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Old 12-30-2010, 08:19 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by mboothe View Post
How the heck is refusing to sell sick, perverted crap censorship? I would be offended if they didn't remove it.
They didn't remove plenty of other books with more explicit and "perverted" content. These were removed for the titles, not the contents, which aren't that racy, and no more sick or perverted than your average thriller combined with a romance novel.

They sell the Hannibal books, which show cannibalism in a positive light. Are you offended that they don't remove those?
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:28 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by Sydney's Mom View Post
I am confused. Wasn't there a HUGE uproar when Amazon refused to take down the pedifile book? On this very forum? And now we are upset that Amazon is (gasp) censoring the books they are presenting for sale? ...


SCOOOOOOOOORE!!!
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:31 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by mboothe View Post
How the heck is refusing to sell sick, perverted crap censorship? I would be offended if they didn't remove it.
You must be continually offended then. Ever read "Exquisite Corpse" by Poppy Z. Brite?

http://www.amazon.com/Exquisite-Corp...sr=8-1-catcorr

Amazon sell it quite happily and I'm guessing that it's much more offensive than the two novels mentioned in this thread.

Incidentally, I'm pleased that you have some 6th sense that tells you a book with the word "rape" in the title is somehow sick and perverted. Looks like you can't judge a book by the cover, but you can by the title?

Just for an exercise, type in the word rape in an "All Departments" search in Amazon and prepare to be outraged. Shopping at Amazon must be a painful experience for you.

Regards
Caleb
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:46 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by eppythacher View Post

http://www.ogilvyrenault.com/en/expertise_9691.htm
Err.. what about this?




In the pro vs anti censorship debate, the Pros don't like other people telling companies what they can or can not sell. This Quebec law has the effect of:
Any company that wants to do business in Canada has to double their printing costs. I honestly don't think anyone cares, yet the Pros don't like forcing companies to sell products? How about this, if you want to do business with the US you have to be anti-censorship?
Quebec has a "language police" that fines stores, and all kinds of business that have not signs in french. They are despised all over Canada for doing that, and pretty much a unique case in this country.

Of all the provinces of Canada, there is only ONE that is officially bilingual, and that is New Brunswick, all others are either english or french. Only at the federal level, bilingualism is official everywhere.
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:46 PM   #65
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How the heck is refusing to sell sick, perverted crap censorship? I would be offended if they didn't remove it.
Why does a companies actions offend you when they do perfectly legal things? And how do you know the content of the books from the title? Have you read the books?

People being offended by these kind of things offend me.
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:47 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by caleb72 View Post
.... Shopping at Amazon must be a painful experience for you.
...
Shopping in general is a painful experience for me.
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:51 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by kennyc View Post
Shopping in general is a painful experience for me.
I've been enjoying shopping at Smashwords and Amazon lately. Armchair shopping has its advantages.

However, put me in a large shopping centre (mall in U.S.?) and ask me to walk around all day looking at shops and I may not always consider the experience to be without pain.

Regards
Caleb
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:55 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by eppythacher View Post
The Rape of Nanking: The Forgotten Holocaust of World War II
http://www.amazon.com/Rape-Nanking-F.../dp/0140277447
Hope Amazon does not ban it lol. I'm sure the book is offensive to the Japanese government.
that is an entirely different kettle of fish, it is about word usage. if I describe my dog as a "wonderful Newfoundland Bitch" (which she totally is!) it is very different from me saying "so and so is such a bitch"

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr ploppy View Post
It would be more like them refusing to carry Brokeback Mountain. But the thing about the moral minority is, they are never satisfied. They just continue chipping away until there is nothing left.
it's not even remotely similar. even equating the two shows an incredible level of ignorance

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Originally Posted by eppythacher View Post
In the US in 2006 there where 435,000 tobacco related deaths and 85,000 Alcohol related deaths. We can buy Alcohol and tobacco stocks, and those companies have at duty to their shareholders to sell tobacco and alcohol. Amazon has a duty to their shareholders to sell books. They are not a private company, they are PUBLIC. You have a point though, selling snuff would be amoral, but so is selling tobacco and maybe alcohol.
these books are promoting an extremely violent and intolerable action. regardless of whether or not the company is publicly traded, they still have the ability to chart their own course

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Originally Posted by tompe View Post
Snuff movies does not have to be porn. And snuff movies does not exist.
wrong.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:12 PM   #69
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wrong.
No correct. You probably do not know the definition of "snuff movie". Look it up in Wikipedia so you can avoid spreading falsehoods.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:21 PM   #70
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Actually Wikipedia says "generally regarded as an urban legend" then goes on to elaborate on this... now whilst probably correct, wiki quotes hardly provide definitive proof... you should also note that whilst it is easy to prove positives it is not so easy to prove negatives...


Quote:
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No correct. You probably do not know the definition of "snuff movie". Look it up in Wikipedia so you can avoid spreading falsehoods.
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Old 12-30-2010, 09:30 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post

Amazon has the right to run its business, within the law (which this decision may skirt but probably doesn't break), any way it likes--but customers also have the right to point out that they're being sleazy and dishonest, and encourage people to stop doing business with them.
To be consistent, you must refuse to buy from any publisher, because they all reject books without being able to point to written criteria why.

And, no, Amazon does not even come close to skirting laws. They can chose what to sell within very broad parameters.
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:22 PM   #72
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I didn't realize it was considered a right for a self-published author to have his or her titles sold by a private sector company of the author's choosing. Or that once the author's book had been carried by a specific retailer or distributor, the company didn't have a right to stop carrying said content for whatever reason or no reason whatsoever.

Personally, I don't consider a private sector company's decision to stop selling certain books as censorship. If Amazon - or Apple or B&N - decided tomorrow that books containing the word "purple" were objectionable and in violation of their content guidelines, I wouldn't consider it censorship. I'd consider it a business decision related to content sold. Whether it's a good business decision or a bad business decision is irrelevant to the censorship question. I wouldn't consider it censorship unless the company in question also tried to suppress other companies from selling "purple" books.
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:25 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by Elfwreck View Post
Amazon has the right to sell or not sell anything it likes--but it's sleazy, and possibly fraud, to penalize people for not following instructions they weren't given.

Nothing in Amazon's content guidelines indicates that titles, or titles of some genres, can't contain the word "rape." A quick search turns up several other books with rape in the title, including "The High School Rape Club."

Amazon doesn't have an obligation to carry any particular content, but it does have an obligation to tell its clients what the business rules are, and to apply those rules to all its clients, not selectively by criteria they refuse to define.
The letter from Amazon that the author posted looked like a standard form letter to the "publisher" of the books. Which in this case was also the author. The word "titles" in the context of the form letter struck me as a substitute for stating that the author's books were in violation of content policy. Would be like me using the phrase Random House titles or Penguin titles to refer to books sold by a particular publisher.

And if a company offers to sell content under vague guidelines, and an author makes a conscious decision to sign up anyway, knowing exactly how vague those guidelines are, why is that author then surprised to find his titles pulled due to content violation?
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:38 PM   #74
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As a side note, 3 months ago I was thinking of either getting a Kindle or Sony 650. I choose the Sony because it was lighter, smaller, and could hold memory cards. However, I must have spent ~$600.00 this year buying ebooks etc from amazon. Because of their recent censorship, I won't be buying anything from them again (unless they have a 80% off ebook sale, lol). If I were a Amazon stock holder, I would not be happy about that. Also, in 3 years will Google be Amazons biggest ebook competitor?
So....you will stop buying your ebooks from Amazon because they are removing ebooks for censorship reasons of which you do not purchase nor intend to???

Great, lets all stop buying from companies who are no longer stocking products/items which we have absolutely no interest in.

If on the other hand you were interested in the titles that Amazon are pulling from sale I can completely understand, but if you have no interest in rape/incest/what-ever-other-phrase-Amazon-are-banning then......I think you're mad.

I do feel on this topic of Amazon that they should actually inform people why their ebooks are being removed, and not just a generic violation of terms.
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Old 12-31-2010, 12:46 AM   #75
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No correct. You probably do not know the definition of "snuff movie". Look it up in Wikipedia so you can avoid spreading falsehoods.
I refuse to use wikipedia as any resource for anything and am on record here for that position.

when I was in Europe, I saw what was told to me was a snuff flick. and that is pretty much all I want to say about it
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