ePub gets (yet) another DRM system

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

You should be liberating you Kindle eBooks NOW and not waiting. If something was to change whereby you were no longer able to remove the DRM, all those eBooks would be screwed. So do it now and keep DRM free copies. There are plenty of people who have lost eBooks thinking I can download them later from the eBookstore and then the store goes away and the eBooks get lost. So don't wait. Do it now.

The end is nigh!
I actually agree.

Back in the PDA era, that is what I would do.
Saved me a lot of grief when MS Reader folded.

I never bought a mobi ebook until Mobi DeDrm came out. I ignored Kindle until it was cracked. I don't trust to the kindness of multinationals.

Amazon isn't likely to kill their golden egg goose by hardening the DRM completely but just because it isn't likely today doesn't mean they won't at some point in the next century.

Best practice is to buy, strip DRM, and archive the disinfected copy.
Belt and suspenders kind of thing, making sure you protect against the one in a zillion improbability.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Tex2002ans

Because you know yours is from the original source.

There's a whole lot of Calibre-converted and/or low-quality junk out there. And they may not have specific editions/versions you may need.

I buy all my books on Amazon, strip the DRM, Calibre convert them to ePub and then Calibre convert them yet again to kepub on my Kobo. So strictly speaking, all I read is "Calibre-converted and/or low-quality junk." I have no complaints.

Having said all that, I do agree you should strip the DRM immediately. I had a book on my shopping list for quite a while. John Coyne's The Piercing. For whatever reason it is now unavailable.

Like leebase, I tried to see if it was available elsewhere on the interwebs. No luck. The book wasn't popular enough I suppose.

Not everything is available everywhere. If you lose access to a book you purchased you may well not be able to find a 'back-up' elsewhere.

[leebase]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Like leebase, I tried to see if it was available elsewhere on the interwebs. No luck. The book wasn't popular enough I suppose.

Good point!

[John F]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I buy all my books on Amazon, strip the DRM, Calibre convert them to ePub and then Calibre convert them yet again to kepub on my Kobo. So strictly speaking, all I read is "Calibre-converted and/or low-quality junk." I have no complaints.

...

The difference, in many cases, is that you started with a good source, whereas the webz versions are sourced from OCRs or PDFs.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Not everything is available everywhere. If you lose access to a book you purchased you may well not be able to find a 'back-up' elsewhere.

Fictionwise had that problem nine years ago.
Overdrive cancelled their contract and they lost access to a whole bunch of ebooks.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=35896

https://dearauthor.com/ebooks/fictio...t-please-read/

Trust but veri...er, backup.

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Fictionwise had that problem nine years ago.
Overdrive cancelled their contract and they lost access to a whole bunch of ebooks.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=35896

https://dearauthor.com/ebooks/fictio...t-please-read/

Trust but veri...er, backup.

And verify that the backup can be restored.

And verify that the restored backup is correct and complete.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by j.p.s

And verify that the backup can be restored.

And verify that the restored backup is correct and complete.

And backup the backup off site.

[Tex2002ans]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I buy all my books on Amazon, strip the DRM, Calibre convert them to ePub and then Calibre convert them yet again to kepub on my Kobo. So strictly speaking, all I read is "Calibre-converted and/or low-quality junk."

I meant conversions where:

• Calibre settings were botched (Output Profiles, Page Margins, Look & Feel, [...])
  • So you may get lower-resolution/lower-quality JPGs
• Completely different Metadata.
  • Sometimes people Calibre Edit Metadata > Download Metadata, then convert and Calibre bakes that into the new file.
  • Different cover.
• Code which otherwise isn't representative of the original source.
  • Missing fonts/bold/italics.
  • Split chapter files
  • Extra page breaks.
• [...]

Or where someone just slapped a PDF into Calibre, PDF->EPUB, and call that an "EPUB" version of the book.

You also have others who have gone EPUB->MOBI->(You acquire a backup copy)->EPUB, compounding the conversion issues.

If YOU are the one working from the originals, YOU are the one who can control the entire workflow, and you KNOW that your originals weren't botched.

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Not everything is available everywhere. If you lose access to a book you purchased you may well not be able to find a 'back-up' elsewhere.

This is important to note as well. I've come across plenty of obscure Non-Fiction texts that aren't available elsewhere.

And like a few others have mentioned, stores have disappeared in the past, along with ebooks that never make it to the new location.

By the time they announce the store closure, it may be too late. (They may have taken down key servers, etc. etc.)

Originally Posted by John F

The difference, in many cases, is that you started with a good source, whereas the webz versions are sourced from OCRs or PDFs.

The worst are these so-called "EPUBs" or "MOBIs" in the ether, which are just auto-generated garbage... similar to Archive.org's non-PDF conversions.

It's the difference between these two images:

Archive.org "EPUB": Attachment 119234
Proper EPUB: Attachment 119235

"EPUB" = EPUB-in-name-only.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I buy all my books on Amazon, strip the DRM, Calibre convert them to ePub and then Calibre convert them yet again to kepub on my Kobo. So strictly speaking, all I read is "Calibre-converted and/or low-quality junk." I have no complaints.

Having said all that, I do agree you should strip the DRM immediately. I had a book on my shopping list for quite a while. John Coyne's The Piercing. For whatever reason it is now unavailable.

Like leebase, I tried to see if it was available elsewhere on the interwebs. No luck. The book wasn't popular enough I suppose.

Not everything is available everywhere. If you lose access to a book you purchased you may well not be able to find a 'back-up' elsewhere.

It's been a long time since I've looked at what's available "elsewhere", i.e. since the primary source was newsgroups and the Sony eBook store and Kindle store where not around. Even back then, not everything was available and it was not all that uncommon for a slightly obscure book to only have the original scan with no edits. We are still a long, long way from the all titles available that I had hoped for. I suppose we might have it if the government ever hammers out some sort of consent decree over orphaned books, but I'm not exactly expecting to see that in my life time.

[sealbeater]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

The more epub is forked by DRM specs, the better Kindle and iBook look.
Especially when the forks are region-dependent.

I have to say, I would never move to Kindle or iBook. Like trading one slave master for another. Personally I've never understood the format wars. Just get a device that can read anything.

[sealbeater]

Originally Posted by shalym

I'm confident that if/when stores start forcing people to use version 3+, then it will be cracked. When I first got my Kobo, the kepub DRM couldn't be removed, now it can. (which is nice, because it means that I can buy books from Kobo ) I'm confident that Alf and his colleagues will be able to handle anything that they *choose* to focus on. Right now, it's not a priority, as the workarounds exist.

Shari

It's like a universal law. The amount of time, man hours, effort and money to create DRM will always be exponentially dwarfed by the same being expended to break it. People will buy multiple devices to break hardware drm. It just will never happen, it only affects paying customers.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by sealbeater

I have to say, I would never move to Kindle or iBook. Like trading one slave master for another. Personally I've never understood the format wars. Just get a device that can read anything.

Well, there are pros and cons for any device. Yes, I could get an Android reader, install the Kindle app and read the Amazon exclusives that way. But I doubt the reading experience would be as good as on an eink Kindle. I'm a Kindle fan, but that doesn't mean I'm enslaved to Amazon. On the contrary, I buy most of my books elsewhere. As I use Calibre for managing my library anyway, converting and sideloading is no bother for me. All the books on my Kindles are sideloaded.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by sealbeater

I have to say, I would never move to Kindle or iBook. Like trading one slave master for another. Personally I've never understood the format wars. Just get a device that can read anything.

Ah, but it's not about the devices; it's about the content.
Who distributes it and who makes money off it.
That is the root of the format wars and they won't end anytime soon.

And don't expect any government mandate on orphan works on this side of the pound. Freedom of speech includes the right to *not* say anything (think: MIRANDA rights) and protection against "search and seizure" makes property rights very hard to override, especially for commercial use, which means no blanket compulsory licensing of books would pass judicial review.

Keeping a book out of print is very much a feature of US copyright.
Nobody has a right to another person's IP.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

And don't expect any government mandate on orphan works on this side of the pound. Freedom of speech includes the right to *not* say anything (think: MIRANDA rights) and protection against "search and seizure" makes property rights very hard to override, especially for commercial use, which means no blanket compulsory licensing of books would pass judicial review.

Keeping a book out of print is very much a feature of US copyright.
Nobody has a right to another person's IP.

Oh no! Not this tired old argument again! Haven't we heard about it enough in the Fall of Gondolin thread (amongst others?)

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Oh no! Not this tired old argument again! Haven't we heard about it enough in the Fall of Gondolin thread (amongst others?)

One of the tenets of the great lie is that if you keep repeating it often enough, people start to believe it. I do find it amusing that someone who talks about the new ebook business model all the time, falls back to advocating the old paper business model when it suits his purpose.

I must say it's a bit of a non sequitur. It certainly doesn't have anything to do with DRM or format wars.