An editorial on iPad sales and competition - Page 21

molman · 08-26-2011, 08:50 PM

Andrew H. is right, this is a factor: I think from memory apple (reported) R&D is currently around 7-8%, so they do spend quite a bit. Not IBM territory which I think is like 13%, but still reasonable in this day and age so that is a factor of the cost. That said their margins are still very impressive. An element of this (by all reports) has been Tim Cook (now CEO) and the massive cash reserves they have to leverage very good parts/supply contracts. This is also a factor of their product lines being narrow so they buy the same parts in massive qualities (economies of scale and all that).

It's funny though, I personally don't feel Apple invents in the novel way that I (personally) think of true innovation, a lot of their innovation is taking existing technologies and concepts and blending them into a nicer whole which is an art in of itself, but often doesn't involve the real cool future concepts that comes out of other technology compaies like IBM labs and even people like Microsoft, or Google with their automated cars.

elcreative · 08-26-2011, 09:02 PM

Pretty good about MS being innovative when the first product that really got them going - DOS - was bought from someone else as they did'n have anything suitable for IBM...

molman · 08-26-2011, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elcreative

Pretty good about MS being innovative when the first product that really got them going - DOS - was bought from someone else as they did'n have anything suitable for IBM...

Far enough though it’s a little sad if you think the genesis that occurred 30+ years ago is the only item of note.

elcreative · 08-26-2011, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molman

Far enough though it’s a little sad if you think the genesis that occurred 30+ years ago is the only item of note.

Why would you say that... I made a simple factual comment about the start of a business with no subtext at all and you read something else into it... why can't people read what is written and take it at face value...

molman · 08-26-2011, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elcreative

Why would you say that... I made a simple factual comment about the start of a business with no subtext at all and you read something else into it... why can't people read what is written and take it at face value...

I would say I said what I said because you wrote in your post "Pretty good about MS being innovative.." which is far from being loaded. As such I would contend I was replying exactly on face value, to your proposition followed by a fact. I would also further put forward that your fact selection itself also contains meaning in the context of a response to my prior post.

Finally I would argue that what you said the first time was more factual ("first product that really got them going"), rather than your second rephrasing "about the start of a business" which is actually erroneous as there was a Microsoft before DOS (MS-DOS).

Hopefully that clears up your chin scratching confusion.

HarryT · 08-27-2011, 04:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molman

Finally I would argue that what you said the first time was more factual ("first product that really got them going"), rather than your second rephrasing "about the start of a business" which is actually erroneous as there was a Microsoft before DOS (MS-DOS).

It certainly wasn't MS-DOS that got Microsoft going. Bill Gates made his initial millions writing ROM BASIC interpreters for the first home computers. And yes, he wrote that personally

.

molman · 08-27-2011, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

It certainly wasn't MS-DOS that got Microsoft going. Bill Gates made his initial millions writing ROM BASIC interpreters for the first home computers. And yes, he wrote that personally

.

True. I seem to recall reading/hearing that it was pretty nice code too.

Anyhow elcreative's phrase could probably have been better, but to be fair it was the first product that got them going on a scale and in a manner that their BASIC interpreter never would have, so as I said it was a 'more factual' thing to say. Either way MS-DOS definitely wasn't the start of Microsoft. Not even their first OS if I recall correctly. Didn't they have a prior unix variant?

Probably a bit of a tangent (re: rat hole) this, thought interesting times those early PC days.

Skip Wyona · 08-28-2011, 10:06 AM

Amusing it is to read the banter here on what is supposed to be a forum about e-books and e-book reading devices. I anxiously await Amazon's decision of what kind of device it will release. Will it be an upgraded Kindle e-book reader and thereby solidify an already strong hold on the e-book market? Or will Amazon abandon common sense and enter the overly saturated tablet market? I am hoping for a better e-book reader.

HarryT · 08-28-2011, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip Wyona

Amusing it is to read the banter here on what is supposed to be a forum about e-books and e-book reading devices. I anxiously await Amazon's decision of what kind of device it will release. Will it be an upgraded Kindle e-book reader and thereby solidify an already strong hold on the e-book market? Or will Amazon abandon common sense and enter the overly saturated tablet market? I am hoping for a better e-book reader.

The smart money is on "both" - a touch-screen next-gen Kindle AND an Android tablet.

Conor · 08-28-2011, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skip Wyona

the overly saturated tablet market?

It didn't look like that last week when every man and his dog was trying to buy an HP Touchpad. There's a recession, and in my opinion they are overpriced. If I want a decent 10 inch tablet, I don't see why I should have to pay more than a netbook for it,

HarryT · 08-28-2011, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conor

It didn't look like that last week when every man and his dog was trying to buy an HP Touchpad.

Wouldn't you want to buy a tablet for $89 if you knew that you could immediately re-sell it for $300 on eBay? I don't think it had much to do with actually wanting to keep it for themselves.

tubemonkey · 08-28-2011, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Wouldn't you want to buy a tablet for $89 if you knew that you could immediately re-sell it for $300 on eBay? I don't think it had much to do with actually wanting to keep it for themselves.

I ordered five of them, with no plans to re-sell. One for me and the rest for gifts.

RockdaMan · 08-28-2011, 12:18 PM

People wanted something for nothing. Plain and simple.

The touchpad was a good device...it just had first generation-itis. It was a steal at $99. I couldn't make use of it though...I'm too addicted to the iOS app support.

Greg Anos · 08-28-2011, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molman

Andrew H. is right, this is a factor: I think from memory apple (reported) R&D is currently around 7-8%, so they do spend quite a bit. Not IBM territory which I think is like 13%, but still reasonable in this day and age so that is a factor of the cost. That said their margins are still very impressive. An element of this (by all reports) has been Tim Cook (now CEO) and the massive cash reserves they have to leverage very good parts/supply contracts. This is also a factor of their product lines being narrow so they buy the same parts in massive qualities (economies of scale and all that).

It's funny though, I personally don't feel Apple invents in the novel way that I (personally) think of true innovation, a lot of their innovation is taking existing technologies and concepts and blending them into a nicer whole which is an art in of itself, but often doesn't involve the real cool future concepts that comes out of other technology compaies like IBM labs and even people like Microsoft, or Google with their automated cars.

You're bang on, Molman. The original innovators rarely make a big success, it's the next gen marketers that make the big success. And then they usually spin that they are the innovators...

I hope Google gets their automated cars out the door in the next few years. Think of all the live that would be saved, and people not maimed...

Greg Anos · 08-28-2011, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockdaMan

People wanted something for nothing. Plain and simple.

The touchpad was a good device...it just had first generation-itis. It was a steal at $99. I couldn't make use of it though...I'm too addicted to the iOS app support.

Is there a 12 step program for that?

08-28-2011, 10:06 AM	#308
Skip Wyona Enthusiast Posts: 32 Karma: 21188 Join Date: Jun 2011 Device: none	Why Amazon should forget about tablets Amusing it is to read the banter here on what is supposed to be a forum about e-books and e-book reading devices. I anxiously await Amazon's decision of what kind of device it will release. Will it be an upgraded Kindle e-book reader and thereby solidify an already strong hold on the e-book market? Or will Amazon abandon common sense and enter the overly saturated tablet market? I am hoping for a better e-book reader.

08-28-2011, 12:18 PM	#313
RockdaMan Banned Posts: 1,644 Karma: 213512 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: On the other side of over there Device: Pandigital Novel, Kindle G1 (broken), iPod Touch	People wanted something for nothing. Plain and simple. The touchpad was a good device...it just had first generation-itis. It was a steal at $99. I couldn't make use of it though...I'm too addicted to the iOS app support. Last edited by RockdaMan; 08-28-2011 at 12:26 PM.

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08-26-2011, 08:50 PM	#301
molman Evangelist Posts: 436 Karma: 538958 Join Date: Jul 2011 Device: none	Andrew H. is right, this is a factor: I think from memory apple (reported) R&D is currently around 7-8%, so they do spend quite a bit. Not IBM territory which I think is like 13%, but still reasonable in this day and age so that is a factor of the cost. That said their margins are still very impressive. An element of this (by all reports) has been Tim Cook (now CEO) and the massive cash reserves they have to leverage very good parts/supply contracts. This is also a factor of their product lines being narrow so they buy the same parts in massive qualities (economies of scale and all that). It's funny though, I personally don't feel Apple invents in the novel way that I (personally) think of true innovation, a lot of their innovation is taking existing technologies and concepts and blending them into a nicer whole which is an art in of itself, but often doesn't involve the real cool future concepts that comes out of other technology compaies like IBM labs and even people like Microsoft, or Google with their automated cars.

08-26-2011, 09:02 PM	#302
elcreative Wizard Posts: 2,888 Karma: 5875940 Join Date: Dec 2007 Device: PRS505, 600, 350, 650, Nexus 7, Note III, iPad 4 etc	Pretty good about MS being innovative when the first product that really got them going - DOS - was bought from someone else as they did'n have anything suitable for IBM...