[Greg Anos]

Steve, you're a professional wordsmith. As such, I have the expectation that you understand the emotional load of words and phrases, and that what you say is what you intend to say. So what do you make of the implications and connotations of your following recent phrases (made after I pointed out a new solar breakthrough) -

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

But these still don't take into account a wasteful lifestyle. We need to improve how we use (and not waste) energy and resources, and alter our perceptions of things like disposables, foods, packaging, transportation/commuting, work, play, etc.

To my reading, this is a request for the vast majority of people to restructure their lifes (and lifestyles). Did I read wrong? I (to me naturally) responded with the questions of how the need for this drastic set of changes was arrived at. I have had lots of people tell me how I should live my life in my lifetime, almost always with absolutely no knowledge of why I make my choices. I've gotten tired of it. The response -

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

You shouldn't need to ask "what is wasteful."

... examples ...

Most of these things are common-sense choices, and you shouldn't have to ask someone else for "definitions." Usually, it just requires some thought, maybe after someone else has pointed it out to you, and the waste becomes crystal clear.

That response was, to me, a condesending pat on the head. If only I was a little brighter, I would think just like you. After all, "common sense" was the choices you made and were suggesting that everybody do. (Which was what you were suggesting in the first quote.) Was this your intention? If not why was if phrased the the manner you did? Rather that complain about the (implied) sneer, I decided to provide a counter-point for each of your examples, thereby showing that - 1. I was bright enough to conterpoint you claims. and 2. Those claims weren't as "common sense" as you were making them out to be. The response -

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

... counter point to my counter point (fair and reasonable) ....

At any rate, as I said, most conservation and wasteful practices are easy to recognize. We've just become pre-programmed by media and government to not think about them, to embrace and even celebrate the ease at which we can toss the nastiest things into the nearest trash can and thereby forget they ever existed.

That mindset is still prevalent in the American culture, and it's high time to get it out of there.

You know, the phrase "it's high time to ..." has had the connotation of a call to action, and has been for hundreds of years. Once again, I'm forced to assume that you know what you are implying with your words. In this case, we'll make the masses stop wasting. Well, you don't have that right, and somebody needed to sharply remind you of that. Hence my Ubermensch comment. It had an oversized effect, leading to the following response set -

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

Pay close attention to this: They are not my standards. Stop acting like I'm the Great Dictator, ordering everyone to do whatever asinine thing comes into my head because my bubble-headed mistress thinks it's a cute thing to do. It's a Texan in office, not me.

Well, who used the phrase "it's high time to...", who suggested that the american lifestyle need to be rebuilt, and who think that the choices are "common sense" and crystal clear. If these are not your standards, why did you espouse them? I think that's a fair question.

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

I'm telling you how you can conserve resources. And I'm telling you that it's not that frickin' hard. That's all.

And none of the rest of us don't know this already? Besides, your previous comments weren't just limited to telling us how easy it is to conserve. See your previous comments.

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

But hey... it's a God-given American tradition to be free to do whatever you want, regardless of its value or sense, so go ahead and be a typical American. It's Standard American Procedure to sit back and say, "Leave it alone, and it'll fix itself," so be my guest.

Correct. So why have you been suggesting that the American lifestyle must change in the posting thread?

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

You want to insult me, and blow off my logical refutations of your points? Fine. Continue to be in classic denial, waste energy, waste resources, and act superior beause no one can tell you what you can't throw away. I'm not at your front door stopping you, am I?.

My point was to show that there was no "crystal clear" choices. I succeeded in that point. I wasn't interested in a tit-for-tat over individual ideas, just to show that for every idea, there were reasons, pro and con, for decision making. As far as insulting you - guilty! I was rapping your teeth in the fact
that if you want to force your viewpoint down other people's throats, you are going to look arthoritarian. That seems to hit a real nerve with you.

Classic denial... <shrug> I make different choices than your do. That doesn't make me superior or inferior to you. If I work, and get paid for my labors, why can't I spend it as I see fit? If I waste things, I get less for my money. I pay for it by having less. One man's waste is another man's efficent use of resources. Which is cheaper (i.e. more efficent use of monetary resources), living in NYC using public transport, or driving in DFW? Yes, I use more gas. My cost of housing is 1/4 the amount in DFW than in NYC. So who's being more wasteful of money? If the cost of gas exceeded the housing differential, the I might go live in NYC. But that's a long ways away....