Kindle eBooks will have PUBLIC Warnings for spelling/formatting errors!

[Cinisajoy]

I don't think many readers are going to complain about 1 little typo unless that typo is repeated throughout the book, "die" for "the" comes to mind.
I think Amazon is looking for things like formatting and a bunch of errors.
Other thought, if one makes their living through Amazon, why would one ignore an email from Amazon?

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

I don't think many readers are going to complain about 1 little typo unless that typo is repeated throughout the book, "die" for "the" comes to mind.
I think Amazon is looking for things like formatting and a bunch of errors.
Other thought, if one makes their living through Amazon, why would one ignore an email from Amazon?

Exactly.

Hitch

[Catlady]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Indeed, which is why Amazon has specifically stated that they will only occur for VALIDATED errors.

So Amazon is going to be the grammar police? Don't get me wrong, I'm all for grammar police, but only if the people who are wielding the billy clubs know what they're doing. Will the Amazon functionaries really know what they're doing? Or will they just assume that if they get 20 complaints about the same thing, it must be an error--even if it really isn't.

All in, I expect that this won't be abused BY AMAZON. I seriously doubt that they'll Scarlet Letter a book for 3 typos, or even 5. I would tend to think that they are targeting the worst offenders; illiterate grammar and egregious amounts of typos, and horrible formatting. That's my take, FWIW.

Then why doesn't Amazon do some basic checking of formatting before offering the book for sale, or require the author to verify that the book was proofread, or something along these lines up front, not after the book has been inflicted on an unsuspecting public? The goal of this new policy may be worthwhile, but it seems like a backwards way to go about it.

[Cinisajoy]

Something just dawned on me.
Looks like Amazon is a threat to the freedom of expression since customers will now be warned about bad books.
@Catlady, why are you so worried? Do you write books that are unreadable?

Now to answer your question, why should Amazon pay big money to vet books?
It is up to the author/publisher to put out the best book they can. I used to assume that if one wrote a book, that one could actually read on a high school level. Or at least junior high.
I also assumed most writers were somewhat professional and knew this was a business.
(Hitch, you can quit laughing or crying at my assumptions now.)
Too bad I was very highly mistaken.

At least now us readers will be warned if we are about to buy house worms with depression or a herd of staffs greeted me warmly at the hotel.
Those were two books that either needed fixed or a warning.
I am looking forward to this.

Oh and Catlady, there are a ton and a half of "proofreaders" on fivver.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Catlady

So Amazon is going to be the grammar police? Don't get me wrong, I'm all for grammar police, but only if the people who are wielding the billy clubs know what they're doing. Will the Amazon functionaries really know what they're doing? Or will they just assume that if they get 20 complaints about the same thing, it must be an error--even if it really isn't.

Well...unless the readers in question have taken on reading your man Joyce, in which case, incomprehension is only to be expected, perhaps an author that gets this many complaints about a single element needs to think about it. Remember--again, the caveat is, from what I've seen myself--Amazon's quite precise about the errata. To the extent of "word X on line X at location YYY." I think if I published a book and received 20 complaints about the same specific thing--I'd think about it. I would.

I've seen one implementation of this new program thus far. A poster over at the KDP says she's received one of the Scarlet-letter letters. (We need a different name). Now, it's almost exactly like the old KQN notices, listing the specific problems, and she doesn't claim that they are not mistakes, mind you. However, in this email, they mention that this is the 3rd time that they've emailed her, and she hasn't made the corrections. So, of course, NOW, she's decided to fix it, as she doesn't want the Notice on her sales page.

However, clearly, she could have written back to them and made any argument she wished, about the text, were it valid or deliberate.

Obviously, I can't speak as to the quality of those people who will be making the judgement calls--at least, not at the first tier. I would assume--famous last assumptions--that there's a next-tier of people who will deal with escalated complaints, should the publisher reply that it's NOT a mistake.

We can but wait and see. It's not like they're going to undo it now. No matter how many people bitch about it.

Then why doesn't Amazon do some basic checking of formatting before offering the book for sale, or require the author to verify that the book was proofread, or something along these lines up front, not after the book has been inflicted on an unsuspecting public? The goal of this new policy may be worthwhile, but it seems like a backwards way to go about it.

Honestly, I think that's a hopeless idea. Why on earth aren't they doing that NOW? The publishers, I mean. Why aren't they putting out the BEST formatted and edited book NOW? It boggles me that we are saying that Amazon should now--at THEIR EXPENSE--implement yet another screening mechanism? We all agree that it has to be done by humans. Isn't Amazon already spending a fortune, doing work that they never expected to do, to enable and perpetuate self-publishing? They've created all these mechanized pieces of software, allowing nitwits to upload a Word file, instead of a MOBI or ePUB; ditto for FXL books, ditto for Textbooks--sheesh, now we think that they should do MORE? Can you imagine what it would take to proof or check two MILLION books?

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

Something just dawned on me.
Looks like Amazon is a threat to the freedom of expression since customers will now be warned about bad books.

It's not a threat to the First Amendment. The authors still have the right to say or write whatever they want. What they don't have the right to do is sell it in Amazon's Sandbox. They can sell it at Smashwords; they can sell it at Scribd; they can give it away. Nobody is muzzled.

Now to answer your question, why should Amazon pay big money to vet books?
It is up to the author/publisher to put out the best book they can. I used to assume that if one wrote a book, that one could actually read on a high school level. Or at least junior high.
I also assumed most writers were somewhat professional and knew this was a business.
(Hitch, you can quit laughing or crying at my assumptions now.)

Actually, at this point, I'm gasping for air, with tears running down my face from laughing so hard. Wait, wait, while I find an inhaler here somewhere....

Too bad I was very highly mistaken.

Y'know...many are professional and dedicated. Unfortunately, more are not. And--sadly--many actually THINK that they are, and don't truly understand how awful their books are. Or how bad the "editing" that they had done is; or that they really oughtn't have asked their Mum to be their beta reader. Remember the old saw: half of the population is, at any given skill, below average. Unfortunately, a huge chunk of those below-average folks are self-publishing.

I for one have developed a whole new respect for slush-pile readers. Well and truly. (n.b.: if any of you have NOT read SlushpileHell, you are missing out. It's like Cakewrecks for folks in the publishing biz. It's like crack to me. I wish he'd publish more of them.)

At least now us readers will be warned if we are about to buy house worms with depression or a herd of staffs greeted me warmly at the hotel.
Those were two books that either needed fixed or a warning.
I am looking forward to this.

Oh and Catlady, there are a ton and a half of "proofreaders" on fivver.

True, and true (proofreaders on Fiverr). There are so-called "formatters" on Fiverr; EDITORS (love of God...), and proofers. Sweet Baby Jesus, the cheapest "editor" I know charges not a penny less than $500, and that's a light edit--a line edit. Real (substantial/developmental/story) edits are in the thousands.

FIVERRS? GRRRRRR.....




I have had to leave the KDP forums, from time to time, because I'm tired of seeing self-appointed expert "publishers" telling newbs that they should NEVER pay for formatting, because it's a "ripoff." That they can either do it themselves in an hour or two (mind you--I can't do a novel in an hour or two!!), or they can pay a Fiverr. UGHGHGHGHGH

(Now I'll probably get in trouble because that linked image is too big, or something...)

Have a spiffy weekend, all!

Hitch

[Cinisajoy]

Let me rephrase, now their ability to sell their freedom of expression might come with a warning.

I also know many very good professional authors. I also know they invest that green stuff in their books before publication.
Have a great weekend.

[Catlady]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

@Catlady, why are you so worried? Do you write books that are unreadable?

I'm not worried; I don't write books of any kind, nor do I read self-published books. I'm not sure why this annoys me, but it does. Maybe because it seems to be turning every paying customer into a faux proofreader. It also seems to be bestowing credibility on books that don't get a "scarlet letter."

Now to answer your question, why should Amazon pay big money to vet books?
It is up to the author/publisher to put out the best book they can. I used to assume that if one wrote a book, that one could actually read on a high school level. Or at least junior high.
I also assumed most writers were somewhat professional and knew this was a business.
(Hitch, you can quit laughing or crying at my assumptions now.)
Too bad I was very highly mistaken.

I don't expect Amazon to "pay big money to vet books." But this new scheme will be costing them money, won't it? There could be massive amounts of time involved in gathering and verifying complaints, dealing with the authors, etc.

Off the top of my head, suppose instead Amazon offered proofreading services for an additional fee?

Oh and Catlady, there are a ton and a half of "proofreaders" on fivver.

Ha ha ha.

[kennyc]

How silly.

[DreamWriter]

This "Suggested Amazon Warning Labels" graphic is hilarious!

From http://johndopp.com/writers/amazons-new-warning-labels/:

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DreamWriter

This "Suggested Amazon Warning Labels" graphic is hilarious!

From http://johndopp.com/writers/amazons-new-warning-labels/:

Attachment 145784

That's absolutely hilarious. Thanks!

Hitch

[Ravensknight]

Well, this IS good news, for once...

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by Hitch

I don't factually know. My current understanding, which is hearsay, is Indy-pubs only, at this moment in time. I don't see the need, if you think about it, for a trade-pubbed book (Big whatever-the-number-is-now). After all, as I believe I've pointed out previously, trade pubs simply won't do it. They'll have printed volumes out there with (generally) the same issues. They're not going to reprint the bloody book for 3 typos.

(Anyone here who hasn't read my rants about instant gratification and snotty readers won't know this, but I think that it's absurd to insist that a KDP publisher INSTANTLY run around and fix 3 bloody typos. Random House wouldn't do that; don't know why an eBook publisher should have to, either. Not to mention--what worked for an upload in, say, 2010, won't work now. It'll be interesting to see how that's all sorted.)

Amazon's announcement specified KDP-published eBooks. Trade pubs don't use the KDP, so...presumably, not trade-pubs. Will it eventually become that? Possibly, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Instant gratification entirely aside...

I have really wanted to be able to report and get a tradpub book pulled in the past. And not for 3 bloody typos either!

I regard this as massively unfair if trad- and indie-pub are not competing on the same level -- for three typos I don't think an indie book should be pulled either, and for the kind of errors that I consider significantly impactful to the reading experience, tradpub should not be magically exempt.
And don't think tradpub is exempt from having stupid errors.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by Catlady

Off the top of my head, suppose instead Amazon offered proofreading services for an additional fee?

The same people that are not paying for proofreader now, will not start paying for proofreaders that Amazon offers them.

The same people that ARE paying for proofreaders now, will continue paying for the proofreaders that they have built up a relationship with, and won't switch to the proofreaders Amazon offers them.

Some new authors who believe in quality, will happen to choose Amazon® proofreaders, but does Amazon really need to get involved in yet another industry, and is it really worth their time?

[Lemurion]

I self-pub; I also do most of my own editing and formatting. It's not entirely by choice, but my budgetary limitations are significant enough that it's my only option.

I'm not worried.

I think I've received one comment that mentioned editing, and that was a compliment.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by Lemurion

I self-pub; I also do most of my own editing and formatting. It's not entirely by choice, but my budgetary limitations are significant enough that it's my only option.

I'm not worried.

I think I've received one comment that mentioned editing, and that was a compliment.

.