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Old 09-16-2021, 08:03 AM   #46
Sirtel
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Ridiculous! The only true way is to pass stories down verbally from parent to child.
By grunts. This language stuff is too modern and ephemeral. It'll pass soon.
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Old 09-16-2021, 08:13 AM   #47
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I also never look at paper book prices. Either I buy the ebook or I'll wait until the price drops. Don't care what the paper edition costs, I'm not gonna buy it.
Almost all of my book reading is from library borrows so cost isn't usually an issue for me either.

And I far prefer the fresh, clean, hygienic e-book experience to some of the nasty books I encountered from the library when I used to borrow paper copies.
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Old 09-16-2021, 08:28 AM   #48
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I have never cared about the cost of a book whatever form it takes. I like to read and I spend whatever it takes to read a book I like. Stone, paper, electronic or beamed directly to my brain I don't care. The story is what is important not the physical form. Books are like sandwiches. The bread is there to hold the filling.
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Old 09-16-2021, 08:40 AM   #49
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I have never cared about the cost of a book whatever form it takes. I like to read and I spend whatever it takes to read a book I like. Stone, paper, electronic or beamed directly to my brain I don't care. The story is what is important not the physical form. Books are like sandwiches. The bread is there to hold the filling.
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Well, I do have a hard limit. Usually I don't buy an ebook over 10$/€. As my TBR list is hundreds of years long, I don't have to read a book immediately and can wait until the price drops.

Depends on how many books you buy, I guess. I buy a lot. Much more than I'll ever have time to read. It's an addiction. So I can't really afford to pay in double digits for a book. Fortunately most books I'm interested in cost less than 10.
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Old 09-16-2021, 08:42 AM   #50
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And I far prefer the fresh, clean, hygienic e-book experience to some of the nasty books I encountered from the library when I used to borrow paper copies.
Yeah, same. I could never get into paper book borrowing for this reason. Unfortunately ebook borrowing on eink is not possible where I live (only through apps and websites), and KU isn't available either without using VPN, so I have to buy all my books.
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Old 09-16-2021, 09:17 AM   #51
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Why? It doesn't matter. The cherry-picked few cases where ebooks are more expensive than print are not the rule. And as already noted: I don't care all that much how the prices of ebooks (that I value more) compare to the prices of print books (that I value not at all).


I don't give the slightest hoot about DRM these days. It has zero impact on my valuation of ebooks. I'm not a curator; I'm a reader. I'm happy to let stores and libraries do all the curating. I'll stick to the reading.
Because it does matter. For people that aren't into eBooks yet they look at the costs of getting a dedicated reader and the books and it would cost them more or the same. So why bother in the first place?

If you want to charge me the same price as the paperback or more don't give me a low resolution cover that looks bad on a modern reader, don't give me books riddled with obvious typos and weird formatting issues like the final "page" being 100 page turns long. These are issues I've had in purchased books.

DRM constrains the average user. No lending your friend that book you really liked and you can't necessarily read the book on the device you want to. Plus you run the risk of losing your purchases if the seller goes bust. While it's currently possible to remove the DRM from some of the big sellers there's no guarantee that will be the case in the future and it's still too complicated for some people.

I like eBooks but there's tons of room for improvement IMO from the format side, the reader side and the price side.
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Old 09-16-2021, 09:54 AM   #52
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Because it does matter.
You mean it matters TO YOU. And that's fine. I'm happy to allow there to be a multitude of opinions on the subject. But neither you (nor I) get to speak for the "average user" about what is constraining them (if anything), or what is "too expensive" because we don't know. We only know what does, or doesn't, bother ourselves.

There is no universal and objectively held "ebooks are too expensive," or "DRM is too constraining" sentiment out there in the wide world. Time to stop pretending there is. There's millions of people out there who are perfectly content to buy (at their own comfort level price-wise), or borrow ebooks with no concern at all for DRM. They're not (all) ignorant, and they're not downtrodden in need of rescue. They're just not interested. They're in a different place.

It's OK for you to feel constrained by DRM, or for you to feel oppressed by ebook prices. But it's not OK for you to think everyone is affected by those things in the same way you are. I'm me. I'm not everyone. And neither are you.

Last edited by DiapDealer; 09-16-2021 at 10:11 AM.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:01 AM   #53
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Sure. There are things that books do better. There are things that I miss about books. I prefer ereading, but that doesn’t mean that books are the devil’s handiwork, yet the author seems to think the reverse.
I agree. It was the only point he wrote I did vibe with -- "bookiness".

I'm not surprised at those who prefer ebooks - I do too for all the same reasons.

But -- didn't we all fall in love with reading - via paper books? How can a physical book NOT touch nostalgic points in your psyche?

Enough for me to read a paper book? No. Every time I have to, it just reminds me why I prefer ebooks.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:05 AM   #54
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Because it does matter. For people that aren't into eBooks yet they look at the costs of getting a dedicated reader and the books and it would cost them more or the same. So why bother in the first place?
But they are not.

Pick five random books off of your book shelf and look them up on Amazon. Odds are the e-book will be cheaper. And that is before any sale.

Quote:
DRM constrains the average user. No lending your friend that book you really liked and you can't necessarily read the book on the device you want to. Plus you run the risk of losing your purchases if the seller goes bust. While it's currently possible to remove the DRM from some of the big sellers there's no guarantee that will be the case in the future and it's still too complicated for some people.

I like eBooks but there's tons of room for improvement IMO from the format side, the reader side and the price side.
I don't disagree with that. But the 'ebooks are more expensive' argument just ain't so.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:09 AM   #55
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But -- didn't we all fall in love with reading - via paper books? How can a physical book NOT touch nostalgic points in your psyche?
Because it's the stories I read that hold all the nostalgic value/memories for me. I fell in love with stories and reading, not books. I can't recall any bookiness feels from my youth, but I can recall the stories and where I was when I was reading them.
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Old 09-16-2021, 10:29 AM   #56
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Because it's the stories I read that hold all the nostalgic value/memories for me. I fell in love with stories and reading, not books. I can't recall any bookiness feels from my youth, but I can recall the stories and where I was when I was reading them.
Yeah, same. Paper itself (the smell, the weight, the texture and so on) does nothing for me.

But then I'm not a particularly nostalgic person overall. For me the past has never been something I miss or grow sentimental remembering. Even though I had a happy, carefree childhood and loving parents. I'm just not that type of person.
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Old 09-16-2021, 12:28 PM   #57
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Because it's the stories I read that hold all the nostalgic value/memories for me. I fell in love with stories and reading, not books.
As long as the print is readable, formatting not distracting, and the pages don't fall out (though I have repaired glue bound and stitch bound books) I'm happy with the book if the content is what I want. My dad, OTOH, buys expensive editions of famous works. He's also into what Critics and Educators regard as Literature, so loses interest in some titles, hence I've at least 11 "Folio Society" editions, I doubt he read, of famous fantasy and myth & legend titles. My youngest son also likes fancy hardback editions, though he reads them eventually. I've passed on a few hardback "classics" to my youngest son, that probably came from my dad, where I have PD ebooks and paperbacks.

I like to have a paper edition and I'll buy it unless the ebook is a lot cheaper.
I like to have the paper and ebook. So I have two versions of Magician on paper and the later version as an ebook when it was on offer for £0.99.

I saw the very grey Sony when it was first in retail in Dublin. Wife saw it too. The only thing that put us off was the price. By the time I could afford eink the PW3 was just out. I bought it purely to read Gutenberg and discovered it would also save a fortune in ink (later toner) in drafts of my writing. So maybe 2 million words now typed and proofed on the Kindle & Kobo, annotations read back to Windows via Calibre to Word, then Writer. Later Kobo and then later still Linux.

Most of the ebooks I read are still from PD sources. I have bought ebooks too, from 4 sources. Wife has bought about x5 ebooks and all Amazon, but she too reads more from Gutenberg and other PD. She recently upgraded from a PW3 to a Kobo Libra and much prefers it. She never looks up stuff or annotates on it.

My dad (90) reads on a Kindle despite his love of the Folio Society. He actually uses the front light to read under the bed clothes! I think there are now 10 users of ereaders in the immediate family. One friend is still a convinced phone user for ebooks as he reads in spare moments when out. He found my PRS350 5" ereader too wide for his pocket!

Last edited by Quoth; 09-16-2021 at 12:32 PM. Reason: Clarify
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Old 09-16-2021, 12:46 PM   #58
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Because it's the stories I read that hold all the nostalgic value/memories for me. I fell in love with stories and reading, not books. I can't recall any bookiness feels from my youth, but I can recall the stories and where I was when I was reading them.
I still have nostalgia for the Narnia books I've held onto since childhood. There's a few other books like that. But were I to decide I wanted to reread them, I'd read them on my Kobo.

I can understand 'bookiness' might be a thing. But it isn't the only thing. For me, it's not even a very important thing. If I want to, I can snag covers that match those of my memories and that is good enough.
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Old 09-16-2021, 01:00 PM   #59
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I'm not really a cover person, either. When I close my eyes and think about favorite stories, it's rare that I see cover images in my mind's eye. I almost never back up to see the cover image whenever I start a new ebook. Visual art, is visual art. I hang art like that on the wall if I want to enjoy it. I know I'm in the minority here, but I never really saw the point of artwork on books. Much like I was never interested in how well singers could dance. *shrug*

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Old 09-17-2021, 05:49 AM   #60
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Do most people buy hardcovers or paperback? I'd argue the latter. ...
Looking at this page:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...usa-by-format/

more people buy paperbacks.

I have no idea about the accuracy of the numbers.
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