Kindle DXG updates - have contacted the BBC and Watchdog - Page 13

abookreader · 03-21-2011, 07:35 PM

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The attitudes of a lot of people on this site are ridiculous. The DXG is advertised as the more expensive version of the K3. If you bother to check Amazon's website you will see that the K3 wifi, K3 3G, and DXG are all marketed together, and compared with each other in a Kindle Comparison table. The comparison table clearly markets the DXG as the premium device on the right of the table, while the K3 wifi is presented on the left of the table as the cheapest and less advanced model. Amazon has clearly hidden the differences in hardware between devices, and it does not state that the devices actually operate different firmware versions, or that the DXG is exempt from future updates and enhancements. The device is misrepresented on Amazon.com and consumers are fraudulently being led to believe that they are purchasing a product of higher quality than it actually is!

okay, I just read over the Amazon page including the comparison matrix. If there is a place where Amazon refers to the product line-up as "Good, Better, and Best" and the DX as "Premiere" or "Advanced" then I sure as heck don't see it. I didn't watch the videos so maybe it is in there? If not, I don't think it is exactly fair for complaining that Amazon is marketing a device unfairly when these adjectives you are coming up with are nowhere in the actual marketing.

I've always been under the impression that the DX price is a refection of the cost of the larger screen, not due to its feature set. I myself have been wanting a solid PDF reader for about 3 years now and haven't bought one yet because I haven't found one yet that really meets my needs - and that includes the Kindle DX.

Best of luck to all of you though.

bZkindle · 03-21-2011, 07:53 PM

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Originally Posted by abookreader

okay, I just read over the Amazon page including the comparison matrix. If there is a place where Amazon refers to the product line-up as "Good, Better, and Best" and the DX as "Premiere" or "Advanced" then I sure as heck don't see it. I didn't watch the videos so maybe it is in there? If not, I don't think it is exactly fair for complaining that Amazon is marketing a device unfairly when these adjectives you are coming up with are nowhere in the actual marketing.

I don't see that either, but they do group the DXG with the K3 and K3 wi-fi which does leave the impression that they all run the same firmware.
It is misleading.
Without checking forums and seeing threads like this, one would never know that.

gizmo1973 · 03-21-2011, 08:09 PM

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Originally Posted by abookreader

okay, I just read over the Amazon page including the comparison matrix. If there is a place where Amazon refers to the product line-up as "Good, Better, and Best" and the DX as "Premiere" or "Advanced" then I sure as heck don't see it.

First of all your looking at the matrix with eyes that are trying to disprove what people ate saying on this thread. Easy enough to argue any logic in any situation. If you look at it from the point of an innocent consumer - a matrix of the type presented naturally implies the devices are comparable, and that the information is being displayed in some sort of order - since the features of each product are being compared, naturally the consumer links the matrix to good, better, best comparison.

The fact is the limitations of the devices are not mentioned at all. As said - there is no mention that they operate different firmwares or that they have different RAM capacities. Compare this scenario with buying an iPad. There are various models available like a 16gb wifi version, but you decide to pay a few hundred dollars more for a 64gb 3G version. Now all of a sudden an update is released which gives flash video support to 16gb wifi owners only - your gona be pissed right? Sure people could argue that the extra money you spent was for more storage and 3G but you purchased in good faith that your device is everything the cheaper models are, and the premium you are paying is for the 'EXTRA' features. Same situation with the kindle - we know the extra cost is for a larger screen, but naturally also believe at the time of purchase we are getting all that the lower models are, and there is nothing in the marketing to suggest otherwise.

DiapDealer · 03-21-2011, 08:18 PM

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a matrix of the type presented naturally implies the devices are comparable,

No... it only implies that the devices are being compared. There's a difference.

Wolf3 · 03-21-2011, 08:24 PM

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Originally Posted by DiapDealer

No... it only implies that the devices are being compared. There's a difference.

We've all seen comparison matrix like that, and it always follows a good/better/best format. There's NOTHING about that table that implies anything else. The Wifi one is "good" the one that adds 3G "better", the one that bumps the screen to 10" "best". There's NOTHING there that would cause anyone to question that this is good/better/best.

*I* Sure didn't know until I started visiting this forum. They came out at almost the same time. It's the third DX. It's presented as their premier device. I don't know why people are so insistent that this isn't misleading at best.

abookreader · 03-21-2011, 08:29 PM

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Originally Posted by Wolf3

We've all seen comparison matrix like that, and it always follows a good/better/best format. There's NOTHING about that table that implies anything else. The Wifi one is "good" the one that adds 3G "better", the one that bumps the screen to 10" "best". There's NOTHING there that would cause anyone to question that this is good/better/best.

*I* Sure didn't know until I started visiting this forum. They came out at almost the same time. It's the third DX. It's presented as their premier device. I don't know why people are so insistent that this isn't misleading at best.

Well, we'll just have to disagree there because when I see a matrix - the only assumption I have is that the features listed are being compared. In no way do I agree that they always imply good/better/best.

Wolf3 · 03-21-2011, 08:32 PM

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Originally Posted by abookreader

Well, we'll just have to disagree there because when I see a matrix - the only assumption I have is that the features listed are being compared. In no way do I agree that they always imply good/better/best.

Well what is it about that matrix that makes you think that's not what it's saying? And I sure haven't seen a company put their products in a format like that without meaning it. As others have brought up, it looks just like how Apple does it, among others.

How did YOU know that they weren't the same thing?

abookreader · 03-21-2011, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolf3

Well what is it about that matrix that makes you think that's not what it's saying? And I sure haven't seen a company put their products in a format like that without meaning it. As others have brought up, it looks just like how Apple does it, among others.

How did YOU know that they weren't the same thing?

How did I know?

Because as I said, nowhere on that page does Amazon use your descriptors of Good Better and Best and Premiere and Advanced. Those are all terms that you have come up with and then your complaint seems to be that Amazon never told you that they DON'T apply.

Amazon also never told you that the Kindle DX can't fix peanut butter sandwiches. If a person assumed that because of the higher price, the DX must be able to fix peanut butter sandwiches -- that'd be a little silly, right?

Wolf3 · 03-21-2011, 08:42 PM

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Originally Posted by abookreader

How did I know?

Because as I said, nowhere on that page does Amazon use your descriptors of Good Better and Best and Premiere and Advanced. Those are all terms that you have come up with and then your complaint seems to be that Amazon never told you that they DON'T apply.

Amazon also never told you that the Kindle DX can't fix peanut butter sandwiches. If a person assumed that because of the higher price, the DX must be able to fix peanut butter sandwiches -- that'd be a little silly, right?

You didn't answer the question. From that page, how did you know that the DX was missing features and not the same hardware platform?

abookreader · 03-21-2011, 08:55 PM

And that is again where we are just going to have to differ in our opinions. I don't expect any product to have the features of a different product - therefore I don't consider the features to be "missing" when it doesn't live up to that standard. I don't expect the DX to have the same hardware and firmware of a different product, therefore I don't feel lied to when it doesn't. As for how do I know this ... simply because I know that companies produce different things with different features to meet different needs.

The DX is not an "advanced" Kindle 3. Nowhere does Amazon state that to be the case so if you somehow made the assumption that it was, then you were wrong. Time to list the DX for sale down and go buy what you need.

I wish you the best in obtaining software updates, truly I do. I simply can't agree with your arguments here however that you were promised something that wasn't delivered or were misled by the Amazon webpage.

gizmo1973 · 03-21-2011, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abookreader

How did I know?

Because as I said, nowhere on that page does Amazon use your descriptors of Good Better and Best and Premiere and Advanced. Those are all terms that you have come up with and then your complaint seems to be that Amazon never told you that they DON'T apply.

bookreader - your an idiot, arguing for the sake of arguing, and your logic is contradicting. You yourself say that the devices are being compared right? Meaning they are comparable - or if you like - they are not of varying quality! What are they being compared on? Features. A comparison matrix groups and displays its items in some meaningful order - again – features in this case. Matrix order - to most logical thinkers good, better, best! or maybe you could shine a light on how the matrix is ordered?

Of course we are complaining about what Amazon hasn't told us. That's the whole point of the complaint! Since we aren't told that they operate different firmwares or have different amounts of RAM, its reasonable to assume they are all the same! Especially since they are being sold as, and promoted as, and 'COMPARED AS' the same device, only (a) with 3G and/or wifi, and (b) with a larger screen!

abookreader · 03-21-2011, 09:04 PM

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Originally Posted by gizmo1973

bookreader - your an idiot, arguing for the sake of arguing, and your logic is contradicting. You yourself say that the devices are being compared right? Meaning they are comparable - or if you like - they are not of varying quality! What are they being compared on? Features. A comparison matrix groups and displays its items in some meaningful order - again – features in this case. Matrix order - to most logical thinkers good, better, best! or maybe you could shine a light on how the matrix is ordered?

Of course we are complaining about what Amazon hasn't told us. That's the whole point of the complaint! Since we aren't told that they operate different firmwares or have different amounts of RAM, its reasonable to assume they are all the same! Especially since they are being sold as, and promoted as, and 'COMPARED AS' the same device, only (a) with 3G and/or wifi, and (b) with a larger screen!

nice

looks to me like they are ordered by price.

gizmo1973 · 03-21-2011, 09:07 PM

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Originally Posted by abookreader

nice

looks to me like they are ordered by price.

Hmm exactly the pathetic response I expected!

abookreader · 03-21-2011, 09:10 PM

Well, now that I've prompted somebody out on the internets to resort to pathetic insults and name calling in order to support whatever argument of the day has their panties into a wad, I do believe my work here is complete and I can go grab a beer and read my Kindle.

Enjoy yourself DXers, or not. Have a nice one though.

Wolf3 · 03-21-2011, 09:21 PM

I just don't understand where you're getting this argument...and I've flat out asked several times now-where on Amazon's page does it tell you the DX is worse than the 3? I just looked at it tonight again, and there's NO WAY I could get that from the page. Before coming here I absolutely did think the DX and the 3 were the same thing aside from screen size, and i see nothing on Amazon to dissuade me of that.

Where on the Kindle pages are you getting that the DX is worse?

As I said, that I knew the release dates on these were about the same just made me assume even more that the were the same thing.

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03-21-2011, 08:55 PM	#190
abookreader Wizard Posts: 1,516 Karma: 2567610 Join Date: Oct 2009 Device: Kindles - Keyboard, Fire, 2-US, iPhone, iPAD	And that is again where we are just going to have to differ in our opinions. I don't expect any product to have the features of a different product - therefore I don't consider the features to be "missing" when it doesn't live up to that standard. I don't expect the DX to have the same hardware and firmware of a different product, therefore I don't feel lied to when it doesn't. As for how do I know this ... simply because I know that companies produce different things with different features to meet different needs. The DX is not an "advanced" Kindle 3. Nowhere does Amazon state that to be the case so if you somehow made the assumption that it was, then you were wrong. Time to list the DX for sale down and go buy what you need. I wish you the best in obtaining software updates, truly I do. I simply can't agree with your arguments here however that you were promised something that wasn't delivered or were misled by the Amazon webpage.

03-21-2011, 09:10 PM	#194
abookreader Wizard Posts: 1,516 Karma: 2567610 Join Date: Oct 2009 Device: Kindles - Keyboard, Fire, 2-US, iPhone, iPAD	Well, now that I've prompted somebody out on the internets to resort to pathetic insults and name calling in order to support whatever argument of the day has their panties into a wad, I do believe my work here is complete and I can go grab a beer and read my Kindle. Enjoy yourself DXers, or not. Have a nice one though.

03-21-2011, 09:21 PM	#195
Wolf3 Connoisseur Posts: 52 Karma: 386 Join Date: Feb 2011 Device: Nook 2, Kindle 3, iPad 2, iPod 4	I just don't understand where you're getting this argument...and I've flat out asked several times now-where on Amazon's page does it tell you the DX is worse than the 3? I just looked at it tonight again, and there's NO WAY I could get that from the page. Before coming here I absolutely did think the DX and the 3 were the same thing aside from screen size, and i see nothing on Amazon to dissuade me of that. Where on the Kindle pages are you getting that the DX is worse? As I said, that I knew the release dates on these were about the same just made me assume even more that the were the same thing.