Amazon Defends Pedophile Book

[ardeegee]

Originally Posted by Piper_

Yadda, yadda, yadda, yadda

To sum up-- people have the right to read really offensive books-- unless I find them really offensive. Then, they are really offensive in a special way and must be banned. This can not turn around against me, because my offenedness is uniquely offended.

The answer to bad speech is more speech.

[Piper_]

Originally Posted by ardeegee

To sum up-- people have the right to read really offensive books-- unless I find them really offensive. Then, they are really offensive in a special way and must be banned. This can not turn around against me, because my offenedness is uniquely offended.

The answer to bad speech is more speech.

No, I was pointing out that this experience shows that most people are capable of observing the critical distinctions between types of "offense," and can thus make good value judgments without causing injustice.

Obviously, many people cannot see such distinctions. Those people are are the reason good kids suffer the injustices from mindless zero-tolerance policies.

A lot of people require the crutch of zero tolerance policies over trusting people to evaluate the situation in context and decide upon the just and proper response.

I don't expect all of them to get it, but I still hope some will.



By the way, I reserved comment on your saying you think this book should be required reading for children. I hope, if you have or know children, you will avoid actually doing that. You have no reason to trust my word on anything, but you should seek the advice of someone who has some background in the area.

I too believe education is the best weapon, but there are materials out there that do an excellent, age-appropriate job of it, without advocating it. Books like this are not among that group.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by Piper_

I too believe education is the best weapon, but there are materials out there that do an excellent, age-appropriate job of it, without advocating it. Books like this are not among that group.

So you've read this book?

[recluse]

That is a tad over the line, Kenny.
The book is self described as being aimed at child molestors, not a guide for kids on how to protect themselves from molestors.

Seriously, get a grip.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by recluse

That is a tad over the line, Kenny.
The book is self described as being aimed at child molestors, not a guide for kids on how to protect themselves from molestors.

Seriously, get a grip.

Have you read it?

[Piper_]

Originally Posted by kennyc

So you've read this book?

Not all of it. People I know have, and they and others are posting excerpts and full or chapter summaries on 2 other forums I belong to. Some reporters in the media are too. My forums are private, but someone posted a chapter by chapter summary at Amazon, if you want to check that out.

It's so short it doesn't take many of either to put it all together. :\ And yes, it's definitely enough to know it would be inappropriate to show a kid.

Anyway, I avoided the more prurient sections, and then had to quit reading altogether, because I got tired of reading people go on about how, historically, pedophilia was no big deal until we made it that way.

[Worldwalker]

Originally Posted by tiniree

I do not approve of banning books!

...

There are just some things that should not be allowed...

So you approve of banning books you think should not be allowed?

[jhempel24]

Jesus Christ people, this is rediculous.

You want to hide behind the first amendment and freeddom of speech, fine, cower behind it. But I live in a country where we are free to make our choice, and it's obvious that WE THE PEOPLE made the choice that it was offensive and it was listened to!

Was it YOUR choice?? NO, but when the hell did the world revolve around you? End of story, welcome to America enjoy your stay, and if you don't like it, we've got two borders, have a safe trip.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by Piper_

Not all of it. People I know have, and they and others are posting excerpts and full or chapter summaries on 2 other forums I belong to. Some reporters in the media are too. My forums are private, but someone posted a chapter by chapter summary at Amazon, if you want to check that out.

It's so short it doesn't take many of either to put it all together. :\ And yes, it's definitely enough to know it would be inappropriate to show a kid.

Anyway, I avoided the more prurient sections, and then had to quit reading altogether, because I got tired of reading people go on about how, historically, pedophilia was no big deal until we made it that way.

Good. (or bad I guess) at least it is good to make informed statements instead of just reacting. I have not read it and only a bit of the news sites (it was on the local news here in Denver tonight since the guy is from southern CO).

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by jhempel24

Jesus Christ people, this is rediculous.

You want to hide behind the first amendment and freeddom of speech, fine, cower behind it. But I live in a country where we are free to make our choice, and it's obvious that WE THE PEOPLE made the choice that it was offensive and it was listened to!

Was it YOUR choice?? NO, but when the hell did the world revolve around you? End of story, welcome to America enjoy your stay, and if you don't like it, we've got two borders, have a safe trip.

I'm actually not quite sure what you are saying here.

[jhempel24]

It means we exorcised our right to freedom of speech by telling Amazon to take it down, and in true Democracy fashion, they listened to the people.

So I don't see where any freedom of speech was violated, in fact, it was used to express disgust.

[kennyc]

Thanks for the explanation. I'm in agreement with you about the expression, not sure I'd go as far as to call it democracy though, more like mob rule.

[ProfCrash]

Originally Posted by jhempel24

It means we exorcised our right to freedom of speech by telling Amazon to take it down, and in true Democracy fashion, they listened to the people.

So I don't see where any freedom of speech was violated, in fact, it was used to express disgust.

Why do people always confuse democracy and capitalism? One is a political system, one is an economic system.


Because we are a democracy that happens to have free speech, the idiot author could write and publish an offensive book. Yeah democracy, the government did not censor the author. Yeah democracy. We could all freely complain about the idiot author and the subject matter of his book.

People made it clear to Amazon that they found a book distasteful and Amazon made a business decision to take it down. That is capitalism, the threat of a boycott and loss of business caused Amazon to make a business decision.

So both systems functioned the way they should. Democracy allowed for free speech, offensive and annoying as it is, and Capitalism lead to Amazon choosing to not sell the book because their customers said it was offensive and threatened to boycott.

[Dulin's Books]

6 borders actually. north south east west up and down

[jhempel24]

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Why do people always confuse democracy and capitalism? One is a political system, one is an economic system.


Because we are a democracy that happens to have free speech, the idiot author could write and publish an offensive book. Yeah democracy, the government did not censor the author. Yeah democracy. We could all freely complain about the idiot author and the subject matter of his book.

People made it clear to Amazon that they found a book distasteful and Amazon made a business decision to take it down. That is capitalism, the threat of a boycott and loss of business caused Amazon to make a business decision.

So both systems functioned the way they should. Democracy allowed for free speech, offensive and annoying as it is, and Capitalism lead to Amazon choosing to not sell the book because their customers said it was offensive and threatened to boycott.

I used it to keep it within the political realm, I wasn't confusing the two

Originally Posted by kennyc

Thanks for the explanation. I'm in agreement with you about the expression, not sure I'd go as far as to call it democracy though, more like mob rule.

So if I'm understanding you right, lets say the presidential election for instance: We vote, the government listens (because we don't really vote in, the electoral college does), so that's mob rule? LOL, either way, I gotta get Guido's opinion on this.