Seriousness The concept of 'TIME' - Page 4

Sweetpea · 08-23-2010, 06:28 AM

Well, we all know that time isn't fixed. It will crawl when you want it to go fast, and it will go fast, when you want it to crawl...

I once read something about time travel that I might think is true. It said you couldn't physically travel back or forth in time (except, using natural events, such as the passing of time). But you could go as an "observer".

There's also a nice short story by Robert Silverberg: "When we went to see the end of the world" that shows a very interesting view about time travel.

HarryT · 08-23-2010, 07:55 AM

It is an interesting conundrum which really crosses the line between between physics and philosophy as to why it is that we can travel in space, but not in time (other than in one direction, and at a fixed speed. General Relativity describes the universe as consisting of 4 dimensional spacetime - 3 dimensions of space, 1 of time - and there's nothing "different" about the time dimension; it's mathematically equivalent to the spacial ones. And yet we can easily travel through the spacial dimensions, but not at all easily through the temporal dimension. Nobody really knows why that is.

GeoffC · 08-23-2010, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Williamlk

What would an existence be like if there was NO time at all?

Not possible, when would lunchtime or 'going home time' be if Time did not exist ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

It is an interesting conundrum which really crosses the line between between physics and philosophy as to why it is that we can travel in space, but not in time (other than in one direction, and at a fixed speed. General Relativity describes the universe as consisting of 4 dimensional spacetime - 3 dimensions of space, 1 of time - and there's nothing "different" about the time dimension; it's mathematically equivalent to the spacial ones. And yet we can easily travel through the spacial dimensions, but not at all easily through the temporal dimension. Nobody really knows why that is.

Travel in the temporal dimension is easy, provided one is happy with it being one-way only .....

beppe · 08-23-2010, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

It is an interesting conundrum which really crosses the line between between physics and philosophy as to why it is that we can travel in space, but not in time (other than in one direction, and at a fixed speed. General Relativity describes the universe as consisting of 4 dimensional spacetime - 3 dimensions of space, 1 of time - and there's nothing "different" about the time dimension; it's mathematically equivalent to the spacial ones. And yet we can easily travel through the spacial dimensions, but not at all easily through the temporal dimension. Nobody really knows why that is.

there is a j in front of time ...

Sparrow · 08-23-2010, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

General Relativity describes the universe as consisting of 4 dimensional spacetime - 3 dimensions of space, 1 of time - and there's nothing "different" about the time dimension...

Isn't one difference that any movement in space requires time, but movement in time does not require space?

HarryT · 08-23-2010, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Isn't one difference that any movement in space requires time, but movement in time does not require space?

That is the physical situation in which we find ourselves, yes. What I meant was that in GR the four dimensions are mathematically identical - there's nothing that singles out the time dimension from the other three.

Sparrow · 08-23-2010, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beppe

I will try to show how I envision that, Sparrow.
Take the film of an event. Like of you getting the prize for best time maker in the office

cut all the frames and put them one on top of the other. Look through them against the proper light and you will see what happens when all the instances of time are collapsed in one space image.

Then just take one frame, the one in which you receive that nice check. Look at it from the side, till the image is collapsed in just a verical line on the right or the left. It resembles the full image but everything that was distributed along is now a just a line.

Everything is touching. Get the check and run.

It is not what actually happens but its representation. That's the key point.

I can't get my head round it!!

Is it something to do with timelines - and things are touching (themselves) in the time dimension, even if they're not in contact with anything in the 3 space dimensions, and the earth is helical spaghetti instead of a sphere?

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=M...0helix&f=false

Javed · 08-23-2010, 09:07 AM

The clip describes the theory of increasing speed causing the slowing of time.

beppe · 08-23-2010, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeoffC

Travel in the temporal dimension is easy, provided one is happy with it being one-way only .....

and free, that could be the main factor in Northumberland and further .

.

dsvick · 08-23-2010, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TGS

Suppose you have a meeting arranged for next Wednesday, then you get an email saying, "Sorry to mess you about but we are going to have the move the meeting forward a day." Is the meeting now on Tuesday or Thursday.
Why is this relevant? Well there seem to be two main ways of conceiving of time - either as something we move through or as something that moves past us, and whilst most of us can operate with either conception we do tend to favour one or the other.

Mostly that's just semantics, or us people trying to organize it in our minds. To me, the concept of moving something forward in time meaning that it will happen sooner, implies that time, or future events, is/are coming towards us. If I'm moving toward something and you move it forward, that forward is in relation to my direction of travel, ion this case ti would be away from me, so the meeting would be Thursday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cassidym

It's a popular idea among conspiracy theorists that the problems continuing to plague the Large Hadron Collider at Cern are actually being caused by scientists coming back from the future and deliberately damaging it. This because they know that, if the Collider is ever fired up and does bang atoms together at close to light speed, it'll cause a black hole.

If that were the case and it were that important I'd hope they'd come up with something a bit more permanent

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

It is an interesting conundrum which really crosses the line between between physics and philosophy as to why it is that we can travel in space, but not in time (other than in one direction, and at a fixed speed. General Relativity describes the universe as consisting of 4 dimensional spacetime - 3 dimensions of space, 1 of time - and there's nothing "different" about the time dimension; it's mathematically equivalent to the spacial ones. And yet we can easily travel through the spacial dimensions, but not at all easily through the temporal dimension. Nobody really knows why that is.

Maybe we just haven't invented the right vehicle to travel through time yet.

bjones6416 · 08-23-2010, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvick

If I'm moving toward something and you move it forward, that forward is in relation to my direction of travel, ion this case ti would be away from me, so the meeting would be Thursday.

This just proves the point, I guess, because I would have assumed the meeting was moved to Tuesday!

WT Sharpe · 08-23-2010, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Williamlk

... What would an existence be like if there was NO time at all? ...

Many serious physicists have begun to ponder whether time indeed is static and our perception of it as fluid is but an illusion. According to these theorists, the assumption that time is static removes many of the mathematical difficulties inherent in current theories. It also means that we have not yet been born and at the same time are long since dead.

WT Sharpe · 08-23-2010, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javed

The clip describes the theory of increasing speed causing the slowing of time.

Great video.

We know that astronauts in our day have already traveled through time. Only microseconds, to be sure, but the time dilation experienced by lunar astronauts away from the earth's gravitational field (which also causes distortions of time), and the distance into the future they have traveled, is measurable.

To date, the only person I know of to successfully travel is a reverse direction through time is Superman, who does it by traveling faster than light in a counter-clockwise direction around the earth. For the rest of us (to date anyway) time seems to be a one-way journey.

As I understand it, events on the quantum scale are not subject to the limitations of time's arrow, and may explain such mysteries as quantum entanglement, in which information gives the appearance of violating the limitations of light speed. Particles moving in a reverse direction through time may even account for antimatter. Anti-particles may simply be normal particles traveling is a reverse direction through time, and what appears to us as the annihilation of each in particle/anti-particle collisions may be simply one and the same particle reversing its direction through time.

dsvick · 08-23-2010, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bjones6416

This just proves the point, I guess, because I would have assumed the meeting was moved to Tuesday!

That was my point, if something gets moved up, then, to me, it happens earlier. Which implies time is moving towards me.

I used the "If I'm moving toward something and you move it forward,..." example because that was the one that TGS offered, I used it to illustrate why, to me, it didn't fit.

Sparrow · 08-23-2010, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvick

That was my point, if something gets moved up, then, to me, it happens earlier. Which implies time is moving towards me.

And away from everyone else??

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08-23-2010, 06:28 AM	#46
Sweetpea Grand Sorcerer Posts: 9,707 Karma: 32763414 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Krewerd Device: Pocketbook Inkpad 4 Color; Samsung Galaxy Tab S6	Well, we all know that time isn't fixed. It will crawl when you want it to go fast, and it will go fast, when you want it to crawl... I once read something about time travel that I might think is true. It said you couldn't physically travel back or forth in time (except, using natural events, such as the passing of time). But you could go as an "observer". There's also a nice short story by Robert Silverberg: "When we went to see the end of the world" that shows a very interesting view about time travel.

08-23-2010, 07:55 AM	#47
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,560 Karma: 93980341 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	It is an interesting conundrum which really crosses the line between between physics and philosophy as to why it is that we can travel in space, but not in time (other than in one direction, and at a fixed speed. General Relativity describes the universe as consisting of 4 dimensional spacetime - 3 dimensions of space, 1 of time - and there's nothing "different" about the time dimension; it's mathematically equivalent to the spacial ones. And yet we can easily travel through the spacial dimensions, but not at all easily through the temporal dimension. Nobody really knows why that is.

08-23-2010, 09:07 AM	#53
Javed Grand Sorcerer Posts: 10,270 Karma: 1126878541 Join Date: Oct 2009 Device: Astak Pocket PRO, iPod Touch, PRS-650	The clip describes the theory of increasing speed causing the slowing of time.