Got it, hate it

[ProfCrash]

Originally Posted by unboggling

Heh.

Hmmm. I'm probably going to buy another eBD that CAN handle ePub as well as selected other formats. From pov of simple user wanting to build personal eBook library for personal use, to get rid of all those pesky pBooks and bookcases, why go thru the hassle of conversion then cleaning up conversion problems if you don't have to?

True. And right now you own the dominate device, and hence the dominant format, in the United States.

I think you are going to be fine.

[phil75070]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

...The Kindle is not like a Playstation 3 (sold at 12% under cost) or other devices where revenue comes from content and licensing. The Kindle is sold at 48% profit......

I'm curious as to where one can find this information as those percentages are very specific.

[Anne Bradshaw]

I'm so surprised to find someone who doesn't like their Kindle. Mine is excellent. I read books the old way and this new way. Prefer the new by far.

Thanks for the tip about downloading to the desktop first. Will do that from now on. I don't keep connected to the Internet on my Kindle and my battery lasts much longer than I anticipated.

[cvkemp]

I just love my K3. And I was very negative for a long time about the Amazon service.

[wvcherrybomb]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

You have good reason to suspect this (and I did as well), however in this case it is not so. The Kindle is not like a Playstation 3 (sold at 12% under cost) or other devices where revenue comes from content and licensing. The Kindle is sold at 48% profit, and Amazon makes practically nothing on ebooks. For a while Amazon was even taking a loss on ebooks, charging less than what they paid to the publisher, in order to keep prices from harming Kindle sales. Not sure if this has changed.

The playing field may change in the future and I'm sure Amazon has that in mind, but for now Kindle sales are about profit from Kindle sales (and stuff like the covers), and they are doing rather well. It's almost an odd thing to see these days, and I sorta find it refreshing. For some reason it makes the purchase feel better to me, ha. A good ol' fashioned product. Well kinda.

They have twice as many free books as non. Just about anything they can give away without taking a loss, they do. Offering content to support a physical product. It's crazy!

I have read this other places and was surprised. I also assumed that the profit was to be made in the ebooks.

I have been shopping for a second ereader for our household to keep everyone away from my K3. After reading this, I think I will just go ahead and buy another K3. Amazon has been good to me for many, many years and I want to continue to support them. The cheaper readers I've been looking at may be too much of a let down after the Kindle experience anyway.

[thorn]

@wvcherrybomb: i've been wondering about amazon and the free books. at first i was thinking that they did a lot of that because it really doesn't cost them much and it's a good way to promote the technology. now i'm wondering whether amazon doesn't learn a lot about us, our tastes and what we are and aren't willing to pay for, from our free downloads.

it has never bothered me that amazon knows so much about my reading tastes; in fact i generally find it more helpful than not. i just got wondering.

[ProfCrash]

The Publishers are the ones who put up the free books.

[bhartman36]

I could be wrong about this, but I think what Amazon loses in individual sales of e-books, they plan to make up in volume. People with ereaders tend to buy more ebooks than paper book readers buy paper books. I tend to believe that Bezos is a smarter guy than to give away the store in order to satisfy people who want to buy e-readers. There has to be more to the story, because selling e-readers in order to take a loss on your main business (books) would qualify Bezos as psychotic, and if that's the case, whoever has his power of attorney should take over the company immediately. It just sounds extremely unlikely to me.

This NY Times article makes a lot more sense to me.

It could be that I'm completely misunderstanding what you're saying, but it doesn't look to me like they're looking at the Kindle as the main product. It looks to me like the e-books are the product. Yes, the freebies are there to get people interested in getting Kindles, but the Kindles are there to get people buying ebooks. If the Kindle was really their focus, all of the Kindle apps on other platforms wouldn't exist (which is also why Apple gets a bug up its ass every time some other device manufacturer (c.f., Palm) wants to sync with iTunes).

[ProfCrash]

I know Amazon was losing per e-book before the Agency Model but I think they are now making a profit off of each book.

Jeff Bezos has said that the e-book division and Kindle division are two separate business lines. This tells me that in Amazon's mind they are making money off of each area.

[wvcherrybomb]

Originally Posted by thorn

@wvcherrybomb: i've been wondering about amazon and the free books. at first i was thinking that they did a lot of that because it really doesn't cost them much and it's a good way to promote the technology. now i'm wondering whether amazon doesn't learn a lot about us, our tastes and what we are and aren't willing to pay for, from our free downloads.

it has never bothered me that amazon knows so much about my reading tastes; in fact i generally find it more helpful than not. i just got wondering.

I'm sure Amazon does reap the benefit of the freebies in that way. It doesn't bother me either. I like having things recommended for me.

But, as ProfCrash said, the publishers are the ones who offer the freebies and they are generally free from other other places, in other formats, as well.

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

The Publishers are the ones who put up the free books.

Yep, what she said.

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by thorn

it has never bothered me that amazon knows so much about my reading tastes; in fact i generally find it more helpful than not. i just got wondering.

I find it helpful also, because it factors in more than genres and such. I've found that if I download a bunch of free mp3s and free ebooks, I'll get a slew of freebie recommendations that I might not have noticed otherwise. I guess it's because of the "others also bought" feature, and lots of others load up on freebies like I do. I think it's funny that their recommendation system may actually be causing me to spend LESS instead of more. As long as they keep sending free stuff my way, I could care less if they're checking my stats.

I also like the fact that I can edit the items that my recommendations are based on. I only buy my Kirkland doxylamine every three months - I don't need to know every competing brand they have for sale.

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by bhartman36

People with ereaders tend to buy more ebooks than paper book readers buy paper books.

I don't think I believe this statement.
I don't feel strongly enough about it to get all mean and nasty, but I just don't buy it.
Why do you think this?

[wvcherrybomb]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

I think it's funny that their recommendation system may actually be causing me to spend LESS instead of more.

I only buy my Kirkland doxylamine every three months

Haha, me too about spending less. Amazon's tracker knows I like free stuff so shows lots of freebies in my genres.

Does doxylamine make you feel sleepy the next day? I take Ambien every night but sometimes run out because of taking two. I fill in the gaps with diphenhydramine but I hate the way I feel groggy from it in the morning.

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I don't think I believe this statement.
I don't feel strongly enough about it to get all mean and nasty, but I just don't buy it.
Why do you think this?

I'm glad you brought this up. I had this same exact line quoted and ready to go on my last post but everything I could think to say sounded confrontational so I decided not to ask.

I have spent less on ebooks than I did on pbooks and I still buy some pbooks.

[kindlekitten]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I don't think I believe this statement.
I don't feel strongly enough about it to get all mean and nasty, but I just don't buy it.
Why do you think this?

oh I absolutely believe it. I am buying about 20 books a month not counting the freebies. granted about 17 of them are between .99 and 2.99, but I am still buying them

[bhartman36]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I don't think I believe this statement.
I don't feel strongly enough about it to get all mean and nasty, but I just don't buy it.
Why do you think this?

There are a couple of reasons:

1) The NY Times article I linked to alluded to it. There's also this article.

2) I think it makes intuitive sense. You don't plunk down $140-$380 if you don't intend to read a lot. More casual readers, if they read e-books at all, simply have the apps on their phones or computers.

3) If you take Amazon at their word (which is obviously not a given, but it makes sense, given #2 above) Amazon sells more ebooks now than paper books. There are only (that I can tell) two ways for this to happen:

a) People are generally moving en masse to download and read e-books on their Kindle apps for other platforms.

b) Kindle owners are buying more e-books than their non-Kindle counterparts.

B makes more sense to me, because Kindle owners are motivated to buy e-books, and from everything I've heard, the smartphone apps are more for casual readers.

Maybe I'm just a weirdo, but one of the calculations I had to make, way back when I bought my K1, was, "How much am I going to read on this thing?" If you don't read a lot, the economics are against buying it.