Amazon uses DMCA to restrict where you can buy e-books

Alexander Turcic · 03-12-2009, 11:30 AM

As some of you may already know, this week we received a DMCA take-down notice from Amazon requesting the removal of the tool kindlepid.py and instructions associated with it. Although we never hosted this tool (contrary to their claim), nor believe that this tool is used to remove technological measures (contrary to their claim), we decided, due to the vagueness of the DMCA law and our intention to remain in good relation with Amazon, to voluntarily follow their request and remove links and detailed instructions related to it.

A quick backgrounder: kindlepid.py is a small Python script allowing you to derive a Mobipocket-compatible personal identifier (PID) for your Kindle reader. This PID in itself has nothing at all to do with reading any copyrighted content. It is only used to make legitimate e-book purchases at stores other than Amazon's.

We believe in the freedom of speech and we encourage you to continue expressing your views and thoughts on tools like kindlepid.py. We only ask you not to provide any how-to instructions, source codes and/or links for obtaining kindlepid.py.

We would like to remind you to apply common sense when using the private message system, and not to use it for sharing information how to obtain or use kindlepid.py. We stress that we respect your privacy and that we do not monitor private messages.

Lastly, I would like to ask you for assistance and to contact us - using the report post feature for example - should you detect content that might not follow the guideline above.

Thank you for your understanding!

Alexander

Nate the great · 03-12-2009, 11:38 AM

Even though our servers are in Canada, and the site owner is in Switzerland, we still removed the material.

CCDMan · 03-12-2009, 11:43 AM

I am amazed at how companies think they can keep folks from finding this kind of information by issuing takedowns. Legal or illegal, trying to stamp out anything that can be placed on the web is like playing bop-a-mole. Apparently no one at Amazon has ever used Google.

What is even more stupid about this is that the actual content under discussion is all quite legal. Only Amazon has any potential to suffer and very little at that. It is interesting that they do not complain about NON DRM books that are available in mobi. like public domain and BAEN.

This would seem to encourage other providers to enable their books on other devices wherever possible or come out with their own device (in fact, more rumors of an Apple device as of yesterday). Pretty shortsighted, as I am sure time will tell....

zelda_pinwheel · 03-12-2009, 11:44 AM

i think it's particularly ironic that they should attack MobileRead the same week that we gave away a free Kindle in a contest.

DixieGal · 03-12-2009, 11:45 AM

That is very rude of Amazon. I'm disappointed in them.

JSWolf · 03-12-2009, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate the great

Even though our servers are in Canada, and the site owner is in Switzerland, we still removed the material.

I feel they are so wrong. What this script does is make the Kindle more useful. With Amazon using the DMCA to get rid of this, they are alienating their customers and causing prospective customers to purchase a different device. I know I wanted to win a K2. But because of what Amazon has done, I'd be selling the K2 had I won and saving the money to purchase a new reader with a larger screen.

Sorry Amazon, but what you are doing leaves a bad taste.

Flub · 03-12-2009, 11:51 AM

The funny part is that many people like me will never have even heard of the script until Amazon made a fuss about it. I found it with a simple google search. Same with how-to instructions.

Is that really what you wanted Amazon? (not that it makes any difference in my case. You can't even download the iPhone app in the UK).

Gaurnim · 03-12-2009, 11:52 AM

Well, they are only doing the most part of their business on the Web, why should we expect them to understand the Web, after all ....

JSWolf · 03-12-2009, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaurnim

Well, they are only a big web store, why should we expect them to understand the Web, after all ....

But we should hope they'd care about their customers.

Jeff, if you are reading this, way to go! You've just given Amazon a black eye and your reputation has gone down the toilet. Well done!

lilac_jive · 03-12-2009, 11:55 AM

Is it ok if someone tells me what this tool did? I'm a little confused.

edit* nevermind, missed the explanation

cvkemp · 03-12-2009, 11:55 AM

This is the reason that I did not buy the Kindle. I did not want to be tied to the mother ship. I love my freedom to pick where I get my books and what firmware I use.
chuck

AnemicOak · 03-12-2009, 11:56 AM

Doesn't Mobi Desktop 6.0 do the same thing? IIRC it did, at least for the K1.

RobbieClarken · 03-12-2009, 12:02 PM

Thanks for the explanation Alexander. I'm glad that MobileRead can still be a place to learn about great tools like kindlepid.py that empower ebook readers and force competition on companies that would rather restrict their customers' options. This attempt to suppress speech will only imply people must perform a google search to find the extra information they need. You wouldn't expect imposing this minor inconvenience is worth the damage to Amazon's reputation that they will receive from bullying a forum that has brought them numerous customers.

JSWolf · 03-12-2009, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnemicOak

Doesn't Mobi Desktop 6.0 do the same thing? IIRC it did, at least for the K1.

Mobipocket Desktop 6.0 did indeed give the PID for the K1. But without kindlefix.py, you cannot shift Mobipocket eBooks to Kindle eBooks. So even if you could get the K1's PID inserted into a Mobipocket eBook, the K1 will not display it without changing the document identifier. And this change is what Amazon is upset about.

So basically the message I am getting from Amazon is....
You bought a Kindle, now we own your *ss.

Alexander Turcic · 03-12-2009, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Mobipocket Desktop 6.0 did indeed give the PID for the K1. But without kindlefix.py, you cannot shift Mobipocket eBooks to Kindle eBooks.

Exactly. And they only pointed at kindlepid.py in the notice.

03-12-2009, 11:30 AM	#1
Alexander Turcic Fully Converged Posts: 12,179 Karma: 68037 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Switzerland Device: Sony Portable Reader	Amazon uses DMCA to restrict where you can buy e-books As some of you may already know, this week we received a DMCA take-down notice from Amazon requesting the removal of the tool kindlepid.py and instructions associated with it. Although we never hosted this tool (contrary to their claim), nor believe that this tool is used to remove technological measures (contrary to their claim), we decided, due to the vagueness of the DMCA law and our intention to remain in good relation with Amazon, to voluntarily follow their request and remove links and detailed instructions related to it. A quick backgrounder: kindlepid.py is a small Python script allowing you to derive a Mobipocket-compatible personal identifier (PID) for your Kindle reader. This PID in itself has nothing at all to do with reading any copyrighted content. It is only used to make legitimate e-book purchases at stores other than Amazon's. We believe in the freedom of speech and we encourage you to continue expressing your views and thoughts on tools like kindlepid.py. We only ask you not to provide any how-to instructions, source codes and/or links for obtaining kindlepid.py. We would like to remind you to apply common sense when using the private message system, and not to use it for sharing information how to obtain or use kindlepid.py. We stress that we respect your privacy and that we do not monitor private messages. Lastly, I would like to ask you for assistance and to contact us - using the report post feature for example - should you detect content that might not follow the guideline above. Thank you for your understanding! Alexander Attached Thumbnails Last edited by Alexander Turcic; 03-13-2009 at 11:03 AM. Reason: notice added

03-12-2009, 11:43 AM	#3
CCDMan Skeptic Posts: 274 Karma: 541 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: USA Device: PRS-500, Kindle 1, iPod Touch, Kindle 2	I am amazed at how companies think they can keep folks from finding this kind of information by issuing takedowns. Legal or illegal, trying to stamp out anything that can be placed on the web is like playing bop-a-mole. Apparently no one at Amazon has ever used Google. What is even more stupid about this is that the actual content under discussion is all quite legal. Only Amazon has any potential to suffer and very little at that. It is interesting that they do not complain about NON DRM books that are available in mobi. like public domain and BAEN. This would seem to encourage other providers to enable their books on other devices wherever possible or come out with their own device (in fact, more rumors of an Apple device as of yesterday). Pretty shortsighted, as I am sure time will tell.... __________________ For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. - H. L. Mencken Last edited by CCDMan; 03-12-2009 at 01:00 PM.

03-12-2009, 11:44 AM	#4
zelda_pinwheel WWHALD Posts: 22,804 Karma: 86880 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Paris, France Device: ebookwise 1150	i think it's particularly ironic that they should attack MobileRead the same week that we gave away a free Kindle in a contest. __________________ I don't want none of that mischief on my eels! - pdurrant Hurricane Zelda of the Amazing Raining Frogs Join Adorable Madness -.-- --- ..- / -.-. .- -. -. --- - / .-. . ... .. ... - / - .... . / ..- -. ..- - - . .-. .- -... .-.. . / ... .. .-.. .-.. .. -. . ... ... "Resistance is futile, y'all." --DixieBorg by popular demand, we bring you the next exciting avatar in zelda's wardrobe, by the inimitable WetDogEared and his amazing dancing mice !! a round of applause, everybody !

03-12-2009, 11:45 AM	#5
DixieGal Hi There! Posts: 4,778 Karma: 36154 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: B'ham, AL Device: EBW1150, PC, Sony PRS-505	That is very rude of Amazon. I'm disappointed in them. __________________ "... I'd much rather help out at a candy store or ice cream parlor. I like it when sugar is commonplace..." Taken out of context from Jeff Inlo's Soul View* (See Writer's Corner)*

03-12-2009, 11:52 AM	#8
Gaurnim Guru Posts: 610 Karma: 1505 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Lyon, France Device: Cybook, Palm T5	Well, they are only doing the most part of their business on the Web, why should we expect them to understand the Web, after all .... Last edited by Gaurnim; 03-12-2009 at 12:04 PM.

03-12-2009, 11:38 AM	#2
Nate the great Sir Penguin of Edinburgh Posts: 7,285 Karma: 48386 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Northern Virginia Device: Airpanel 100, Jornada 720, Kindle, Smart Q7, Zelda has Sony 600 & 700	Even though our servers are in Canada, and the site owner is in Switzerland, we still removed the material.

03-12-2009, 11:51 AM	#7
Flub Connoisseur Posts: 99 Karma: 83 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: United Kingdom Device: iPhone, PRS-505	The funny part is that many people like me will never have even heard of the script until Amazon made a fuss about it. I found it with a simple google search. Same with how-to instructions. Is that really what you wanted Amazon? (not that it makes any difference in my case. You can't even download the iPhone app in the UK).

03-12-2009, 11:55 AM	#10
lilac_jive Wizard Posts: 4,698 Karma: 12637 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pennsylvania Device: PRS-505	Is it ok if someone tells me what this tool did? I'm a little confused. edit* nevermind, missed the explanation __________________ Ridiculous Goal: Attempt to read a majority of the books in the book 1001 Books to Read Before You Die Total Read: 33 Here's the whole list: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...8Z7g40xfEpiWKw Check out the MobileRead group on GoodReads and see what everyone else is reading! http://www.goodreads.com/group/show/15019.MobileRead

03-12-2009, 11:55 AM	#11
cvkemp Feeling My Age Posts: 225 Karma: 22 Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Hutto, Texas Device: EZ Reader, Dell Mini 10V	This is the reason that I did not buy the Kindle. I did not want to be tied to the mother ship. I love my freedom to pick where I get my books and what firmware I use. chuck

03-12-2009, 11:56 AM	#12
AnemicOak Bookaholic Posts: 2,517 Karma: 5683 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Minnesota Device: Opus / Kindle 2 / Sony 505 / HTC Hero (Android Phone)	Doesn't Mobi Desktop 6.0 do the same thing? IIRC it did, at least for the K1. __________________ ~Brian "The test of any good fiction is that you should care something for the characters; the good to succeed, the bad to fail. The trouble with most fiction is that you want them all to land in hell, together, as quickly as possible." - Mark Twain

03-12-2009, 12:02 PM	#13
RobbieClarken ... formerly epiphany Posts: 325 Karma: 1252 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Australia Device: iRex DR1000S, iPod Touch 2G, iPhone 3GS	Thanks for the explanation Alexander. I'm glad that MobileRead can still be a place to learn about great tools like kindlepid.py that empower ebook readers and force competition on companies that would rather restrict their customers' options. This attempt to suppress speech will only imply people must perform a google search to find the extra information they need. You wouldn't expect imposing this minor inconvenience is worth the damage to Amazon's reputation that they will receive from bullying a forum that has brought them numerous customers. __________________ Currently reading: Create Your Own Economy by Tyler Cowen, Thinking and Deciding by Jonathan Baron, The Myth of the Rational Market by Justin Fox Books I've read in 2009: The Addict by Michael Stein, Faust in Copenhagen by Gino Segre, Blue Shoes and Happiness by Alexander McCall Smith, The Lightness of Being by Frank Wilczek, Animal Farm by George Orwell, The Cat Who... Went Underground/Talked to Ghosts/Lived High/Knew a Cardinal/Moved a Mountain/Wasn't There by Lilian Jackson Braun

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