Considering the Boox Max 3

[libriworm]

I read tons of PDFs of scientific papers and books, both digitally produced and scanned from hardcopy. So I'm looking for something to read them on more comfortably than my laptop.

My hard requirements are few -- (1) a huge screen (12.5"+), (2) a tablet form factor, (3) some sort of built-in light, and (4) the ability to load files directly to the device, whether via USB or Wifi (Sony's equivalent offering is gimped, as is most of their hardware, and requires you to use their software to transfer files to it.)

There are also a few features that would be nice, but aren't deal breakers. E-ink is a very big plus to me,. And of course a cover that functions as a stand to prop the thing up on tables, desks, etc.

And that's it, really. I do not want to use the device to write documents, check my e-mail or send messages. I do not want to use it to listen to audio books or music, nor to watch videos of any sort. In fact, I want as few distractions as possible from reading. And beyond highlighting text, I couldn't care less about note taking, drawing, or doing anything else but reading.

Unfortunately, there seems to be not a single device on the market that meets these criteria. The closest is the Onyx Boox Max3. But it has no light, which is a big downside for me. Plus, the Onyx cover appears to be crap -- I have not found a single picture of it in any position but flat, which makes me worry it can't fold and serve as a stand. The fact that Onyx separately sells what has to be the worlds clunkiest tablet stand (a massive chunk of machined aluminum and plastic) further leads me to believe that the cover is nothing but a rigid sheet to cover the screen.

But the thing is, Sony's equivalent device is utter garbage -- it can read just a single file format, it also has no front light, it can't do a damned thing without connecting to Sony's software on your PC (and I seriously suspect it's Windows only, and I use Linux), and most reviews of it call it slow and laggy.

And that seems to be about it for 12.5"+ e-readers.

Say it ain't so!

I'm also rather worried by the fact that there are virtually no independent reviews of the Boox Max 3. There are a handful of clearly promotional PR videos from the manufacturer, and another handful of very obvious corporate shills who film/write puff pieces that read like press releases, almost certainly for pay or free devices.

Finally, I'm worried by the series of bizarre situations that surround Onyx. No one seems to really know who the heck makes these devices (a Chinese company? a Russian company?). Customer service requests to one Boox company may be shuffled off to another one, which apparently turned domain squatting into a business. There are two incompatible branches of the firmware that no one can really explain. The devices seem to somewhat hastily localized versions of either Chinese or Russian products. Google refuses to certify these devices, and getting the Play Store to work often involves rather shifty hacking, sideloading an APK from pirate site or another.

So I'm honestly quite apprehensive about blowing $860 + maybe $50 for a case.

Thoughts? Alternatives to the Max 3 I may have missed that are at least 12.5"?

[libriworm]

Can someone at least tell me if the Boox Max 3's Boox-branded cover serves as a stand?

[whopper]

they are ok devices, not great.

the software is mediocre, I don't use what they offer but third party ones like librera. You cannot expect the support of a first class brand, but they are doing it better now than in the past. The good thing is that is android, so, until certain point you can choose how to use the device through apps instead of being locked into a proprietary software

the cover can be used as a stand, similar to surface or ipad

onyx is a chinese company.

As a device to browse sites or use like a monitor, it is a 2/10 compared to tablets.
As a device to read books or pdf's full page or 2 pages per screen, it's the best one available with eink.

it is a niche product with a high price, whatever the value you get from it is personal For me it was worth it.

[maxcol]

I bought a Max 2 Pro about 10 months ago, but in retrospective don't think it's worth the high price. Given the obvious limitations (no light, e-ink screen constraints) I was expecting high quality software and good support in exchange. Unfortunately Onyx delivers none of these.

The software is buggy and lacking crucial features (such as working with multiple open documents/notes). And the support is abysmal: Instead of addressing existing customers who have paid their best money for an expensive device, the company just goes and scatters its development resources in producing newer devices.

Personally I'm about to buy a 12.9'' Ipad Pro.

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by maxcol

Personally I'm about to buy a 12.9'' Ipad Pro.

Have fun in the sun!

[maxcol]

Originally Posted by ottischwenk

Have fun in the sun!

I know, that's one advantage of e-ink. But then, how often do I work or study in the sun? As it stands, the Ipad Pro compares to my Onyx Max 2 Pro as a car to a bicycle, only this bicycle costs almost as much as a car!

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by maxcol

I know, that's one advantage of e-ink. But then, how often do I work or study in the sun? As it stands, the Ipad Pro compares to my Onyx Max 2 Pro as a car to a bicycle, only this bicycle costs almost as much as a car!

I often work under headlight lighting and a tablet is also unusable - a car cannot be used on a Mountain Byke route.

[maxcol]

Originally Posted by ottischwenk

I often work under headlight lighting and a tablet is also unusable

Well, for those types of scenario I guess e-ink is indispensable and you are willing to pay any price. In my case, as the OP's, I mainly want to study and annotate technical/scientific material in my office or at home. If you add to the equation the myriad work/productivity/study/entertainment apps available on the Ipad and their high quality software & support, the price/value ratio I'm currently getting from the Max 2 Pro is preposterous. I'll just make sure in the future to triple-check what I'm investing my money into.

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by maxcol

Well, for those types of scenario I guess e-ink is indispensable and you are willing to pay any price.

Oh no!
13.3 is too big for me, I prefer illuminable A5 format. I also need an internally formatted 512 GB SD card and USB-C OTG, so no Onyx Boox device.

[Waiting4somethin]

Maybe it's worse on a 13.3 " but on my 10" ereader I just use a clip on light: I prefer the light shining onto the device rather than reflecting into my eyes. But I remember having this conversation before.

(Before the thread got deleted? I guess it was an unwelcome tangent.)

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by Waiting4somethin

Maybe it's worse on a 13.3 " but on my 10" ereader I just use a clip on light: I prefer the light shining onto the device rather than reflecting into my eyes.

But it is light from above!
And you see reflected light.
There is no difference to a lamp some distance away.

[Question Mark]

Originally Posted by Waiting4somethin

Maybe it's worse on a 13.3 " but on my 10" ereader I just use a clip on light: I prefer the light shining onto the device rather than reflecting into my eyes.

I had the original Note (my wife has it now) which didn't have a light. I used to sometimes use it with a clip on light when I was reading at night and didn't want to illuminate the entire room.

The problem I had was that I would have to periodically adjust the clip on light. It was difficult to get a nice even light over the entire surface. And then if I wanted to change the location of my hand while reading, the clip on light would sometimes be in the way. It also wasn't the most convenient setup when traveling.

I much prefer the Note Pro because of its frontlight. Unlike a backlight, it doesn't shine directly into one's eyes. Unlike a clip on light, it provides even lighting across the entire surface and I can freely move my hands when reading. It is also a breeze to use when traveling... And I can easily switch it off when I don't need it.

I think a frontlight on a 13" device would be great. However, from what I understand, there are some difficulties with providing even lighting across such a large surface with a frontlight. Too bad. Hopefully, they will eventually resolve this issue.

[ottischwenk]

I rarely read in the dark, mostly with ambient light. And then I only adjusted the light so bright that it was not noticeable but increased the contrast.

[Waiting4somethin]

@Question mark

Yeah the frontlight definitely has a lot of positives, however I find that it is still like shining a light into my eyes, be it reflected, or indirect, etc, I suppose that is why people want the warm light feature? If I turn a frontlight up to full brightness in a dark room for example, there is little difference between the frontlight and a torch. That is an extreme example, as one would usually use it very dimmed if they are in the dark, but it hopefully demonstrates the basic difference between the frontlight and cliplight. Even at low levels I still have that uncomfortable feeling after a while. That is from my recollection of using frontlights, anyway. I must admit it has been quite a while since I used one.

I know it's not perfect illumination but this is a great implementation of a light for me. Except I would have it coming out of the device itself rather than from the case.

[Waiting4somethin]

Originally Posted by libriworm

And that's it, really. I do not want to use the device to write documents, check my e-mail or send messages. I do not want to use it to listen to audio books or music, nor to watch videos of any sort. In fact, I want as few distractions as possible from reading. And beyond highlighting text, I couldn't care less about note taking, drawing, or doing anything else but reading.

I'm also rather worried by the fact that there are virtually no independent reviews of the Boox Max 3. There are a handful of clearly promotional PR videos from the manufacturer, and another handful of very obvious corporate shills who film/write puff pieces that read like press releases, almost certainly for pay or free devices.

I don't do exactly the same kind of reading so I don't know what you need. One difference about eink that is clear, is that you can't flick through the pages in quite the same fluid manner, something which would probably be a lot better on an ipad for example. I don't think max3 will have solved this problem. I could be wrong. But I would get a used max2.

As you say, videos (by onyx and goodereader) obscure the device flaws, since they are selling them. I was particularly disappointed with goodereader's video about the dasung monitor. It's one thing promoting, but quite another to smear the competition. But I haven't had a problem with "The Ebook Reader" videos in terms of basic reading features.