It's IMPOSSIBLE to price ebooks too high - Page 2

TallMomof2 · 01-19-2011, 03:17 PM

I don't buy very many DTBs anymore. And those are almost exclusively non-fiction needlecraft books. If the ebook is higher than the DTB I don't buy either. It's not an either or for me. Fiction is a perfect fit for ebooks. One can natter on about losing special typesetting that contributes to the book but all I want to do is read a story.

For me, yes, ebooks can and are priced too high. You should see my Kindle wishlist, it's full of close to 50 ebooks that I'm interested in but won't buy because for one they are agency titles and secondly they are over my personal price threshold. I'm waiting for the price to lower and so far not a one has dropped.

OtterBooks · 01-19-2011, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leebase

I can see your point. I, for one, almost never buy hard back books. New release hard back books cost more (for the most part) than I am willing to pay.

And YET, they manage to sell millions of such books at those prices because other folks are willing to pay the price.

It is the same with ebook pricing. Just wait and see.

Lee

I don't think I've ever bought a hardcover book at full price, though obviously people do. I have so many books I want to read that I've never felt the need to buy a book when first released. I've always read exactly what I want to, when I want to, and can't recall the last time I paid more than $8. In fact if I've ever had a problem it's having more books than I can handle.

leebase · 01-19-2011, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TallMomof2

For me, yes, ebooks can and are priced too high. You should see my Kindle wishlist, it's full of close to 50 ebooks that I'm interested in but won't buy because for one they are agency titles and secondly they are over my personal price threshold. I'm waiting for the price to lower and so far not a one has dropped.

And thus, it's true. The publishers could not succeed in getting YOU to buy an ebook at the current price. You have chosen to spend your money on the competition (whether it be books from other publishers, library books, used books, books you've already bought but hadn't got around to reading, rereading books you had already bought).

There was no "for you" at the end of my "TOO HIGH". There is vast amount of competition for your time and money such that no publisher can possibly succeed by putting too high of a price on their books.

Lee

leebase · 01-19-2011, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

I don't think I've ever bought a hardcover book at full price, though obviously people do. I have so many books I want to read that I've never felt the need to buy a book when first released. I've always read exactly what I want to, when I want to, and can't recall the last time I paid more than $8. In fact if I've ever had a problem it's having more books than I can handle.

Exactly. You and I both rarely bought hard back books at the new book price. Other people did. Enough other people did that publishers kept those prices at levels I never thought were ok for me.

The same is true of ebooks. It won't be whether you or I or the hundred-man-angry-mob of this forum buy ebooks at $14.99. It will be whether that same mysterious "market" that allowed the hard book prices to be so high will allow the ebook prices to be "too high" for us too.

Lee

Anthem · 01-19-2011, 07:41 PM

Enjoyed your post and your points!

Freeshadow · 01-19-2011, 08:02 PM

@lee
oops he does it again...

you stated several times already, what we all complaining about certain book prizing practices are, didn't you?
*grabs the fishbox* here

OtterBooks · 01-19-2011, 08:40 PM

The only time I consider high prices an ethical issue is when it involves a company intentionally taking advantage of a customer base that has no other reasonable options. This obviously is not the case with ebooks, and don't toss out some special-needs anecdote because you know that isn't typical and you're probably making it up anyway. For most people the ereader is a luxury electronic toy that only adds to their options, so cry me a river about the price of your fancy robo-novels, little lord fauntleroy. You're so oppressed.

How's everyone doin' this fine evening/day/morning?

kovidgoyal · 01-20-2011, 03:19 AM

You mean this thread is an insidious plot to cause the downfall of publishers by convincing their customers to not give them feedback when they set their prices to high?

wvcherrybomb · 01-20-2011, 04:05 AM

My opinion of the OP "theory" -

Twisted, convoluted assumptions.

HansTWN · 01-20-2011, 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

The only time I consider high prices an ethical issue is when it involves a company intentionally taking advantage of a customer base that has no other reasonable options. This obviously is not the case with ebooks, and don't toss out some special-needs anecdote because you know that isn't typical and you're probably making it up anyway. For most people the ereader is a luxury electronic toy that only adds to their options, so cry me a river about the price of your fancy robo-novels, little lord fauntleroy. You're so oppressed.

How's everyone doin' this fine evening/day/morning?

That is what I have been saying all along. The idea of a user saying "you don't charge me the price I want to pay, therefore I will get it from the darknet" seems ludicrous to me. What if the employers of those persons did the same thing and said "either you work for me for 2 bucks an hour or I will get an illegal worker to replace you"?

Nobody has a right to buy something at the price he or she wants to pay for the item. You have the right to refuse to buy, buy something else, and to tell everybody why.

Obviously I agree that publishers are making a big mistake by pricing books too high, however, I don't see how anyone can get angry about it. I also agree with the argument, that for most buyers, an ebook represents less value than a pbook (can't be resold or given to others). But what does that matter to the publishers? If they really are making a mistake with their prices and their books aren't selling the market will shake them down soon enough. There is plenty of reasonably priced or free stuff to read while we wait this out. And if ebooks are selling well at higher prices, then we will just have to suck it up.

Ken Maltby · 01-20-2011, 05:12 AM

Just to be on record, I am in full agreement with LeeBase, on this point. When allowed to
work naturally, the free market provides the pricing that represents the best agreement
possible between buyer and seller.

DRM and other attempts to artificially effect the conditions that influence pricing in a
free market, always end up having unintended consequences and seldom work to the
advantage of those employing them, in the long run.

(Except when the measures are really a mechanism to "pick winners and losers", which
allows for corruption and the furthering of hidden agendas, then those in a position to
control the implementation of the measures can be the beneficiaries of the coruption.)

Luck;
Ken

HarryLime · 01-20-2011, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TallMomof2

You should see my Kindle wishlist, it's full of close to 50 ebooks that I'm interested in but won't buy because for one they are agency titles and secondly they are over my personal price threshold. I'm waiting for the price to lower and so far not a one has dropped.

I'm in the same position. I have only owned my kindle for 6 days but I am damned if I'll pay more for an ebook than the physical. So I'm waiting for even modestly priced ebooks to come down to equal or below physical book price.

Having just read Shades of Grey I'm waiting for the rest of the Fforde books to come down to an equivalent buy price to the paperbacks.

Is there any sign of the VAT issue being resolved? This would help.

One other point is that I believe the walled garden, single bookshop, model of the Ebook is partially to blame for this. I can't just go to another Ebook shop and get a better price. The market isn't efficient and that's not in the readers interest. The physical book market is far more efficient hence the ability to get better prices.

leebase · 01-20-2011, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

You mean this thread is an insidious plot to cause the downfall of publishers by convincing their customers to not give them feedback when they set their prices to high?

Anyone think rants on this forum count as feedback to the publishers?

Not buying the high priced books is the primary feedback that is going to mean something.

Plus so much of the ranting is just wrong headed. Debates over how much it costs or should cost to create an ebook when costs have next to nothing to do with pricing on books.

Misguided notions that there is some sort of monopoly power that publishers can exercise. When books have to compete for entertainment dollars, even IF there were such a thing as a book monopoly, it would have no power to price books beyond what the market would bear.

People actually supporting the "desire to be a monopolist" practices of the largest book retailer on the planet -- all the while pointing fingers at publishers.

So much absurdity in light of the impossibility that any ebook can be priced too high.

Lee

abookreader · 01-20-2011, 11:09 AM

I guess I'm just confused as to your purpose here Leebase because you seem overly invested in counteracting pricing rants with your alternate opinions. I can think of at least 2 or 3 threads started by you on this topic.

If Publishers don't care about buyers who refuse to pay hardback prices and "Negative reviews and message board discussions" are meaningless and futile ... then exactly what is your role in all this?

As you said, it will work out as it works out in spite of those who fuss. In the grand scheme of the marketplace, we are tiny and meaningless.

Why all the time spent trying to change those who you claim have no power anyway?

leebase · 01-20-2011, 11:35 AM

@abookreader - Why post to me asking why I post. Are my ideas any less worth of discussion than those who disagree with me. Are the MORE threads started by me on this topic than threads ranting against ebook pricing? I think not. Not even close.

You see the thread title and who started it. If you don't want to participate, then don't.

Lee

01-19-2011, 08:02 PM	#21
Freeshadow temp. out of service Posts: 2,818 Karma: 24285242 Join Date: May 2010 Location: Duisburg (DE) Device: PB 623	@lee oops he does it again... you stated several times already, what we all complaining about certain book prizing practices are, didn't you? grabs the fishbox here Last edited by Freeshadow; 01-19-2011 at 08:06 PM.

01-19-2011, 08:40 PM	#22
OtterBooks Wizard Posts: 1,262 Karma: 2979086 Join Date: Nov 2010 Device: Kindle 4, iPad Mini/Retina	The only time I consider high prices an ethical issue is when it involves a company intentionally taking advantage of a customer base that has no other reasonable options. This obviously is not the case with ebooks, and don't toss out some special-needs anecdote because you know that isn't typical and you're probably making it up anyway. For most people the ereader is a luxury electronic toy that only adds to their options, so cry me a river about the price of your fancy robo-novels, little lord fauntleroy. You're so oppressed. How's everyone doin' this fine evening/day/morning? Last edited by OtterBooks; 01-19-2011 at 08:44 PM.

01-20-2011, 05:12 AM	#26
Ken Maltby Wizard Posts: 4,466 Karma: 6900052 Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: The Heart of Texas Device: Boox Note2, AuraHD, PDA,	Just to be on record, I am in full agreement with LeeBase, on this point. When allowed to work naturally, the free market provides the pricing that represents the best agreement possible between buyer and seller. DRM and other attempts to artificially effect the conditions that influence pricing in a free market, always end up having unintended consequences and seldom work to the advantage of those employing them, in the long run. (Except when the measures are really a mechanism to "pick winners and losers", which allows for corruption and the furthering of hidden agendas, then those in a position to control the implementation of the measures can be the beneficiaries of the coruption.) Luck; Ken Last edited by Ken Maltby; 01-20-2011 at 05:22 AM.

01-20-2011, 11:09 AM	#29
abookreader Wizard Posts: 1,516 Karma: 2567610 Join Date: Oct 2009 Device: Kindles - Keyboard, Fire, 2-US, iPhone, iPAD	I guess I'm just confused as to your purpose here Leebase because you seem overly invested in counteracting pricing rants with your alternate opinions. I can think of at least 2 or 3 threads started by you on this topic. If Publishers don't care about buyers who refuse to pay hardback prices and "Negative reviews and message board discussions" are meaningless and futile ... then exactly what is your role in all this? As you said, it will work out as it works out in spite of those who fuss. In the grand scheme of the marketplace, we are tiny and meaningless. Why all the time spent trying to change those who you claim have no power anyway? Last edited by abookreader; 01-20-2011 at 11:17 AM.

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01-19-2011, 03:17 PM	#16
TallMomof2 Kindlephilia Posts: 2,017 Karma: 1139255 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Snowpacolypse 2010 Device: Too many to count	I don't buy very many DTBs anymore. And those are almost exclusively non-fiction needlecraft books. If the ebook is higher than the DTB I don't buy either. It's not an either or for me. Fiction is a perfect fit for ebooks. One can natter on about losing special typesetting that contributes to the book but all I want to do is read a story. For me, yes, ebooks can and are priced too high. You should see my Kindle wishlist, it's full of close to 50 ebooks that I'm interested in but won't buy because for one they are agency titles and secondly they are over my personal price threshold. I'm waiting for the price to lower and so far not a one has dropped.

01-19-2011, 07:41 PM	#20
Anthem Guru Posts: 704 Karma: 1622328 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: USA Device: Kindle Oasis, OnePlus Nord	Enjoyed your post and your points!

01-20-2011, 03:19 AM	#23
kovidgoyal creator of calibre Posts: 45,609 Karma: 28549044 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mumbai, India Device: Various	You mean this thread is an insidious plot to cause the downfall of publishers by convincing their customers to not give them feedback when they set their prices to high?

01-20-2011, 04:05 AM	#24
wvcherrybomb Sharp Shootin' Grandma Posts: 847 Karma: 1123940 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Sunny Florida Device: Kindle 3, Kindle Fire, Literati (has been adopted by my daughter)	My opinion of the OP "theory" - Twisted, convoluted assumptions.

01-20-2011, 11:35 AM	#30
leebase Karma Kameleon Posts: 2,976 Karma: 26738313 Join Date: Aug 2009 Device: iPad Mini, iPhone X, Kindle Fire Tab HD 8, Walmart Onn	@abookreader - Why post to me asking why I post. Are my ideas any less worth of discussion than those who disagree with me. Are the MORE threads started by me on this topic than threads ranting against ebook pricing? I think not. Not even close. You see the thread title and who started it. If you don't want to participate, then don't. Lee