Atheist zealots a heavy cross to bear

[recluse]

There have been several posts indicating that people of faith are defective, Donnageddon.
And worse.

I expect that from the "hellfire and brimstone" nuts, not from those who claim to be intellectuals.

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

You know what, I've got the feeling that its probably very healthy for you to get a little offended from time to time. Sometimes its good to encounter others with strong opinions and beliefs that help us challenge our own views to strengthen or change. Wow......................


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If youre secure with your belief then theres no need. But thats just it, its impossible to become secure with atheism. Those who convince themselves more and more are forming chains that they can't break out of, and eventually such individuals can become what are termed monsters in society. Thats just what Satans gunning for. Its the best way to bring folks down.

Take a deep breathe and remember... paragraphs are your friends.

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by recluse

There have been several posts indicating that people of faith are defective, Donnageddon.
And worse.

I expect that from the "hellfire and brimstone" nuts, not from those who claim to be intellectuals.

What can be worse than the "cold reality" of declaring atheists will burn eternally in hell fire?

Really, recluse, you need to adjust your perception of what constitutes "hatred".

[terrazoids]

Originally Posted by weateallthepies

If the theists were content to simply believe that might work but many seek to affect society as a whole based on those beliefs. If I became a passive atheist overnight, there would still be unelected bishops sitting in my democratic government, religious groups would still seek to and succeed in opposing scientific research, political leaders would still justify their actions by invoking god. I'm not sure how it would help to simply ignore all these things.

The reason why religious groups sometimes get in the way of scientific research, is that they perceive scientists do no think of of the moral consequences of their actions. Many scientists are atheist and so postulate that because they have a high level of education in one area this entitles them to pursue a potentially damaging from of knowledge as there is no reason why not to (or the 'pursuit of knowledge'). Sometimes they even convince themselves that a certain plainly evil device is actually good for the world, as the famous case concerning the thermonuclear bomb. They're looking for these false moralities in order to justify their research and enable them to continue in their path. Just because we can do something doesn't mean we should. Many people posted about how they don't need religion to live ethically. That may be true but its dangerous. Its all about perspective. Point of view. Whom do you place as the center of your universe. People don't intentionally subvert normal moral rules, or course not. Even many atheists are living normal ethical lives, sure. Where it gets tricky is in cases where a person defines an activity as part of 'who they are' or has a very strong desire to do something but needs some belief system to back it up. This is when a person may choose to modify a moral rule for personal gain. Theres mild examples of this and extreme. Politicians telling a white lie to protect their reputations to Jeffrey Dahmer praying at an idol made of his victims skulls so he could continue exploring the evil he was obsessed with.

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Theres no hate there buddy... just sweet cold reality..

terrazoids, I am still awaiting anything from you resembling "reality" other than reading "the book".

You are finely attuned it seems to "sound bites" and an empty gas tank on "thoughtful content".

But, may you live long and prosper... and do no harm to others.

[terrazoids]

Originally Posted by recluse

There have been several posts indicating that people of faith are defective, Donnageddon.
And worse.

I expect that from the "hellfire and brimstone" nuts, not from those who claim to be intellectuals.

Is it really so nutty what I'm talking about? By the way, does anyone here actually understand what I'm talking about?

[terrazoids]

Originally Posted by Donnageddon

terrazoids, I am still awaiting anything from you resembling "reality" other than reading "the book".

You are finely attuned it seems to "sound bites" and an empty gas tank on "thoughtful content".

But, may you live long and prosper... and do no harm to others.

Same to you pal...

[terrazoids]

Originally Posted by Donnageddon

terrazoids, I am still awaiting anything from you resembling "reality" other than reading "the book".

You are finely attuned it seems to "sound bites" and an empty gas tank on "thoughtful content".

But, may you live long and prosper... and do no harm to others.

Well I'm still waiting for something from you other than derision and insults..

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Is it really so nutty what I'm talking about? By the way, does anyone here actually understand what I'm talking about?

terrazoids, what you are saying is common street evangalism. It contains no real thought. We have all heard this 24X7 from street performers and late night cable TV. Much like the "sham-wow" guy.

You really need to dig deeper and question the catch phrases you have learned.

I know you have much deeper insights in you!

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Well I'm still waiting for something from you other than derision and insults..

er.. what was your question again?

[weateallthepies]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

You know what, I've got the feeling that its probably very healthy for you to get a little offended from time to time. Sometimes its good to encounter others with strong opinions and beliefs that help us challenge our own views to strengthen or change.

On this I agree. Philip Pullman summed it up on the publication of his last book:

It was a shocking thing to say, and I knew it was a shocking thing to say. But no one has the right to live without being shocked. No one has the right to spend their life without being offended.

Nobody has to read this book. Nobody has to pick it up. Nobody has to open it. And if they open it and read it, they don’t have to like it. And if you read it and dislike it, you don’t have to remain silent about it. You can write to me — You can complain about it. You can write to the publisher. You can write to the paper. You can write your own book.

You can do all those things, but there your rights stop.

No one has the right to stop me from writing this book. No one has the right to stop it being published, or sold, or bought, or read.

And that’s all I have to say on that subject.

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Wow there are all kinds of folks on this thread. I have the feeling that a lot of people who do have strong faith are afraid to speak up about it because of the viscous attacks from some of the more vocal members. Some folks react by pushing their so called awards in front of them to prove their validity and then recommending me to go and read more like school teachers. Others are content to poke fun at thousands of years of philosophy and though with little jibes and funny stories that prove their point. Some folks dig up internet links and encyclopedia articles that I must read before I become 'enlightened' by them.

Isn't that exactly what you do when you constantly point people towards "The good book".

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Other folks are selecting passages out of context from the bible and pushing them forward as proof that God is cruel. Yeah we could debate everyone of them but the point is that no one here seems to be able to hold down a debate without becoming totally aggressive and 'offended'. Well thats fine too. I don't mind offending people.

I'm not aggressive or offended. There have been plenty of reasonable comments and questions many of which you have not replied to.

Originally Posted by terrazoids

And the image of burning in hell is one which draws powerful reactions and can truly motivate people to think about what they do, if they don't already naturally feel inclined. Satan is ever present in the world and society, and he loves the ones who sound haughty and arrogant. The ones who believe they've got it all worked out. These are the people who place themselves at the center of their universe and begin to take decisions on what to do based on what they perceive their wants to be. What belief in God can do for you is to remove your self as the center of the your world. God will become the center of your belief. Something outside of yourself, and then actions thoughts, everything changes. What I'm curious about is why so many atheists are acting so aggressively to these ideas. Why are you offended? Actually? If youre secure with your belief then theres no need. But thats just it, its impossible to become secure with atheism. Those who convince themselves more and more are forming chains that they can't break out of, and eventually such individuals can become what are termed monsters in society. Thats just what Satans gunning for. Its the best way to bring folks down.

I'm not offended in the slightest. Neither am I a monster. I'm not good because I fear hell, I'm good because I wish to live a peaceful and happy life within society. If atheists are all so self-centered, how do you explain secular charity?

[terrazoids]

Originally Posted by Donnageddon

terrazoids, what you are saying is common street evangalism. It contains no real thought. We have all heard this 24X7 from street performers and late night cable TV. Much like the "sham-wow" guy.

You really need to dig deeper and question the catch phrases you have learned.

I know you have much deeper insights in you!

Oh thank you for your confidence, are you genuine? I like catch phrases because they act as building blocks that people easily understand. Then you can manipulate those building blocks. Also often times, catch phrases are based on everyday truths that we all take for granted, they're so common. It would be hard on this forum to put forth a really complex argument because everyone's so busy picking on little details they don't agree with them. Common people... the big picture. Lets talk about God... and his potential presence in your life!

[sweevo]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Theres no hate there buddy... just sweet cold reality..

terrazoids, do you KNOW that the god you believe in exists, or do you merely BELIEVE it?

[Donnageddon]

Originally Posted by terrazoids

Common people... the big picture. Lets talk about God... and his potential presence in your life!

(TM) patent pending

[terrazoids]

Originally Posted by weateallthepies

On this I agree. Philip Pullman summed it up on the publication of his last book:






Isn't that exactly what you do when you constantly point people towards "The good book".



I'm not aggressive or offended. There have been plenty of reasonable comments and questions many of which you have not replied to.



I'm not offended in the slightest. Neither am I a monster. I'm not good because I fear hell, I'm good because I wish to live a peaceful and happy life within society. If atheists are all so self-centered, how do you explain secular charity?

You need to read more carefully what I wrote, and I have tried to respond to people here on this forum. Keep in my mind that I do think its possible to be an atheist and live an ethical life. Also note that I haven't pointed people to the "book" as often as others using wiki articles to back up there points. You know what, I like it when people try to explain their own ideas without reference to external books and so forth. You know... using logic.