Reasons why NOT to exchange Sony PRS-650 for a Kindle

[capslock]

To begin with, I don't mean this to be a bashing thread. I just think it might be more worthwhile than starting a thread for reasons to get a Kindle.

So I have been using a Sony PRS-650 for about a week now and I have been, for the most part, satisfied with it. My decision to get it over a Kindle was based on a few things that seemed to justify the extra cost. The Sony, of course, has touch screen, better pdf display, is better built, and it doesn't have a big ugly keyboard taking up space.

However, the small screen size has been difficult to read off, and I overestimated the usefulness of the stylus. Given the small size, it has also been problematic to read while standing up on the subway/taking a bus. At this point, it appears that I'd be better off getting a Kindle.

I had the chance to run into someone with a Kindle and got the chance to test drive it. For one, it has a better grip (for subway purposes) and the screen size (for the $139) is adequate for my purposes; unlike with the Sony, I don't have to get really close to the screen or try to play around with the different display settings.

So given that the Kindle will save me about $100, I am inclined to get it; in addition to the reasons above, it also has offline wikipedia. So the case to me seems pretty clear.

But it would be helpful to hear some bad things about the Kindle, so as to better inform my decision. Are they fragile? Do they require a case as much as the Sony PRS-650? Am I going to be able to rename PDFs (this was a problem for using my Sony model, but I gather that's because I wasn't using Calibre)?

One reason why I avoided getting a Kindle, moreover, was because I heard you have to pay some amount to upload PDFs to it. Given that I'll primarily be using it to display PDFs that I upload to it (mainly math, technical pdfs), I wouldn't want to pay to upload some 300+ pdfs. But when I asked the person with the Kindle about this, he said he never had to pay anything to do this. So is this something that just applied to older models or something?

Beyond these concerns, I'd appreciate any other input. Thanks in advance.

[grooks]

Are you considering the Kindle 3 or the Kindle DX? I ask because you mentioned a few times about the Sony's small screen size but also mentioned that the Kindle is easier to hold. If comparing the Sony 650 and the Kindle 3, they have the same 6" screen and both use the latest e-ink pearl technology.

[capslock]

Originally Posted by grooks

Are you considering the Kindle 3 or the Kindle DX? I ask because you mentioned a few times about the Sony's small screen size but also mentioned that the Kindle is easier to hold. If comparing the Sony 650 and the Kindle 3, they have the same 6" screen and both use the latest e-ink pearl technology.

Hmm. He said he bought it for $139 on Amazon.

I saw that he had some 'Kindle DX user guide' pdf on his Kindle, so I asked him if his was the Kindle DX (which I know would have cost more than $139), but he said no. I take it I was being lied to?

If this is the case, that's pretty disappointing. I suppose I'd still consider making the transition to Kindle 3, given the $100 price different (+offline wikipedia), but it seems less likely now. I still would like to hear what people would have to say though.

Another question: I have heard that the Kindle has a 'backlit' screen of some sort, which makes it easier to read in the dark. But they do sell attachable lights, so it would be nice to have an idea about this.

[elcreative]

Pretty amazing thing to hear, like most things you "hear", absolute rubbish, eInk screens are reflective, they do NOT have backlights.

Originally Posted by capslock

Another question: I have heard that the Kindle has a 'backlit' screen of some sort, which makes it easier to read in the dark. But they do sell attachable lights, so it would be nice to have an idea about this.

[love2read1357]

None of the Kindles have back lighting. The DX and both K3's have the same Pearl EInk screen as the newer Sony's.

If the one you saw was about the size of a piece of notebook paper, it was DX. If it was smaller (like the size of the Sony 650, I think) it has the 6" screen.

When you buy a Kindle, you can set an email address in your Amazon Kindle account to send documents to your Kindle. It would be something like your username@kindle.com but if you live in the US you can also send the same documents to your username@free.kindle.com and you won't be charged. Although most people don't get charged no matter which one you use. I've never been charged anything but I don't use it as much as it sounds like you will.

Sending it that way is only to convert it to kindle format. But you can convert them in Calibre and then sideload documents free. Also I believe that as long as you send them to your Kindle email address and use a free WIFI network when you do it, it will be free.

The charge only applies sometimes when you are using 3G to do it.

The newer Kindles now have better support for PDF's so you may not have to convert them at all. You can also switch the screen to landscape and also zoom in.

I don't know how this compares to a Sony because I don't own one.

[SeaBookGuy]

Between the screen being large enough for you to notice, and the DX user guide, I am fairly certain he has the DX, but didn't recognize the term when you mentioned it. The K3's screen isn't any bigger than the 650.

I don't generally read books on mass transit as it's usually so noisy as to be distracting; I listen to an audiobook instead.

[wallcraft]

Originally Posted by capslock

One reason why I avoided getting a Kindle, moreover, was because I heard you have to pay some amount to upload PDFs to it. Given that I'll primarily be using it to display PDFs that I upload to it (mainly math, technical pdfs), I wouldn't want to pay to upload some 300+ pdfs. But when I asked the person with the Kindle about this, he said he never had to pay anything to do this. So is this something that just applied to older models or something?

If you upload ebooks to the Kindle using Whispernet (e-mail it to Amazon, Amazon sends it via wireless to the Kindle) then Amazon charges per MB. However, with the Kindle 3 you can specify WiFi download and this is free. On all Kindles, you can side-load via USB without involving Amazon at all.

The Sony and Kindle handles PDFs differently. Sony will "reflow" (convert to text and images) PDFs on a page by page basis. The Kindles don't do this, you always deal with a page as it would appear if printed (margins may be cropped). If a PDF is suitable for reflow, you can convert it to MOBI for the Kindle using either Calibre or by e-mail to Amazon (free if returned via e-mail or WiFi). Most technical PDFs won't reflow well, and you may be better off with the larger screen of the Kindle DX.

[catsknit]

Or, if you want the larger screen but prefer some of the Sony features, why not look at the Sony 950? not as large as the Kindle DX but it supposedly is better for technical pdfs from what I've read.

[kartu]

Both K3 and 650 have 6" (same size ) Pearl screen, yet 650 has "smaller screen", eh?

Are you actually talking about Sony PRS 350?

[stevshar]

Try increasing the font size
Reading while standing on public transport is no fun, public transport is no fun
going to work is no fun, go on the dole life is too short.

[elemenoP]

I actually love my 650 for reading standing up on a crowded subway. I can operate it one-handed, including page turns, which I couldn't do with a paperback.

OP: where do you live? Must be a metro area if you take the subway to work. So you probably have access to electronic LIBRARY BOOKS which is the reason I got the Sony over the Kindle.

eP

[bluerfoot]

Well just to chime in, I have had bad experience with my prs-350 in terms of using the toc on non sony books (my oreilly epubs cannot go to chapter headings) so big warning to anyone who does not just need to read novels in a linear fashion and who does not want to be stuck with the sony store. If you want to be locked in you may as well go with the better amazon store...

[grooks]

I almost never get ebooks from Sony and most of the ebooks I read have a linked TOC. This includes ePub and PDF books.

Is it possible the problem with your ebook is how it was created by O'Reilly?

[trekchick]

I used to have a Kindle 3 (and K2 and K1). I currently have a Kindle DX. I also own a Sony 350 and a Sony 950 and I've used the 650.

As other's have mentioned, the Kindle 3 and Sony Touch use identical screens.

Kindle does not have offline Wikipedia. It has integrated Wikipedia search, but you must have wifi signal to access it (or 3G if you have the $189 model).

The Kindle 3 does not have a backlight, but Amazon sells a lighted case. Amazon's lighted case is prettier than Sony's lighted case, but the illumination is sub-par (I regretted buying it).

K3 has the best PDF features of any Kindle, but it's still lacking compared to Sony. K3 displays the PDF's filename and the author from Metadata, if it can read the metadata Sometimes, the author is inexplicably blank, even when I can see the correct metadata in Inspector when using Preview my Mac. Sony displays the PDF's metadata. You can Google "Edit PDF Metadata" to find the tools to do that without converting the file.

K3 has 3 pre-set PDF zoom levels: 150%, 200%, 300% (or you can view full screen or full page). Sony has a user-selectable and lockable zoom, plus it has columnar page modes that are darn-near perfect for some of my PDFs. If altering the zoom or page mode doesn't work for you, the Sony can reflow the text, but Kindle doesn't support reflow.

You don't have to pay to load PDFs on your Kindle (you can just drag and drop them into Kindle's "Documents" folder via USB). If you want to deliver them over wifi, you can email them to your devicename@free.kindle.com account and they'll appear on your home screen as long as you're in a wifi area. If you send PDFs with a blank subject line, they'll be delivered as-is, if you put "convert" in the subject line, amazon will send you an .azw version of the file (the usual format problems with PDF conversion apply).

Flipping to landscape mode on Kindle or Sony gives you a petter view of the PDF's width, but on either device, there are intermittent issues (e.g. ghosting, repeating, cropping) with the lines which end and begin pages on the screen, but are part of a single page in the PDF file.

I actually like Kindle, so it's hard to say bad things about it (as the OP requested). But I can share some of it's shortcomings.

My biggest problem with PDFs on Kindle is that it doesn't support table of contents or document links. This is a huge PITA, especially for technical books, which are often accessed non-sequentially. In order to go to Chapter 4, you have to search for "Chapter 4" (and hope that it's not really "Chapter Four", or you'll have to search again.)

My second biggest problem with PDFs, specific to my DXg, is that it doesn't have K3's "advanced" PDF features: annotations, dictionary look-up, opening password-protected files (I cannot fathom why Amazon chooses to withhold these features from the only Kindle that can actually display a readable full-size PDF page).

I also get annoyed by Kindle's preset zoom levels. Sometimes 110% or 125% would be perfect, but those aren't options. Kindle does automatically crop the margins, but it can't crop headers/footers, and sometimes getting rid of those would make the difference between readable and un-readable. Also the way Kindle performs margin crops can be distracting; Kindle dynamically crops the outer whitespace on a page-by-page basis, so, a page with one short column will be shown at mega magnification, and the next page will look tiny in comparison.

If you're familiar with PDF creation. Amazon uses the entire Media Box and automatically crops from there. Sony displays the Crop Box, which means that I can manually crop PDFs on my computer and display that view on Sony, but Kindle ignores my alterations (or sometimes shows only blank pages, even though Sony displays the same file flawlessly).

I didn't mean to go on this long, so I'll quit here by stating that if PDF reading is your primary activity, then Kindle 3 is a poor choice. Sony Touch or Daily Edition are better options and the DX is also a good choice if you can work around not having a table of contents, annotations, or dictionary lookups (if Amazon updates the firmware to include those features, DX will be the best choice for PDF).

[bluerfoot]

Originally Posted by grooks

I almost never get ebooks from Sony and most of the ebooks I read have a linked TOC. This includes ePub and PDF books.

Is it possible the problem with your ebook is how it was created by O'Reilly?

I don't know I have contacted them. the issue is that it sees the chapter heading but since there are sections in the chapters I have to drill down (sometimes multiple levels) to get into the book. so there is a toc but it is useless...