E-paper readability

[JohnDae]

Originally Posted by rkomar

Paper and electronic displays are different things, each with advantages and disadvantages. I don't see the need to try to force electronic displays to look exactly like paper, just for aesthetic purposes. Let each do what it does best.

I think it's called e-paper and e-ink because it wants to mimic ink on paper. Why is this? Ink on paper in books looks like what it does because it has been found to be good for reading. Contrast is one the key properties. I'd argue also that so is lack of glare which is why book paper is rough and diffuse.

[Sarmat89]

The main problem with E-ink legibility is bad black color and glare. The ink is at best deeply dark gray, and it is even worse when the ambient light glares off from the glass.
The minor problem is that the screen is always charged and attracting dust.

[SteveEisenberg]

Originally Posted by rcentros

But I don't feel like I'm missing much as book lights and lighted cases fill in nicely (when reading in dim light) for me.

For reading in bed, my wife and I use these:

https://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/70386305/

To me, eInk's ability to adjust to the desired font size makes up for the readability problems mentioned in this thread.

Originally Posted by patrik

When you read a book, the page is typically curved. When you read on an e-reader, you have perfect angle to the page, all the time.

This is especially true as compared with re-bound library books where some of the paper, next to the binding, has been lost.

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by JohnDae

I think it's called e-paper and e-ink because it wants to mimic ink on paper. Why is this? Ink on paper in books looks like what it does because it has been found to be good for reading. Contrast is one the key properties. I'd argue also that so is lack of glare which is why book paper is rough and diffuse.

Marketing has its own reasons for naming products which often has little to do with the latter's properties. They simply want to sell the most product possible. Expecting e-ink displays to be able to mimic ink and paper perfectly based on marketing is asking for trouble. Perhaps they just meant the name to mean that it will replace ink and paper, not mimic it.

I also think you are idealizing paper plus ink, and expecting e-ink to live up to that. Some papers are glossy, some are matte. Some are fine, some are rough. Some change colour over time, affecting contrast. I have paperbacks where the contrast and the font roughness are way worse than on current e-ink. I can still comfortably read both, so I don't let it bother me.

[HLS]

How are you getting glare on an eink display?

[JohnDae]

Originally Posted by kcladyz

How are you getting glare on an eink display?

I`m writing this on an e-reader and the daylight is shining in through window curtains. If I turn the device so that the windows directly reflect to me I will see their semi blurred reflections glaring on the screen.

If I pick up a book and do the same thing there is zero amount of distracting glare. The whole page just gets a bit lighter. This is because the paper is more diffuse surface and has has less specular reflection.

Compared to my anti-glare coated laptop the glare is about as blurred but much less in intensity so better.

Also, the paper looks natural white made little brownish by age at the edges and e-paper looks gray next to it. In this light it would ideally be whiter for a better contrast.

Again, not the end of the world, this is very cool and usable tech but I do hope that if I pick up a new e-reader in distant future it would have even better readability.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by JohnDae

I`m writing this on an e-reader and the daylight is shining in through window curtains. If I turn the device so that the windows directly reflect to me I will see their semi blurred reflections glaring on the screen.

Do you use the frontlight? I find that leaving it on at all times makes the screen appear whiter. Also, the brighter the room you are reading in, the higher they recommend you set the front light (though I don't typically bother with that).

I find this works for me, though I'm sure it doesn't work for all.

Ebook plusses outweigh minuses for me (generally lower price, easier to store, adjustable fonts) though I don't begrudge anyone who disagrees.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by JohnDae

I'd argue also that so is lack of glare which is why book paper is rough and diffuse.

The paper is rough and diffuse because it's cheaper. It also has a short life span compared to higher quality papers. Some books are printed on higher quality glossy paper (high kaolin content) as are quite a few magazines though using higher quality paper carries a weight and cost penalty.

Personally, the ability to carry a large number of books, the builtin frontlight and ability to adjust font size makes my ereader a far better choice compared to a dead tree book. What use is a higher contrast but unreadable page?

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by JohnDae

I`m writing this on an e-reader and the daylight is shining in through window curtains. If I turn the device so that the windows directly reflect to me I will see their semi blurred reflections glaring on the screen.

If I pick up a book and do the same thing there is zero amount of distracting glare. The whole page just gets a bit lighter. This is because the paper is more diffuse surface and has has less specular reflection. ...

I don't have that kind of trouble with my eReaders (or maybe I'm just not as discerning). It might be an issue with the light layer. The only eReader I have that is front-lit is my Nook Simple Touch with Glowlight, and it's too murky to comfortably read without turning on the front light. (Actually, even with the light on, it's not comfortable on my eyes after about a half an hour.) I don't know where you live, but if you're in the United States, you can pick up an older, non-front-lit eReader for about $20 and test to see if the light layer is the issue.

[4691mls]

Originally Posted by rcentros

I don't have that kind of trouble with my eReaders (or maybe I'm just not as discerning). It might be an issue with the light layer. The only eReader I have that is front-lit is my Nook Simple Touch with Glowlight, and it's too murky to comfortably read without turning on the front light. (Actually, even with the light on, it's not comfortable on my eyes after about a half an hour.) I don't know where you live, but if you're in the United States, you can pick up an older, non-front-lit eReader for about $20 and test to see if the light layer is the issue.

If my non-lighted Sony reader is angled wrong toward a light source (window, lamp, etc.) there will be a glare. I find it most noticeable if there is a light directly overhead.

[Marinolino]

Originally Posted by 4691mls

If my non-lighted Sony reader is angled wrong toward a light source (window, lamp, etc.) there will be a glare. I find it most noticeable if there is a light directly overhead.

I usually use ultra matte anti-glare screen protectors on my bigger tablets and also for the bigger (glossy) e-ink readers with additional layers (frontlight, capacitive, touch)

Backlight/Frontlight is always reduced as much as possible e.g. usually at about 20-30 % indoors and 40-50 % outdoors, usually using homemade paper sunshades with tablets for the sunny conditions abroad or darker blankets over the ropes for the shade in the garden, on the balcony etc.

[4691mls]

I don't generally find it to be a problem, usually holding the reader at a slightly different angle takes care of the glare.

I don't expect e-ink to exactly duplicate the experience of reading a paper book. I do enjoy having the ability to obtain books from the library and bookstores from the comfort of my home, and the ability to change the font size and style.

[JohnDae]

Originally Posted by DNSB

The paper is rough and diffuse because it's cheaper. It also has a short life span compared to higher quality papers. Some books are printed on higher quality glossy paper (high kaolin content) as are quite a few magazines though using higher quality paper carries a weight and cost penalty.

Reading paper is generally diffuse because its excellent for the purpose due to the fact that it doesn't suffer from glare unlike glossy paper.

Here's an article from "Steve's Digicams" that talks about matte vs glossy paper:

"Matte paper is excellent for displaying photos such as large panoramas that must be displayed "naked" (not behind plastic/glass) in an environment where light reflections can be an issue. Since you don't get any glare at all from matte papers, matte paper is a good choice for displaying a 4 foot panorama in a camera store under mixed lighting especially where the prints are displayed high on a wall and reflections from overhead lights can be a real issue."

"Glossy papers generally offer the widest color range and best resolution, but they suffer from glare which can be a problem under certain lighting conditions."

Since E-readers are appreciated in wide variety of lighting situations one generally wants them glare free. That's why they apply anti-glare coating for E-ink displays. The end result today is just not as glare free as matte paper but reading experience would be improved if it was. It is still very usable as is. My old reflective LCD reader glares a ton more and mostly because of that is very hard to use without its frontlight.

[JohnDae]

Originally Posted by rcentros

I don't have that kind of trouble with my eReaders (or maybe I'm just not as discerning). It might be an issue with the light layer. The only eReader I have that is front-lit is my Nook Simple Touch with Glowlight, and it's too murky to comfortably read without turning on the front light. (Actually, even with the light on, it's not comfortable on my eyes after about a half an hour.) I don't know where you live, but if you're in the United States, you can pick up an older, non-front-lit eReader for about $20 and test to see if the light layer is the issue.

To be fair, the device I have looks very sharp. I tested a lower end and older front lit version and that was murky in comparison. The light guide layers might have improved since your front lit device. Still, such layer can only degrade clarity. Assuming this device has one, it would be curious to see how it would look without it.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by JohnDae

Reading paper is generally diffuse because its excellent for the purpose due to the fact that it doesn't suffer from glare unlike glossy paper.

I prefer my opinion which is tempered by years in an industry that used a lot of paper that the driving factor was and is price well ahead of any other consideration. Another consideration is that with paper books, the ink is part of the top layer while in an eInk display, the image is behind one or more layers.

Originally Posted by JohnDae

Since E-readers are appreciated in wide variety of lighting situations one generally wants them glare free. That's why they apply anti-glare coating for E-ink displays. The end result today is just not as glare free as matte paper but reading experience would be improved if it was. It is still very usable as is. My old reflective LCD reader glares a ton more and mostly because of that is very hard to use without its frontlight.

I can sit on a bench in bright sunlight and use my ereader collection while my Nexus 7 tablet or iPad Pro are pretty much unusable unless I hold them at weird angles so I'm not looking at what amounts to a glossy mirror.