people like me who devoured these books year after year and now would like to have them on their newfangled e-readers--but not enough to spend $10 apiece. Most new e-book versions of mass-market paperbacks seem to be around $7 or $8--why should these old books cost so much more?

One thing I have been curious about, is when a book is under contract to a publisher, but the author is dead, what happens to the money if there is no clear cut heir to the copyright? Could that be part of why some of the older book series are no longer in print? I know there are some classics that could easily make money if reprinted, but are unavailable.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by JimKal

Here is an example that just doesn't make any sense to me. From the Amazon website:
Micheo Kaku's "Physics of the Furture". The hardcover is $16.63, The Kindle version is $14.99, the paperback is $9.75.

Were do you find the paperback version? I cannot find it. Seems unreasonable that the paperback version should be published so soon after the hardcover version.

[JimKal]

Originally Posted by tompe

Were do you find the paperback version? I cannot find it. Seems unreasonable that the paperback version should be published so soon after the hardcover version.

As I said, that is the listed price on Amazon for the paperback. While this example seems particularly egregious, it is not uncommon to see a paperback listed at a lower price than the e-book. I find myself not buying either version when they do something like this. I just don't understand the business model for this type of pricing. They won't kill the e-book market and it seems to punish the publisher more than anyone else.