Pricing sucks!

[Andrew H.]

Originally Posted by rhadin

Harry, what you meant to say then is that ebooks are more valuable to you, not that they are more valuable. the "to you" is an important qualifier.

But value is *always* subjective. For many people, the ability to avoid clutter is quite valuable, and the ability to resell or lend a book is not very important at all. (Or the ability to lend a book via Kindle to a relative 250 miles away is more important than the ability to lend a book to someone closer). E-books are more valuable to a lot of people. Even people who complain about e-book prices being higher that pbook prices.

I buy a lot of ebooks (currently have more than 500 in my TBR pile) but I only buy in ebook form either a book I'm not interested in keeping once I have read it or a book I have bought the hardcover version of but want the convenience of reading in ebook form (I buy very few for this latter purpose, perhaps 3 or 4 in a year).

To me, although I have the same shelf problem you have, ebooks are significantly less valuable because I have no intent of keeping them once read.

[stonetools]

Originally Posted by rhadin

Harry, what you meant to say then is that ebooks are more valuable to you, not that they are more valuable. the "to you" is an important qualifier. I buy a lot of ebooks (currently have more than 500 in my TBR pile) but I only buy in ebook form either a book I'm not interested in keeping once I have read it or a book I have bought the hardcover version of but want the convenience of reading in ebook form (I buy very few for this latter purpose, perhaps 3 or 4 in a year).

To me, although I have the same shelf problem you have, ebooks are significantly less valuable because I have no intent of keeping them once read.

Of course , if judgments as to the value of ebooks are subjective, then this invalidates authoritative pronouncements that ebooks are inherently less valuable because of this and that restriction, and thus should cost much less.
Ebooks are as different from pbooks as are audiobooks from pbooks. Oddly enough, no one insists audiobooks MUST be less expensive than pbooks.

[patrickt]

What part of "This price was set by the publisher" do so many people find incomprehensible?

[leebase]

The old old old book I want to buy isn't available as an ebook. Wah wah wah. Oh why oh why aren't authors and publishers putting out their old stuff in ebooks???!!!

Wait....I don't want to PAY for these ebooks. Why, I can get a used copy of the paperback for a NICKEL.....why are they charging more than a NICKEL for these OLD ebooks,.

Lee

[Mnementh]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

In the UK the Kindle edition is £2.99. About $4.99.

I've seen this with quite a few books being sold much cheaper in the UK than the US, I'm assuming (maybe completely off base obviously) the publishers are a little bit wary of introducing "Agency Pricing" over here as it resembles the Netbook Agreement far too closely and would probably be deemed illegal.

[Daithi]

Originally Posted by leebase

The old old old book I want to buy isn't available as an ebook. Wah wah wah. Oh why oh why aren't authors and publishers putting out their old stuff in ebooks???!!!

Wait....I don't want to PAY for these ebooks. Why, I can get a used copy of the paperback for a NICKEL.....why are they charging more than a NICKEL for these OLD ebooks,.

Lee

Thanks for contributing to the conversation.

[FizzyWater]

Originally Posted by stonetools

Ebooks are as different from pbooks as are audiobooks from pbooks. Oddly enough, no one insists audiobooks MUST be less expensive than pbooks.

I wouldn't agree with this statement. An audiobook contains both the text of the book and a performance by the reader(s).

I've been listening to more audiobooks this year than I ever did before (for various reasons). Sometimes, the narrator adds to the story and sometimes they kill it! I don't particularly like the prices for audiobooks (and I rely heavily on the library for stories I'll likely only listen to once), but I understand there's another layer of costs involved in these.

[Ninjalawyer]

Originally Posted by stonetools

Of course , if judgments as to the value of ebooks are subjective, then this invalidates authoritative pronouncements that ebooks are inherently less valuable because of this and that restriction, and thus should cost much less.
Ebooks are as different from pbooks as are audiobooks from pbooks. Oddly enough, no one insists audiobooks MUST be less expensive than pbooks.

That makes no sense. The experiential difference between a pbook and an audiobook is the difference between reading and radio whereas the experiential difference between an ebook and a pbook is the difference between reading a book and reading a slightly different book.

People don't say audio books should cost less because they are not children, and understand the extra work that goes into producing an audio book. They also understand the very limited amount of work that needs to be done to convert a pbook to an ebook and the fact that selling one additional ebook once you've done that conversion has an almost nil marginal cost.

Also, I think people are arguing about two different meanings of the word "value". Value can mean the subjective value you place on something or the economic value (i.e. the price a buyer is willing to pay and the price a seller is willing to accept).

[leebase]

Originally Posted by Ninjalawyer

They also understand the very limited amount of work that needs to be done to convert a pbook to an ebook and the fact that selling one additional ebook once you've done that conversion has an almost nil marginal cost.

A new book you expect to sell tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands or millions.

Backlist books where you might sell a few tens of books? There's just no money in selling so few books to make it worth the effort if you can't sell them for a good deal more than the used paper back book bin.

Originally Posted by Ninjalawyer

Also, I think people are arguing about two different meanings of the word "value". Value can mean the subjective value you place on something or the economic value (i.e. the price a buyer is willing to pay and the price a seller is willing to accept).

Right. A nickel an ebook is something buyers are VERY willing to pay....just not so many producers willing to work for that amount of pay.

But WAIT....the OP said he was willing to pay a whopping $3.98!

Exactly. Just buy that paper back from the bin you saw it in.

Lee

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by Mnementh

I've seen this with quite a few books being sold much cheaper in the UK than the US, I'm assuming (maybe completely off base obviously) the publishers are a little bit wary of introducing "Agency Pricing" over here as it resembles the Netbook Agreement far too closely and would probably be deemed illegal.

No, there's Agency pricing in the UK too. Indeed, the UK Kindle edition of Watership down is marked "This price was set by the publisher".

[rogue_librarian]

Originally Posted by HarryT

eBooks are more valuable than pbooks.

That is very much open to debate. They also have a resale value of zero, and the DRM means there's a very good chance of losing access to them at some point in the future (unless you remove it, obviously). Also, while consumers do take value into account, obviously, they expect resale prices to reflect production costs to some degree, I know I do. No printing / shipping / warehousing / shelf-space should result in a lower price.

Originally Posted by Fbone

If it makes you feel better, B&N has the pbook for $14.98.

I don't see how that helps prospective buyers of the ebook.

In any case, the ebook will almost always be pricier than the pbook if you count (as the OP did) all the used pbook prices.

Wasn't that a previous-edition new book? That said, yes, the ebooks do compete against the used MM paperbacks, obviously. There is really little excuse to charge that amount of money for a 40 year old book. A few bucks is fine, it saves me to go down to the church yard sale (or pay for shipping from Amazon). 13.99? I don't think so.

[rogue_librarian]

There are a bunch of sellers who offer a used copy of Watership Down for 1¢ (literally). Should the publishers set the ebook price at 0.5¢ to match?

No, but that (plus shipping!) is the price publishers must compete against. Or not, as the case may be.

[HansTWN]

Originally Posted by rogue_librarian

Also, while consumers do take value into account, obviously, they expect resale prices to reflect production costs to some degree, I know I do. No printing / shipping / warehousing / shelf-space should result in a lower price.

Even though I know pricing doesn't necessarily reflect costs, to be charged more for something that costs less to produce does make me feel like am being taken for a ride.

And knowing that this is only so because of price fixing (retailers are not allowed to set their own prices like they can for pbooks) is even worse.

At the very least it is very bad public relations. Let us hope Amazon will take them down, or at least reduce their influence to a level at which they have to be customer friendly.

[cromag]

Originally Posted by stonetools

...
Ebooks are as different from pbooks as are audiobooks from pbooks. Oddly enough, no one insists audiobooks MUST be less expensive than pbooks.

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

I wouldn't agree with this statement. An audiobook contains both the text of the book and a performance by the reader(s).

I've been listening to more audiobooks this year than I ever did before (for various reasons). Sometimes, the narrator adds to the story and sometimes they kill it! I don't particularly like the prices for audiobooks (and I rely heavily on the library for stories I'll likely only listen to once), but I understand there's another layer of costs involved in these.

Another difference, based solely on my observation, is that ebooks are rarely abridged and audiobook often (in my limited experience, almost always) are abridged. I go out of my way to find unabridged audio books and usually pay a hefty premium for the privilege.



Still, as much as I enjoy the ebook experience, mostly I just enjoy reading. If an ebook I want is much more than $5 I look for a paper copy. Used copies are fine, and I enjoy going to a local used book store more than I ever enjoyed going to the local Barnes and Noble.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by cromag

Another difference, based solely on my observation, is that ebooks are rarely abridged and audiobook often (in my limited experience, almost always) are abridged.

In these days of downloadable audiobooks, most books that are released as audiobooks are now available unabridged. The unabridged version is, however, normally considerably more expensive than the abridged version, which has always seemed odd to me. I would have thought that the cost of doing the abridging would cost far more than the additional recording expenses!