viewer: please add touch screen controls. It's a mess...

_novalis · 04-22-2020, 09:22 AM

Hi,

I am looking for a way to adjust the behaviour for the viewer on a windows tablet. Control by FINGERS.
So far I use a horizontal setup with two pages. Let's say page 1 and page two.
If I swipe left, the behavioir is like expected, page 3 and 4 for are shown. BUT of I only TAP on the right page (2), page 2 swipes over to the left and page 3 shows up on the right. So only half of the job is done, and I would always had to tap twice to accomplish the same as with a "swipe to the left".
A bug I assume.
Also I prefer to tap on the left page to go forward. Instead the default behaviour is to go backwards. Nothing to change that either...

Next thing, if I hold the finger on some word I would assume a selection and some markers to extend or shrink the selection. BUT instead you can only select one word max, if you are LUCKY. If happens that you move your finger just a tiny bit during you hold and try to select a word you have scrolled like 80 pages back or forward.
You HAVE TO use a mouse to select things.

The symbols for closing or enlarging) the windows (inspector, table of content, etc) are like almost two pixels x two pixels. Unusable for fingers.

In short: Although a good reader, for tablet users it is not a pleasure.
I wish there were some settings dialog to adjust those things.

OR is there a possibility. If not I'd really recommend putting them up in priority todo.

Many thanks.

kovidgoyal · 04-22-2020, 09:55 AM

no its not a bug. swipe changes screenfuls. tap changes by pages. you can setup tap on margins to change screenfuls if you like, in the viewer preferences under scrolling behavior.

And long taping selects a word. If you want to select more without a mouse, you will need to wait for annotations support coming in calibre 5.

As for the size of the dock window controls, they come from Qt. and cant really be changed.

_novalis · 04-22-2020, 10:41 AM

Sorry I don't get it.
The behaviour is maybe not a bug. But with all respect, for a touch screen it is a pain, and so annoying that I don't want to use it. I want a full screen turn on tap.
I think it would make sense to let the user decide how he likes his reader to behave regarding the page turning, etc. At least that is what I have learned from programming user friendly applications.
It also wouldn't be so difficult it this case.
But it is your decision, I accept that.

Tap on margins doesn't do anything for me btw.

kovidgoyal · 04-22-2020, 11:08 AM

Interesting, in the years the viewer has existed you are the first person to ask, no demand, tap to turn screens. And yet judging by your level of hyperbole, the viewer has no touch controls and is a complete mess. Refrain from that kind of hyperbole in the future if you want people to pay attention to you.

And here you go: https://github.com/kovidgoyal/calibr...7c0cf5ed287776

Quoth · 04-23-2020, 05:15 AM

The viewer is for Mac OS, Windows and Linux. Those are primarily WIMP GUI desktop/laptop OSes. The Win8 and Win10 hybridisation is a failure of design that reduces productivity for traditional applications and the TIFKAM (Metro) is a user fail, except on x86 tablets using only the "apps".

I gave away a 10" Win 10 tablet with keyboard dock, it was so bad. So I have a 10" Android tablet for random instant browsing and PDFs and laptop for content creation.

Unless you have a crippled Win10 tablet with no dock, then the normal page turn methods are far better than touch based taps.

_novalis · 04-23-2020, 08:00 AM

I respectfully disagree, with both of you.
I like my windows tablet, a Samsung Tabpro S. It is a complete success for my workflow. Using it as a lightweight travel computer with full Windows capabilities. Would never trade it against anything.
I also use a 8'' Android tablet with Moonreader as my prefered book reader.
More for fun I tried the calibre viewer, and you might take it as exaggeration, but for this device, a windows touch tablet, the easy of use is a mess. I don't wanna hurt your feelings, but it is what it is. In the end you can have a different opinion, but this is mine. And again, don't take it personal, it is just a critical view on a piece of sofware.
Regarding the design flaws of windows or a touch device or a tablet, or all these things in one: That's not the point here. I was just saying: By adding a few more options to the already extensive settings panel, problems can be solved easily. It adds value so to speak.
And I am saying, let the user decide how he wants his reader to behave, don't patronize him.
Again sorry for being so hyperbolic.

_novalis · 04-23-2020, 08:08 AM

and Kovid: I am really wondering that I am the first person that asks for tap to turn screens.
First, I think it is the most natural thing to have, and the easiest. Second, if I have two book pages on my horizontal screen, when I'm finished reading them and then tap... who wants to to only shift one page? You certainly want to have two fresh pages on the screen. Otherwise where would be the point in having double pages?
So I can't really imagine why anyone would prefer to tap twice to shift the two pages.

kovidgoyal · 04-23-2020, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _novalis

So I can't really imagine why anyone would prefer to tap twice to shift the two pages.

Yes, its a common failing of human beings, if they cannot imagine a use for something themselves, they believe there must be no use for it. And I dont know what you are still arguing about, since as I indicated in my last post, I already added the option just for you.

Uncle Robin · 04-23-2020, 08:21 AM

It almost saddens me to see such selfish, aggressive whiny demands getting so promptly fulfilled. There is a such a thing as TOO nice, Mr Goyal.

_novalis · 04-23-2020, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

Yes, its a common failing of human beings, if they cannot imagine a use for something themselves, they believe there must be no use for it. And I dont know what you are still arguing about, since as I indicated in my last post, I already added the option just for you.

Well thank you for doing that.

I don't really want to dive into the common failings of human beings, but I did not mean to question the nature of this ebook reader navigation in general. I am certainly not qualified and did't want to give the impression.
I just wanted to communicate that the navigation as implemented now, for touch screen tablets based on Windows, don't make sense.
I don't expect anything for myself though. And if you think that apart from myself nobody could profit then you'd better let it be.

_novalis · 04-23-2020, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Robin

It almost saddens me to see such selfish, aggressive whiny demands getting so promptly fulfilled. There is a such a thing as TOO nice, Mr Goyal.

I almost cried by being accused such a disgraceful and flagitious deed

DiapDealer · 04-23-2020, 10:47 AM

The level of passive-aggressiveness on display by the op of this thread is absolutely staggering.

I think what you meant to say was, "I was wondering if an option could be added?"
Followed by a "Thank you" post after it's implementation.

_novalis · 04-23-2020, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

The level of passive-aggressiveness on display by the op of this thread is absolutely staggering.

I think what you meant to say was, "I was wondering if an option could be added?"
Followed by a "Thank you" post after it's implementation.

yes exactly, thank you for helping out.

maybe I also wanted to say that as it is it's a mess [on windows based touch screen devices]

and that's basically the title of this topic

DiapDealer · 04-23-2020, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _novalis

maybe I also wanted to say that as it is it's a mess [on windows based touch screen devices]

And maybe you like hurting your chances of ever getting in any help from this community in the future, as well. Have a nice day.

compurandom · 04-23-2020, 11:21 AM

I would have complained about poor touch support in calibre except last time I complained I was told touchscreens were useless and would never be supported in calibre. To tell someone they are the first to complain about touchscreen support is just untrue and a bit rude.

So I've given up using it that way. It's not because I've not noticed problems in the interface, it's because there seems to be negative desire to fix the problems that are there. I've had to resort to other applications when I'm using my laptop that way.

If calibre had better touchscreen support, I'd probably use it more.

04-22-2020, 09:22 AM	#1
_novalis Member Posts: 11 Karma: 10 Join Date: Dec 2016 Device: win tablet	viewer: please add touch screen controls. It's a mess... Hi, I am looking for a way to adjust the behaviour for the viewer on a windows tablet. Control by FINGERS. So far I use a horizontal setup with two pages. Let's say page 1 and page two. If I swipe left, the behavioir is like expected, page 3 and 4 for are shown. BUT of I only TAP on the right page (2), page 2 swipes over to the left and page 3 shows up on the right. So only half of the job is done, and I would always had to tap twice to accomplish the same as with a "swipe to the left". A bug I assume. Also I prefer to tap on the left page to go forward. Instead the default behaviour is to go backwards. Nothing to change that either... Next thing, if I hold the finger on some word I would assume a selection and some markers to extend or shrink the selection. BUT instead you can only select one word max, if you are LUCKY. If happens that you move your finger just a tiny bit during you hold and try to select a word you have scrolled like 80 pages back or forward. You HAVE TO use a mouse to select things. The symbols for closing or enlarging) the windows (inspector, table of content, etc) are like almost two pixels x two pixels. Unusable for fingers. In short: Although a good reader, for tablet users it is not a pleasure. I wish there were some settings dialog to adjust those things. OR is there a possibility. If not I'd really recommend putting them up in priority todo. Many thanks.

04-23-2020, 10:47 AM	#12
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 28,568 Karma: 204127028 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	The level of passive-aggressiveness on display by the op of this thread is absolutely staggering. I think what you meant to say was, "I was wondering if an option could be added?" Followed by a "Thank you" post after it's implementation. Last edited by DiapDealer; 04-23-2020 at 10:49 AM.

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04-22-2020, 09:55 AM	#2
kovidgoyal creator of calibre Posts: 45,342 Karma: 27182818 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mumbai, India Device: Various	no its not a bug. swipe changes screenfuls. tap changes by pages. you can setup tap on margins to change screenfuls if you like, in the viewer preferences under scrolling behavior. And long taping selects a word. If you want to select more without a mouse, you will need to wait for annotations support coming in calibre 5. As for the size of the dock window controls, they come from Qt. and cant really be changed.

04-22-2020, 10:41 AM	#3
_novalis Member Posts: 11 Karma: 10 Join Date: Dec 2016 Device: win tablet	Sorry I don't get it. The behaviour is maybe not a bug. But with all respect, for a touch screen it is a pain, and so annoying that I don't want to use it. I want a full screen turn on tap. I think it would make sense to let the user decide how he likes his reader to behave regarding the page turning, etc. At least that is what I have learned from programming user friendly applications. It also wouldn't be so difficult it this case. But it is your decision, I accept that. Tap on margins doesn't do anything for me btw.

04-22-2020, 11:08 AM	#4
kovidgoyal creator of calibre Posts: 45,342 Karma: 27182818 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mumbai, India Device: Various	Interesting, in the years the viewer has existed you are the first person to ask, no demand, tap to turn screens. And yet judging by your level of hyperbole, the viewer has no touch controls and is a complete mess. Refrain from that kind of hyperbole in the future if you want people to pay attention to you. And here you go: https://github.com/kovidgoyal/calibr...7c0cf5ed287776

04-23-2020, 05:15 AM	#5
Quoth Still reading Posts: 14,010 Karma: 105092227 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper	The viewer is for Mac OS, Windows and Linux. Those are primarily WIMP GUI desktop/laptop OSes. The Win8 and Win10 hybridisation is a failure of design that reduces productivity for traditional applications and the TIFKAM (Metro) is a user fail, except on x86 tablets using only the "apps". I gave away a 10" Win 10 tablet with keyboard dock, it was so bad. So I have a 10" Android tablet for random instant browsing and PDFs and laptop for content creation. Unless you have a crippled Win10 tablet with no dock, then the normal page turn methods are far better than touch based taps.

04-23-2020, 08:00 AM	#6
_novalis Member Posts: 11 Karma: 10 Join Date: Dec 2016 Device: win tablet	I respectfully disagree, with both of you. I like my windows tablet, a Samsung Tabpro S. It is a complete success for my workflow. Using it as a lightweight travel computer with full Windows capabilities. Would never trade it against anything. I also use a 8'' Android tablet with Moonreader as my prefered book reader. More for fun I tried the calibre viewer, and you might take it as exaggeration, but for this device, a windows touch tablet, the easy of use is a mess. I don't wanna hurt your feelings, but it is what it is. In the end you can have a different opinion, but this is mine. And again, don't take it personal, it is just a critical view on a piece of sofware. Regarding the design flaws of windows or a touch device or a tablet, or all these things in one: That's not the point here. I was just saying: By adding a few more options to the already extensive settings panel, problems can be solved easily. It adds value so to speak. And I am saying, let the user decide how he wants his reader to behave, don't patronize him. Again sorry for being so hyperbolic.

04-23-2020, 08:08 AM	#7
_novalis Member Posts: 11 Karma: 10 Join Date: Dec 2016 Device: win tablet	and Kovid: I am really wondering that I am the first person that asks for tap to turn screens. First, I think it is the most natural thing to have, and the easiest. Second, if I have two book pages on my horizontal screen, when I'm finished reading them and then tap... who wants to to only shift one page? You certainly want to have two fresh pages on the screen. Otherwise where would be the point in having double pages? So I can't really imagine why anyone would prefer to tap twice to shift the two pages.

04-23-2020, 08:21 AM	#9
Uncle Robin Diligent dilettante Posts: 3,661 Karma: 52758936 Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: in my mind Device: Kobo Sage; Kobo Libra Colour	It almost saddens me to see such selfish, aggressive whiny demands getting so promptly fulfilled. There is a such a thing as TOO nice, Mr Goyal.

04-23-2020, 11:21 AM	#15
compurandom Wizard Posts: 1,012 Karma: 500000 Join Date: Jun 2015 Device: Rocketbook, kobo aura h2o, kobo forma, kobo libra color	I would have complained about poor touch support in calibre except last time I complained I was told touchscreens were useless and would never be supported in calibre. To tell someone they are the first to complain about touchscreen support is just untrue and a bit rude. So I've given up using it that way. It's not because I've not noticed problems in the interface, it's because there seems to be negative desire to fix the problems that are there. I've had to resort to other applications when I'm using my laptop that way. If calibre had better touchscreen support, I'd probably use it more.

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