Irate kindlers 1star carpet bomb Michael Connelly's new book

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by bhartman36

Amazon could easily solve this problem, if they wanted to. They obviously know who purchased a book and who didn't. But Amazon benefits from people pressuring the publishers to lower prices., so they have no problem with people doing this kind of thing.

There's no problem to solve and there's nothing wrong with using reviews to protest any aspect of a book.

[CleverClothe]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Question: Does the one-star review reflect negatively on the author, the publisher, or the ones making the reviews? It does not reflect at all on the author. It doesn't even reflect on the publishers.

I vote for the ones making the reviews. I agree with Otterbooks. These folks should take to the streets and hold their breath till their face turns purple. I am not impressed with anyone who writes a dishonest review. I don't care for Connely but I'm tempted to buy the book out of spite.

There is a very simple rule of thumb for me on book pricing. If it's priced too high, for me, I don't buy it. I know, it's a radical thought. Apparently, enough people buy the books at the higher prices that the children's crusade really doesn't influence publishers.

Dishonest review? What, do you think these people are secretly happy with the price and are just posting bad reviews for fun?

[CleverClothe]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

I was suggesting that the one star brigade acted out of a sense of entitlement, and I was correct.

Ah, so consumers are just suppose to take whatever corporations give them, and like it. Got it.

Societal Cog #524562435234, please step up to the window to receive your daily ration of Solient Green. It is delicious AND nutritious!

[rogue_librarian]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

I was suggesting that the one star brigade acted out of a sense of entitlement, and I was correct.

You don't say. Glad we could talk about it.

No you aren't, because a letter accomplishes that;

Please don't tell me (and that's a hypothetical "me", as I have no particular interest in that author and haven't read his books, let alone negatively reviewed his last one) or anybody else for that matter how to express dissatisfaction. It's more than just a little contumelious; preposterous, even.

... to affect the price legitimately.

So, those reviews are "illegitimate behavior"? It just keeps getting better.

If you don't like the price, don't buy it.

As I've said: I don't. But I also complain about it. And I let the publisher know in a way that gets their attention. Hint: letter writing is not it.

[OtterBooks]

Originally Posted by CleverClothe

Dishonest review? What, do you think these people are secretly happy with the price and are just posting bad reviews for fun?

I think people fairly presume that people who "review" a book have read it (crazy presumption, I know), but really it's the star rating I take issue with here, not the commentary. I shed no tears for the publisher. However, the star average is there to assist people when searching for books they may enjoy. When the book shows up in search results with a 2 star average despite most people who actually purchased it giving it 4-5 stars, the people who dropped the average in order to stage a protest have willfully caused a deception. They know full well that they were doing this, because drawing attention by means of disturbance is their very tactic. Sure it's kinda funny, but still.

Originally Posted by CleverClothe

Ah, so consumers are just suppose to take whatever corporations give them, and like it. Got it.

Societal Cog #524562435234, please step up to the window to receive your daily ration of Solient Green. It is delicious AND nutritious!

You don't need to submit to their thriller-novel oppression, man. Don't click the Buy button. When we get to the point where standing in front of tanks or self-immolation is required, call me. If you think it's a legit form of protest, go post one star reviews for Old Navy clothing or something. It's made by child labor in sweatshops. Oh, but the price is right. Also Soylent Green was a good movie. Alright a little snarky debate is fun, but seriously, peace.

[Piper_]

I'm still uncomfortable with demanding new releases to be $9.99, for fear they'll just add the difference to the mid-priced books or make us wait for the new releases.

And this author should be OK, and if he's big enough, he might have more say in the pricing, so I'm not too fussed about it.

But for other authors, too many ratings like these could be a problem. And on principle, it seems off to stick permanent ratings onto a book over something that probably *won't be applicable months later.

BUT, I don't think the answer is for people to suck it up, or just write the publisher. I also don't think it's so much that people feel "entitled."

I think they're offended by publishers treating them like chumps... in a lot of ways. There is a lot of bad blood between publishers and their customers. Even I've lost all respect and trust in them for a multitude of reasons.

Consumers' public outcries are more effective than a letter or just not buying, and they've gathered for such strength in numbers for centuries. Doing that doesn't mean they're spoiled or irrational.

The response they get can either mollify them or inflame them further.

I'm not sure how to mollify them, if you can't show them they aren't really being taken advantage of, but insulting them will just inflame them further.

I just wish Amazon would give a second star category for pricing, and maybe even code it so it shows the price points at which the stars were given. That would be a good outlet and provide valuable information to everyone, I think.

[OtterBooks]

Originally Posted by Piper_

I just wish Amazon would give a second star category for pricing, and maybe even code it so it shows the price points at which the stars were given. That would be a good outlet and provide valuable information to everyone, I think.

Or maybe separate postings into "Reviews" and "Comments," limiting Reviews to people who purchased the product. That way the review average would display the consensus of actual consumers of the book, while not stifling other commentary.

Amazon's contention with publishers over ebook prices is well known. I wouldn't be surprised if they were absolutely loving the review-protests. Amazon exec reads the reviews, laughing: "Haha, that's right, stick it to the man, woo!"

[tompe]

Originally Posted by Piper_

I'm still uncomfortable with demanding new releases to be $9.99, for fear they'll just add the difference to the mid-priced books or make us wait for the new releases.

And it is just an arbitrary level. Why not demand $4.99? Or $14.99? Or $13.00?

I think $15 is pretty cheap for a new book. I usually have to pay more.

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

Or maybe separate postings into "Reviews" and "Comments," limiting Reviews to people who purchased the product. That way the review average would display the consensus of actual consumers of the book, while not stifling other commentary.

In other words, you want it buried. I'm quite happy with the current method. It sends a message.

[HansTWN]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

Or maybe separate postings into "Reviews" and "Comments," limiting Reviews to people who purchased the product. That way the review average would display the consensus of actual consumers of the book, while not stifling other commentary.

Amazon's contention with publishers over ebook prices is well known. I wouldn't be surprised if they were absolutely loving the review-protests. Amazon exec reads the reviews, laughing: "Haha, that's right, stick it to the man, woo!"

Just because Amazon probably supports this action, does it invalidate the protest? If Amazon tries to put pressure on publishers and authors to give us better prices then more power to them.

Let us face it, Michael Connelly has money to burn and should be in a position to do something about this situation. This is not some poor guy whose livelihood could be affected by this. So if people don't protest now, then when? Only when nobody listens?

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

No you aren't, because a letter accomplishes that; you're going to engage in punitive behavior against someone who doesn't meet your demands, since your opinion isn't held by enough people to affect the price legitimately. Everyone knows what the rating system is for. Using it to bully the seller is sleazy.

Agreed. 100%. Try to justify it anyway you see fit if you choose participate, but there is no noble cause being served by the one-star vigilantes. Just misguided miscreants performing an act of vandalism.

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Just misguided miscreants performing an act of vandalism.

God bless their little misguided hearts

[Catlady]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

I think people fairly presume that people who "review" a book have read it (crazy presumption, I know), but really it's the star rating I take issue with here, not the commentary. I shed no tears for the publisher. However, the star average is there to assist people when searching for books they may enjoy. When the book shows up in search results with a 2 star average despite most people who actually purchased it giving it 4-5 stars, the people who dropped the average in order to stage a protest have willfully caused a deception. They know full well that they were doing this, because drawing attention by means of disturbance is their very tactic. Sure it's kinda funny, but still.

So who's acting all entitled now? Your main issue seems to be that when you are searching for a book, you might have to take a few extra moments to read a review rather than just count the number of stars. Gee, what a hardship.

You don't need to submit to their thriller-novel oppression, man. Don't click the Buy button. When we get to the point where standing in front of tanks or self-immolation is required, call me. If you think it's a legit form of protest, go post one star reviews for Old Navy clothing or something. It's made by child labor in sweatshops. Oh, but the price is right. Also Soylent Green was a good movie. Alright a little snarky debate is fun, but seriously, peace.

How can you presume to know what other protests/boycotts people engage in? Talk about snarky!

[Catlady]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Agreed. 100%. Try to justify it anyway you see fit if you choose participate, but there is no noble cause being served by the one-star vigilantes. Just misguided miscreants performing an act of vandalism.

Vandalism? It's not like they're carpet bombing his house, for gosh sakes!

[bhartman36]

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

There's no problem to solve and there's nothing wrong with using reviews to protest any aspect of a book.

Actually, there are two problems to be solved:

1) Permanent reviews for a temporary condition.
2) A "review" by someone who didn't read the book is inherently dishonest. "Review" means you've viewed the book at least once. You can't review a book if you haven't read it at least once.

I think separating the price of a book from the content as a separate part of a review would be a good solution. It wouldn't be the fork in the eye to authors that some people seem to want, but it would at least be fair.

I fully support people tagging books with "9.99 boycott", etc. That's viewable by people reading the information on a book, and it doesn't imply the tagger has actually read it. Or you could start a forum in the Amazon forums to protest the book's price. But when people read through reviews of a book, they expect to see reviews of a book. (Shocking, I know. )

See, here's the thing: When someone clicks on a book on Amazon, they already know what the price is. They've made peace with that. A review telling them the price is too high gives them absolutely no information. Zero. So your little protest doesn't dissuade people from buying the book based on price. The only possible effect it can have is to lead people to believe that the book itself isn't good (based on its effect on the average rating). So you're not educating anyone. At best, you're engaged in conscientious vandalism. Because it doesn't really matter what Amazon thinks of the reviews. The reviews are for the people who might want to read the book. Those are the stakeholders you're screwing over.