Rewriting books is doubleplusungood

[NVash]

But on the whole, does the African American race do anything to show that it doesnt deserve that name? That they are above it? Or are they just sitting back complaining and making things worse? Sad to say most that I see sit back, complain and make it all worse. I know a few that dont, a few that try to be respectful citizens but most dont want to try that.

Listen, I dont need to be told about how Blacks arent treated as well as Whites. Im quite aware of that, I see it day to day. I just think that instead of sitting back saying 'Oh theyre racist' the Black race needs to stand up together and try to better themselves. Because IMHO its horribly divided between respectful people and the 'n-words', if ever there were any. Im sick of the whining, sick of the complaining, why dont people do something about it? Why dont these people that want to sit back and complain all day do something to show all these employers that they arent just some 'n-word' and that theyre worth hiring? Now true enough, it may not get a job right off the bat. Might not get one at all but for darn sure this complaining and doing whatever the heck they want isnt helping either is it? Why dont they stop dealing drugs for crying out loud, stop it with all the baby mothers, stop being on 'Maury' and the butt of who knows how many jokes, stop it already, take a look at themselves and make a change? Look at that 'Boondocks' video I posted. Think of what Martin Luther King said. Is that not a completely accurate description of most of Black America today? Is that not a shame? I think it is.

[natasha_fawn]

Originally Posted by NVash

But on the whole, does the African American race do anything to show that it doesnt deserve that name? That they are above it? Or are they just sitting back complaining and making things worse? Sad to say most that I see sit back, complain and make it all worse. I know a few that dont, a few that try to be respectful citizens but most dont want to try that.

Listen, I dont need to be told about how Blacks arent treated as well as Whites. Im quite aware of that, I see it day to day. I just think that instead of sitting back saying 'Oh theyre racist' the Black race needs to stand up together and try to better themselves. Because IMHO its horribly divided between respectful people and the 'n-words', if ever there were any. Im sick of the whining, sick of the complaining, why dont people do something about it? Why dont these people that want to sit back and complain all day do something to show all these employers that they arent just some 'n-word' and that theyre worth hiring? Now true enough, it may not get a job right off the bat. Might not get one at all but for darn sure this complaining and doing whatever the heck they want isnt helping either is it? Why dont they stop dealing drugs for crying out loud, stop it with all the baby mothers, stop being on 'Maury' and the butt of who knows how many jokes, stop it already, take a look at themselves and make a change? Look at that 'Boondocks' video I posted. Think of what Martin Luther King said. Is that not a completely accurate description of most of Black America today? Is that not a shame? I think it is.

Wow, way to generalize an entire race. You really don't see people of all races trying to do something about it? Trying to overcome centuries of prejudice?

Actually, you don't really need to answer that. It's pretty clear that all you see is the "baby mothers" and the "drug dealers." If you're generalizing by the folks who end up on Maury, you could say the exact same things about whites, or heck, everyone in America.

No race, as a whole, does anything. It's individuals who choose to act, and they are affected by their environment and how they are perceived by those around them. Your statements in this comment are part of the precise problem you say that the "Black race" and the "African American race" (no such thing) should be addressing. Look to yourself before you start disparaging others.

Edit to add:
I do actually agree with you about the removal of the word from Huck Finn, but not for the same reasons. I think the word needs to stay because it was, and still is, used as such a hateful insult. That's why Twain used it in the first place.

[MrsJoseph]

Originally Posted by NVash

But on the whole, does the African American race do anything to show that it doesnt deserve that name? That they are above it? Or are they just sitting back complaining and making things worse? Sad to say most that I see sit back, complain and make it all worse. I know a few that dont, a few that try to be respectful citizens but most dont want to try that.

Listen, I dont need to be told about how Blacks arent treated as well as Whites. Im quite aware of that, I see it day to day. I just think that instead of sitting back saying 'Oh theyre racist' the Black race needs to stand up together and try to better themselves. Because IMHO its horribly divided between respectful people and the 'n-words', if ever there were any. Im sick of the whining, sick of the complaining, why dont people do something about it? Why dont these people that want to sit back and complain all day do something to show all these employers that they arent just some 'n-word' and that theyre worth hiring? Now true enough, it may not get a job right off the bat. Might not get one at all but for darn sure this complaining and doing whatever the heck they want isnt helping either is it? Why dont they stop dealing drugs for crying out loud, stop it with all the baby mothers, stop being on 'Maury' and the butt of who knows how many jokes, stop it already, take a look at themselves and make a change? Look at that 'Boondocks' video I posted. Think of what Martin Luther King said. Is that not a completely accurate description of most of Black America today? Is that not a shame? I think it is.

You took a wrong turn somewhere. This entire statement is sad. I feel really bad for you. It's painful to really "meet" someone who cannot judge an individual as such. I'll keep you in my prayers.

[NVash]

I do. Im part of that race. Im not trying to generalize anything. Im just saying, when someone is loud in the street, theyre usually Black. When someone wants to get loud in a store and gets the cops called on them, Black. Ive seen this happen time after time, and then I see the Caucasians walk in and out without a problem. Many times I want to ask these Black people if they realize what theyre doing. You want to complain about racism but then act a darn fool all the time? What is that? Why cant you walk in a store and act like a human being, act civilized, why must you act loud and rowdy and trash everything? Kind of like what Ive been told many times, look at the ghettos. You see how run down they are? This is why the White Man wont let the Black Man have anything. And the people that told me that were Black. Not Mulatto but 100% Black. Ive been told that time and time again, even in the ghettos by Black people who want better for themselves but look around them at the drug dealers and gunfire. Theyre disgusted by it. Those drug dealers, the guys doing wrong by their families, they would be called the 'n-word' and Im sure Ive heard them called that many times. Am I so wrong to be disgusted as well?

The worst part is that one reason racism may still be around is, sure, stubborn people. I dont doubt that. The other reason is because people keep seeing these guys on TV, these guys carrying on acting fools and getting arrested, whens the last time you saw an episode of 'Cops' that didnt involve some African Americans, and then they say 'Stupid n-words' and think everyone is like that, making it that much harder for the respectable African Americans to make something of themselves. Why? Just because of the color of their skin theyre lumped in with that crowd and honestly, I dont think many like that at all.

Then again its a Black neighborhood. I think this is, again, all in where one lives.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by MrsJoseph

You took a wrong turn somewhere. This entire statement is sad. I feel really bad for you. It's painful to really "meet" someone who cannot judge an individual as such. I'll keep you in my prayers.

I thank you for your prayers but where did I take this wrong turn and how? If Im wrong please tell me how. Im more than willing to discuss this. Im not racist at all, Im just saying what I see.

[DanielKoehler]

Idiocy! Huck is a great work of art. Would they propose to cover up the Venus de Milo because someone is offended by bare breasts? A pox on these self-appointed watchdogs!

[natasha_fawn]

Originally Posted by NVash

<snipped for space>
Just because of the color of their skin theyre lumped in with that crowd and honestly, I dont think many like that at all.

Then again its a Black neighborhood. I think this is, again, all in where one lives.

Since this isn't a political forum, I'm going to step away from this part of the conversation. (If you want to continue it, perhaps it should be taken to the opt-in political forum.) Save to say that since the word is currently used in a derogatory manner by anyone, regardless of racial identification or social status, to anyone, regardless of the same, that it is a hateful word. I'll change my mind when we can say it the same way we say "Yankee."

[MrsJoseph]

Originally Posted by NVash

I do. Im part of that race. Im not trying to generalize anything. Im just saying, when someone is loud in the street, theyre usually Black. When someone wants to get loud in a store and gets the cops called on them, Black. Ive seen this happen time after time, and then I see the Caucasians walk in and out without a problem. Many times I want to ask these Black people if they realize what theyre doing. You want to complain about racism but then act a darn fool all the time? What is that? Why cant you walk in a store and act like a human being, act civilized, why must you act loud and rowdy and trash everything? Kind of like what Ive been told many times, look at the ghettos. You see how run down they are? This is why the White Man wont let the Black Man have anything. And the people that told me that were Black. Not Mulatto but 100% Black. Ive been told that time and time again, even in the ghettos by Black people who want better for themselves but look around them at the drug dealers and gunfire. Theyre disgusted by it. Those drug dealers, the guys doing wrong by their families, they would be called the 'n-word' and Im sure Ive heard them called that many times. Am I so wrong to be disgusted as well?

The worst part is that one reason racism may still be around is, sure, stubborn people. I dont doubt that. The other reason is because people keep seeing these guys on TV, these guys carrying on acting fools and getting arrested, whens the last time you saw an episode of 'Cops' that didnt involve some African Americans, and then they say 'Stupid n-words' and think everyone is like that, making it that much harder for the respectable African Americans to make something of themselves. Why? Just because of the color of their skin theyre lumped in with that crowd and honestly, I dont think many like that at all.

Then again its a Black neighborhood. I think this is, again, all in where one lives.

EDIT:

I thank you for your prayers but where did I take this wrong turn and how? If Im wrong please tell me how. Im more than willing to discuss this. Im not racist at all, Im just saying what I see.

I have a college education. I grew up in a HOUSE, not a HOOD. If you want to know why some random black person was arrested and is on Cops, I suggest you go ask them. I have no idea.

Asking me about ghettos is absurd. Should I ask you about trailer-parks?

The sad part is that you are so happy about your bigotry. You don't know me but want to ask me about the actions of the people in YOUR neighborhood simply because we share skin tone??!

BTW - people who aren't racists don't have to make announcements.

[NVash]

I figured what I said sounded racist. I know Im not. If you think I am I apologize. I actually took a moment to go speak to other people about this and have come to this conclusion. Truthfully Im uneducated. I thought I knew something and I did not. Ive seen some things, yes, and I dont pretend to like them. But its all in where I live. I havent ventured out much, I havent seen other things nor many other races act differently. I almost saw it all in two shades and theres more to it than that.

I apologize. Maybe Ill pick up this conversation when Ive seen and experienced more things or just give it up altogether.

[rogue_librarian]

Originally Posted by DanielKoehler

Would they propose to cover up the Venus de Milo because someone is offended by bare breasts?

Exactly, that could never happen...

[boxcorner]

Originally Posted by NVash

... Merriam Webster is apparently Dictionary.com, I typed in websters.com and got redirected to Dictionary.com. Havent gone to reference.com ...

Thanks, that's interesting. When I type websters.com in Google, the first website listed is merriam-webster.com whereas when I type websters.com in my browser it redirects to dictionary.reference.com

In your Post #170 the link was: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Nigger and you wrote, "... Take a look at definition number 2, the slang version under '-noun' ..."

Look at the bottom of the dictionary entry, under Origin, it says: "Dictionary.com Unabridged Based on the Random House Dictionary ...", similarly, at the bottom of the World English Dictionary entry, it says, "Collins English Dictionary ..." and under the Word Origin & History entry it says, "Online Etymology Dictionary ...", and so on.

To look up a word in Merriam-Webster, I type the word merriam after the look-up word, in my browser (I use Chromium), and then click on the website at the top of Google list. To look up a word in the Oxford dictionary, Google oxford online.

[boxcorner]

Originally Posted by rogue_librarian

Exactly, that could never happen...

Nor this which got plenty of press coverage.

[RKnack]

Originally Posted by Iphinome

There is nothing wrong with being politically correct now, it shows some manners. Don't try to confuse the absurdity of applying it retroactively with the ideal of not using hateful language in the now.

Political correctness is intellectual fascism. 'Nuff said.

[HarryT]

A question to the people who object to the editing of Mark Twain: do you also object to the editing of Agatha Christie? Do you think that "And Then There Were None" should be sold in the USA under the title "Ten Little Niggers", with an island called "Nigger Island" and a nursery rhyme about "Ten little niggers"?

[WillAdams]

The big difference between the two is that Ms. Christie only passed away in 1976 and was alive when said work was edited, exhibiting no objection to said changes --- indeed many of her portrayals of non-whites is sympathetic, esp. after World War II.

Samuel Clements is long dead, and _Huckleberry Finn_ is an artifact of a past time and needs to be studied as is, along w/ the historical context in order for the full meaning to be made of it.

No one would object to a children's edition, labeled as such --- the problem is the intellectual dishonesty of passing the bowdlerization off as the real thing.

I sympathise w/ NVash's position --- I grew up in a school which had the second-lowest tax base in the state and the worst educational standing which was 60% black, 40% white, save that it had one family of Amer-asians (myself and my sister). Ill-behaved trash comes in all colors and I am certain that Martin Luther King would include equal jail time in his dream that all men be judged by the content of their character.

William

[WT Sharpe]

Originally Posted by HarryT

A question to the people who object to the editing of Mark Twain: do you also object to the editing of Agatha Christie? Do you think that "And Then There Were None" should be sold in the USA under the title "Ten Little Niggers", with an island called "Nigger Island" and a nursery rhyme about "Ten little niggers"?

Originally Posted by WillAdams

The big difference between the two is that Ms. Christie only passed away in 1976 and was alive when said work was edited, exhibiting no objection to said changes --- indeed many of her portrayals of non-whites is sympathetic, esp. after World War II.

Samuel Clements is long dead, and _Huckleberry Finn_ is an artifact of a past time and needs to be studied as is, along w/ the historical context in order for the full meaning to be made of it.

No one would object to a children's edition, labeled as such --- the problem is the intellectual dishonesty of passing the bowdlerization off as the real thing.

I sympathise w/ NVash's position --- I grew up in a school which had the second-lowest tax base in the state and the worst educational standing which was 60% black, 40% white, save that it had one family of Amer-asians (myself and my sister). Ill-behaved trash comes in all colors and I am certain that Martin Luther King would include equal jail time in his dream that all men be judged by the content of their character.

William

In addition, Harry, Christie's title wasn't of particular importance to her story. Twain was trying to make a point, and it was one that, while it perhaps could have been made another way, certainly wouldn't have been as forceful. The changing of Christie's offensive title is a vast improvement to the work.