An example of a problem with DRM systems

pdurrant · 12-18-2011, 06:45 AM

A new member has just posted a question which shows one of the problems that DRM systems can cause: loss of access to purchased books.

I'm astonished that ADE is still doing this (allowing installation without authorisation), when customers have been making this same mistake since it was first released.

HarryT · 12-18-2011, 07:08 AM

I've never before heard of ADE allowing purchases without an explicit authorisation. Has it always done so?

EowynCarter · 12-18-2011, 07:27 AM

It had been so for a while.

Ninjalawyer · 12-18-2011, 08:25 AM

For downloaded music and movies, there have been numerous examples of of people losing access to their purchases when a DRM authentication server is taken down or the company running the DRM scheme has gone belly-up. I'm actually surprised at how infrequently this is an issue with ebooks though.

Edit

Business decisions also made this an issue with Fictionwise:

http://dearauthor.com/ebooks/how-to-...-and-overdrive

pdurrant · 12-18-2011, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninjalawyer

For downloaded music and movies, there have been numerous examples of of people losing access to their purchases when a DRM authentication server is taken down or the company running the DRM scheme has gone belly-up. I'm actually surprised at how infrequently this is an issue with ebooks though.

Edit

Business decisions also made this an issue with Fictionwise:

http://dearauthor.com/ebooks/how-to-...-and-overdrive

Yes, this has happened several times. But this instance is caused by a different thing: A really bad user interface decision.

Darqref · 12-19-2011, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

Yes, this has happened several times. But this instance is caused by a different thing: A really bad user interface decision.

from my viewpoint, ADE is a virus, and I refuse to let it be installed on my systems. I haven't pursued the issue, but I *think* I could buy epub books from B&N without needing ADE. It hasn't been worth it yet.

Ken Maltby · 12-19-2011, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darqref

from my viewpoint, ADE is a virus, and I refuse to let it be installed on my systems. I haven't pursued the issue, but I *think* I could buy epub books from B&N without needing ADE. It hasn't been worth it yet.

Right, you don't need ADE on your computer to buy ebooks from B&N.
Also, you don't need ADE on your computer to read the books that you
buy from B&N, even if they have DRM on them.

I have no "Nook" but I do have a B&N account and a "Nook" library on their
server. My ereader ( the Ectaco jetBook Lite ) supports the B&N DRM scam
(along with ADE and Secure eReader). The ADE and B&N DRM scam support
comes with the Adobe Reader Mobile 9.1.1 implemented on the device for
reading .epub and .pdf files.

If your ereader device can read B&N DRMed files then you don't need ADE
to read them.

I have a copy of "Nook for PC" on my system, but I'm not sure it makes any
difference to the store. When I buy an ebook from them I just go to the
"Nook Library" that they maintain for my purchases and download the file,
then I remove the infection, so it's usable on all my devices. I never need
to access "Nook for PC" or ADE.

Luck;
Ken

TheSFReader · 12-19-2011, 03:59 AM

Yes, it's so sad to see "uneducated" people getting bitten by this infection whereas we all know a cure exists... So either go DRM abstinent, or use Alf's condoms and don't let DRMs intrude your personal library ^^

ProDigit · 12-19-2011, 05:11 AM

Thanks for warning us!
Eventhough I don't use DRM'ed content, I have the experience of losing a good 15 books due to DRM (a change of user on a device)!
Ever since I've stayed away from DRM, but fear the day I buy a book that has DRM on it without me knowing it!

I wish there was a simple way to strip DRM off of books as soon as they are received, without losing quality the book, nor of the pictures inside the book!
I don't want to screen capture the book, or reconvert it!

mbovenka · 12-19-2011, 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProDigit

I wish there was a simple way to strip DRM off of books as soon as they are received, without losing quality the book, nor of the pictures inside the book!
I don't want to screen capture the book, or reconvert it!

Google 'Apprentice Alf'. He is a good friend

If you use Calibre you can install the plugins and removing DRM then becomes invisible as far as importing your books into Calibre is concerned.

ATDrake · 12-19-2011, 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProDigit

I wish there was a simple way to strip DRM off of books as soon as they are received, without losing quality the book, nor of the pictures inside the book!

If you're a Mac user and know some Applescript, you can attach a Folder Action Script to wherever the downloads end up to automatically process all new arrivals with the liberation tools*. Possibly something similar could be worked up for Windows users.

* Disclaimer: I have not actually done this myself because I'm lazy and buy mostly non-DRM stuff anyway though probably I should to keep backups of the more interesting promo freebies I get.

reprep · 12-19-2011, 06:19 AM

I just checked my ADE to be sure it is authorized. I wasn't even aware that you could download books without authorizing. Nevertheless it is a major bug and another big reason to stay away from DRM.

Unfortunately major e-book sellers in my country sell books with adobe DRM. I strip the DRM as soon as the download finishes.

Well i wasn't aware that stripping DRM from books make you lose some of the content, does it?

DiapDealer · 12-19-2011, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Well i wasn't aware that stripping DRM from books make you lose some of the content, does it?

In my experience, removing the drm doesn't touch/alter the content in any way (with maybe the exception of topaz books—and even then, there are ways to preserve the original formatting).

HarryT · 12-19-2011, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProDigit

I wish there was a simple way to strip DRM off of books as soon as they are received, without losing quality the book, nor of the pictures inside the book!
I don't want to screen capture the book, or reconvert it!

What are you talking about? DRM removal has no impact whatsoever on the "quality" of a book, nor does it affect pictures.

EowynCarter · 12-19-2011, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSFReader

Yes, it's so sad to see "uneducated" people getting bitten by this infection whereas we all know a cure exists... So either go DRM abstinent, or use Alf's condoms and don't let DRMs intrude your personal library ^^

Well, i consider myself educated, but I still got slapped in the face by that one, as I had forgotten I hadn't authorized ade. I only realized something was wrong when inept refused to de-drm.
And then I authorize ADE, naively believing that it would re-authorize the book properly then. Fail !

12-18-2011, 06:45 AM	#1
pdurrant The Grand Mouse 高貴的老鼠 Posts: 71,506 Karma: 306214458 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Norfolk, England Device: Kindle Voyage	An example of a problem with DRM systems A new member has just posted a question which shows one of the problems that DRM systems can cause: loss of access to purchased books. I'm astonished that ADE is still doing this (allowing installation without authorisation), when customers have been making this same mistake since it was first released.

12-18-2011, 08:25 AM	#4
Ninjalawyer Guru Posts: 826 Karma: 18573626 Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Canada Device: Kobo Touch, Nexus 7 (2013)	For downloaded music and movies, there have been numerous examples of of people losing access to their purchases when a DRM authentication server is taken down or the company running the DRM scheme has gone belly-up. I'm actually surprised at how infrequently this is an issue with ebooks though. Edit Business decisions also made this an issue with Fictionwise: http://dearauthor.com/ebooks/how-to-...-and-overdrive Last edited by Ninjalawyer; 12-18-2011 at 08:32 AM. Reason: For great justice

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12-18-2011, 07:08 AM	#2
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383043 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	I've never before heard of ADE allowing purchases without an explicit authorisation. Has it always done so?

12-18-2011, 07:27 AM	#3
EowynCarter Wizard Posts: 4,332 Karma: 4000000 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Paris Device: Cybooks; Sony PRS-T1	It had been so for a while.

12-19-2011, 03:59 AM	#8
TheSFReader Groupie Posts: 172 Karma: 161634 Join Date: Dec 2010 Device: Nook	Yes, it's so sad to see "uneducated" people getting bitten by this infection whereas we all know a cure exists... So either go DRM abstinent, or use Alf's condoms and don't let DRMs intrude your personal library ^^

12-19-2011, 05:11 AM	#9
ProDigit Karmaniac Posts: 2,553 Karma: 11499146 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Miami FL Device: PRS-505, Jetbook, + Mini, +Color, Astak Ez Reader Pro, PPW1, Aura H2O	Thanks for warning us! Eventhough I don't use DRM'ed content, I have the experience of losing a good 15 books due to DRM (a change of user on a device)! Ever since I've stayed away from DRM, but fear the day I buy a book that has DRM on it without me knowing it! I wish there was a simple way to strip DRM off of books as soon as they are received, without losing quality the book, nor of the pictures inside the book! I don't want to screen capture the book, or reconvert it!

12-19-2011, 06:19 AM	#12
reprep Addict Posts: 202 Karma: 6720 Join Date: May 2011 Device: amazon kindle DXG	I just checked my ADE to be sure it is authorized. I wasn't even aware that you could download books without authorizing. Nevertheless it is a major bug and another big reason to stay away from DRM. Unfortunately major e-book sellers in my country sell books with adobe DRM. I strip the DRM as soon as the download finishes. Well i wasn't aware that stripping DRM from books make you lose some of the content, does it?