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Old 07-19-2010, 07:09 PM   #16
Cosmo Spring
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Some more $.02 on the "academic eReader" topic...

I was in a similar situation until I picked up a DX-Graphite a couple weeks ago. I did a lot of research, and found this site quite useful for its user comments. I'm a doctoral student and I'm starting the part where I have to read every word written on my topic of interest. I was already sick of printing and carrying so much paper. I'm a gadget geek, too, but with my income (did I mention I'm in grad school?) I don't want to make this decision twice and end up having to buy another gadget in a few months.

So, some thoughts, particularly about the iPad/eReader for academics / grad students...

Reading on the Kindle > Reading in the iPad. The lighter weight and the e-ink screen produces a MUCH better reading experience. Had Apple busted out the matte-finish screen like what's on my 15" MacBook Pro, it might have been enough that this would be a non-factor. But when test-driving the iPad I was not happy with the glare. Also, my arm and neck was sore-enough from reading a short paper that I had pretty much made my decision at this point.

Annotating on the iPad: inefficient and possibly bad for your mind. Okay, there will be software improvements in facilitating annotation as PDF apps for the iPad get better, but the same ergonomics that detract from the reading experience are redoubled on manipulating the iPad to scribble, highlight, and produce marginalia. Also, the capacitive display (non-stylus-type touchscreen) makes for poor precision particularly when trying to actually scribble some legible, which is a problem for most academics with good old pen and paper. Finally, I'm of a mind that taking actual notes while reading is a better method than scribbling on the paper or the screen for the sort of deep, critical reading that academics tends to expect. To whatever degree that is the case, (a) it makes handling the heavier iPad more irritating, and (b) it exacerbates the need for precise and efficient annotation features if you were to try to capture your writing on the iPad itself.

The iPad will be made obsolete by... the next iPad. Ask anyone who bought the first-generation iPhone. I didn't buy the first iPhone, but I think so much of my iPhone 3GS that I cannot wait to see what the iPad turns into. That being said, I feel the Kindle DX will not be eclipsed by future technology - not as fast as the iPad, at least - and it is, afterall, a fine eReader beyond my requirements as an academic. I dream, fondly and with much anticipation, of the day when I can read ebooks for fun.

Among eReaders, it is the only (academic) option, and it will be for a while. Reading full-size PDF - OCR'd or not - is a real treat on the massive and clear screen. Also, there is enough power that even when I load up larger PDF, the page turning is no slower than a physical page turn. It is indeed frustrating that there aren't more features for us PDF readers - it would be great to insert notes or at least bookmarks, and advanced navigation of a large PDF can be a hassle. I had been hoping that the "business eReader" offereings from Skiff, Plastic Logic, or iRex would fill in this market space. Those projects are all dead, and personally, I think that there is no market segment here - not in the current economic climate, anyway.

Finally, the "extras" on the Kindle add to its value, but fall way short of the iPad. I love using Instapaper to send lighter reading material to the device in a friendly format from my Google Reader feeds and from Internet foraging. Also, the text-based browser has actually come in handy, and as the Kindle is slowly "opened up" for third party developers, the device should become more extensible. But it's no computing device - not even close.

So, that's that. Thank you, mobileread-ers, for helping me do my own research on what to buy, ereader-wise. I hope these comments are of help to the next poor grad student to stumble upon this site in search of the holy ereader-grail.
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Old 07-19-2010, 09:50 PM   #17
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I have used both an iPad and a Kindle DX (not the graphite). I agree that the iPad is the best reading experience for technical documents in PDF available currently. After reading on the iPad I can't get used to reading on the Kindle DX again. There is simply no comparison. The iPad wins hands down.

Now, I will mention that the Kindle DX has an eInk display and the iPad is LCD. For most people, reading on the Kindle DX will causes less eye strain and will allow you to read for longer time periods. The iPad's LCD places a much more noticeable burden on the eyes. This is just about the only advantage the Kindle DX has over the iPad. In my opinion, the reading experience and responsiveness outweighs the fact the iPad is noticeably heavier than the Kindle DX.
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Old 07-20-2010, 08:24 AM   #18
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I'm not interested in something that small. I think for that there is one Arcos tablet or something like that. But it's waaaay too small for technical pdfs.

Are you on crack?! The guy said he wanted to read technical pdfs! That means tables and figures... a 6 inch ebook is absolutely terrible for that! no matter what techonology you can't fit that much info on 6" of screen. It is impossible! And no.. please don't post dismembered pdfs on a prs 600. I have too much technical/reference pdfs to run them through a dismemberment software.

GJMS
Thanks for the shallow insult. Seems like you have all the answers. Your loquacious posts will surely guide everyone to the correct choice. Enjoy your Ipad.
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Old 07-20-2010, 10:36 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmo Spring View Post
...

Reading on the Kindle > Reading in the iPad....
Annotating on the iPad: inefficient and possibly bad for your mind.The iPad will be made obsolete by... the next iPad.....
Among eReaders, it is the only (academic) option, and it will be for a while. ...
Finally, the "extras" on the Kindle add to its value, but fall way short of the iPad....

So, that's that. Thank you, mobileread-ers, for helping me do my own research on what to buy, ereader-wise. I hope these comments are of help to the next poor grad student to stumble upon this site in search of the holy ereader-grail.
I have had also the same thoughts about KindleDX vs iPad but ... but a lot of people here are of the opinion that the pdf reader of the DX is horrible for technical pdfs (no zoom, no anotations) and that's a biggie for me. As for the iPad becoming obsolete, I don't really mind! As long as it reads the pdfs I'm ok with it. If there's an even thinner AND (important) larger iPad (which I don't expect) THEN and only then will I be angry. 3G, Apps and other bells and whistles don't interest me. As for the screen I don't mind reading on LCD but the glare... why on the Jesus' name do modern techs prefer shiny displays over antireflecting ones ? I just don't get it.

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Thanks for the shallow insult. Seems like you have all the answers. Your loquacious posts will surely guide everyone to the correct choice. Enjoy your Ipad.
*gracefully bows down* Pleased to be of service.

GJMS
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Old 07-20-2010, 11:52 AM   #20
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Things I like... My iPad and hearing different points of view and experiences

Things I don't like. ...people who rather than give an account of their experience bash other peoples opinion

It's not for me but many people read PDF's on a variety of devices, the best one being the one that works for you. In my case it's the iPad for others it's...
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Old 07-20-2010, 01:54 PM   #21
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It's not for me but many people read PDF's on a variety of devices, the best one being the one that works for you. In my case it's the iPad for others it's...
Agreed, and it's clear that there are trade-offs between eReaders and tablet/slab computers, and there will be until the size/weight difference is negligible and LCDs are easier on the eyes. But then with the long-term promise of flexible screens and re-usable, re-printable "electronic paper" there may always be two markets here.

In case the Kindle vs. iPad antagonism in my review played any part in your comment re. "Things you don't like" - I did not intend my anti-iPad comments to be ad hominem attacks on pro-iPad readers. As someone who dabbles academically and research-wise in the ergonomics and usability of human-computer interaction, I believe the iPad does produce an objectively-poor reading experience. However, (a) I am not always right, and (b) what device doesn't require the user to adjust his or her practice and behavior to accomodate it? It's a matter of the trade-offs we are willing to accept - whether for rational purposes (a given device offers other useful features) or affective reasons (we "enjoy" the device, sore arm and neck be damned) that determine, to a degree, which gadgets we will open our wallets for.

But that's just another way of saying, as you have already said in so many words: different strokes for different folks.
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Old 07-20-2010, 04:37 PM   #22
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In my opinion, the Kindle DX had the potential of being the ideal choice as an e-reader for academic reading. But there are too many things missing. The PDF viewer is very basic, even in the graphite edition. The content management interface is very poor, the web browser is sluggish to the point of being unusable most of the time. The most important thing for academic reading in an e-reader is a good PDF reader and the Kindle DX fails in this category. I have 34 research documents in PDF that don't display on the Kindle DX. A white background is shown instead. I have 9 research documents in PDF that load on the Kindle DX but the device becomes frozen constantly as a I turn the pages. These documents are handled perfectly by the iPad without a glitch.

In my view, the Kindle DX has the following advantages for the average reader but not necessarily for the technical reader (scientific and engineering publications)

1. The large selection of the Amazon Kindle bookstore.
2. The wireless delivery of ebooks.
3. The built-in cellular connection.
4. The larger size of the display makes some documents more accessible and easier to read.
5. eInk causes less eye strain when reading for long periods of time.

For academics, the selection of books is much smaller. Not all textbooks are available in the Kindle format. For academics, the most important thing is the native support for multiple formats, especially PDF, which is still the standard format for technical papers. The Kindle DX is not a good choice here based on my experience. And I did try very hard to like the Kindle DX.

The iPad also has its range of problems but I have found it to be the best device so far to read technical PDFs. After reading on the iPad, I find it impossible to go back and read on the Kindle DX. The only thing that makes me think of the Kindle DX is the eInk display, which is easier on the eyes during extended reading.
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Old 07-20-2010, 10:55 PM   #23
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Quote:
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Agreed, and it's clear that there are trade-offs between eReaders and tablet/slab computers, and there will be until the size/weight difference is negligible and LCDs are easier on the eyes. But then with the long-term promise of flexible screens and re-usable, re-printable "electronic paper" there may always be two markets here.

In case the Kindle vs. iPad antagonism in my review played any part in your comment re. "Things you don't like" - I did not intend my anti-iPad comments to be ad hominem attacks on pro-iPad readers. As someone who dabbles academically and research-wise in the ergonomics and usability of human-computer interaction, I believe the iPad does produce an objectively-poor reading experience. However, (a) I am not always right, and (b) what device doesn't require the user to adjust his or her practice and behavior to accomodate it? It's a matter of the trade-offs we are willing to accept - whether for rational purposes (a given device offers other useful features) or affective reasons (we "enjoy" the device, sore arm and neck be damned) that determine, to a degree, which gadgets we will open our wallets for.

But that's just another way of saying, as you have already said in so many words: different strokes for different folks.
No it was directed at darkness angel your comments were well thought out and Germane.
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Old 07-21-2010, 03:49 AM   #24
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Thanks for all of the help! I really appreciate it. I'm still not completely decided on which would be best for me; but I definately have a much better idea of the strengths and weaknesses of my options. I think I'm going to mull it over a bit more and maybe keep an eye open for any devices with the Pixel Qi screen too. Thanks again!
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Old 07-21-2010, 05:14 AM   #25
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Quote:
'm not interested in something that small. I think for that there is one Arcos tablet or something like that. But it's waaaay too small for technical pdfs.
I did read technical pdf on my archos 5. And found it a rather ok experience, though archos 7 would be better for that.
The only thing missing is annotation.
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Old 07-29-2010, 11:24 AM   #26
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Not quite the same, but the reason I've been toying with the idea of an ebook reader is mainly for the convenience of reading journals. I'm fortunate that all the journals I'd need to read are purely text based, with no tables.

Looking at Amazon's blurb regarding the new Kindle I'm pretty sure I read you can highlight & anotate PDFs, so am getting seriously swayed in that direction. Plus I'm in the UK so am very limited in what's available.

Will be really interested to see what else is suggested.
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Old 07-29-2010, 12:43 PM   #27
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I use a SONY PRS900 for PDFs. I am a PhD student in Finance - and do read a lot of academic papers from JSTOR and SSRN.

I read PDFs landscape - displaying a third of the page at the time. It works - it's not perfect if you deal with a lot of tables and figures, but for text it works great. Being able to free-hand annotate my files is a must for me, and being able to see the annotated files on my PC is great.

Sometimes I use BRISS to remove white margins, but most of the time I don't find it necessary.

I do, by the way, own an iPad. For how cool it is, it just isn't a reading device. I know it's somewhat subjective, but I, for one, just cannot read on LCD. And it's too heavy. And battery life is too short. The big screen is nice - but if I wanted to read on LCD, I would just stick to my laptop.
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:42 AM   #28
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I do, by the way, own an iPad. For how cool it is, it just isn't a reading device. I know it's somewhat subjective, but I, for one, just cannot read on LCD. And it's too heavy. And battery life is too short. The big screen is nice - but if I wanted to read on LCD, I would just stick to my laptop.
I appreciate your viewpoint is based on your own experience, but I really couldn't disagree with you more - just goes to show that different things really do appeal to different people.

The iPad is roughly the same weight as a typical hardback book. I read with it resting on my lap. Perfectly comfortable that way. Battery life is >10h - a LOT more than 10h if you turn WiFi and 3G off. I read for typically a couple of hours a day, and recharge my iPad once a week. I honestly don't see how that can be regarded as "too short" a battery life, but again, we all have different requirements. Finally, there's a world of different between reading on an iPad and on a laptop. The laptop is heavy and bulky, it gets hot, the screen is the wrong shape, and the keyboard gets in the way. Reading from the iPad is (for me) just like reading a hardback book.
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Old 07-30-2010, 06:06 AM   #29
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Very interesting topics,
i'm in the same situation than Greeneggs ans Cosmo Spring and I was thinking to take a Kindle DX. But with this topic, I think i'll wait a little bit more

What do you think about the iRex DR1000S and the future PocketBook 901 (that could be released soon in Europe) ?

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Old 07-30-2010, 08:50 AM   #30
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... I read for typically a couple of hours a day
Sorry Harry, but a couple of hours is not typical for academic reading.
Try reading the whole day on the iPad, day in, day out.

Yes, it wins against the epaper based devices, as far as responsiveness is concerned, but it is not all that matters.

In my point of view, the decision for an academic user is not between an iPad (and the like) and the ebook readers, but rather between a dedicated ereader and old-fashioned paper.

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