NYT story: Possible risks when electronics aren't turned off during flights

[kevinrs]

Originally Posted by derangedhermit

I think the main reason that the mobile operators support having the phones turned off below 10,000 feet is because the phones can often be picked up by the base stations (the cell towers) on the ground. The mobile networks are not engineered to handle phones moving at 350-400 mph, although calls often go through and stay up, at least for a while.

It's all electronics off below 10,000 feet, cell phones off when the plane is off the ground at any elevation. Cell phones are based on being short range, with many towers, when you are on the ground, your signal reaches maybe 3 towers. In the air, your signal could reach hundreds of towers, if a few people in each plane were using phones, the whole network in a city could be overloaded. It's oversimplification, but any tower in range of your signal, even if it's not the tower your call is going through, cannot be used on the same frequencies for someone else's call.

[kevinrs]

Originally Posted by twowheels

Since electromagnetic fields fall off as an inverse square of distance this isn't really relevant from my economy seat to the cockpit, but cell phones can cause some significant interference. In meetings I can often tell when a cell phone is about to ring due to the sounds that start coming out of the conference room's speakerphone... I've also had the experience (many times) of putting my cell phone and electric shaver together in the center console in my car and having my shaver start spinning randomly in short bursts from the cell phone's transmissions.

that seems to vary depending on the type of cell phone, and it's seen on crt monitors too. GSM and nextel seem to be the worst, hard to see anything happen with a cdma phone. Also, who's to say your signal doesn't follow a control wire that goes under your seat straight to the cockpit.

[Mortis]

Originally Posted by WillAdams

Given the danger a small, dense object represents in an accident, that alone is sufficient reason to require that people put the things away.

For those who feel that hardcover books represent a similar danger, try the following experiment:

- take an open hardcover book, throw it as hard as you can at a wall 6' away, observe the size of the dent (if any) which it makes
- repeat that w/ some small electronic device, compare the relative size of the damage

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=128062&page=1

William

What if the one pound book is closed? I suspect physics will play a role in the size of the dent as well.

I am a private pilot and have flown a couple of thousand hours since 1992 when I started flying with a Motorola "Bag" phone in the plane. Since then I have changed the avionics to what's called a glass cockpit, meaning most of the instruments are electronic rather than mechanical. I fly with my phone on all the time, I have a special intercom system designed to allow me to plug my phone into it, so I can take or make calls using my headset. I have never had an issue.

Do I turn my electronics off in a commercial plane? Damn right I do, it's the rules and I would hate to have my last few seconds of life thinking I caused the plane to crash with 300 other peoples lives on my conscience. Do I really believe it could happen, 99.9% sure it won't interfere but I'm not going to take the risk of being black listed from an airline just so I can listen to The Bare Naked Ladies while reading my Kindle and sending a text to my sister, not worth it.

[twowheels]

Originally Posted by kevinrs

that seems to vary depending on the type of cell phone, and it's seen on crt monitors too. GSM and nextel seem to be the worst, hard to see anything happen with a cdma phone. Also, who's to say your signal doesn't follow a control wire that goes under your seat straight to the cockpit.

The speakerphone interference that I referred to was probably CDMA because that's what my company provides to employees, and it was usually one of their blackberry devices going off. My cell phone causing the shaver to come on in bursts was most definitely CDMA, because I've been a Verizon customer since my first phone.

[WillAdams]

Mortis, of course, a closed book wouldn't be being read and should be stowed away.

[EowynCarter]

Seriously, if cellphone and co where a real trouble, they would be totally forbidden in planes.
I can wait a bit during landing and take-off, shut down wi-fi / 3g and all, but shut down everything all flight long ?

[SeaBookGuy]

On a recent flight, the woman in front of me had her iPod going the entire descent; we did not crash. I think to use a) a device located at the flight deck and b) a passenger's GPS unit as examples is highly ... selective. I repeat my opinion that "all electronics" is there so that flight attendants don't have to play referee. What I don't understand is why cell phones are "okay" upon landing, but (technically) nothing else is? I use my ebook/mp3 player anyway sometimes.

[Mortis]

Originally Posted by WillAdams

Mortis, of course, a closed book wouldn't be being read and should be stowed away.

I guess my point should have been that during a crash you're not likely to be reading are you, I would think screaming, praying or just plain dropping bricks are more likely, but reading would be the last thing you would be doing.

I agree with your point that any flying object in the passenger compartment can be deadly if the conditions are right.

[Sydney's Mom]

If the question is electromagnet waves, then why does my kindle matter. Of course, I don't have the wireless on, but the flight attendant says "anything with a battery" So, I place it in its case, on my lap, and read secretly. As I suspected, that is a rule just so the flight attendants don't have to make decisions - is it a phone, a music player, a game boy . . .

[DMB]

Until a few years ago phones were forbidden in hospitals because there was a fear they would interfere with various medical machines. That danger seems to have receded now.

[Penforhire]

If the concern is valid I would hope newer aircraft electronics would be better shielded. Most of us live in a society where electronics is ever more integrated into our lives. Our transportation modes should reflect that (e.g. Ford's Sync system). Can we go "cold turkey" just for take-off and landings? Sure. But why should we have to?

[OtterBooks]

I think it's ok for flights involving a hot-air balloon or luck dragon.

[SeaBookGuy]

Anyone else ever been on a flight where phones have gone off before landing (back in mobile incoming signal range) when it becomes apparent that at least one passenger innocently forgot to turn it off?

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by SeaBookGuy

Anyone else ever been on a flight where phones have gone off before landing (back in mobile incoming signal range) when it becomes apparent that at least one passenger innocently forgot to turn it off?

I was. The plane crashed and killed everyone on board.

[SeaBookGuy]

Taking a break from your harp lessons to come back and enlighten us, eh?