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Old 07-01-2019, 11:50 AM   #1
PeterT
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Why e-books, e-audiobooks could be harder to snag at your local library

https://www.cbc.ca/news/entertainmen...nges-1.5189591

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You might call her an ideal library-goer: Andrea Querido visits her local branch weekly — even blogs for it — and*describes*libraries as "a place of community and connection."

And when Querido's son was born five years ago, the communications professional fell in love with a new section of the stacks: e-books, which along with e-audiobooks, make up the fastest growing area of borrowing for many libraries today.

"You'd have those late nights and you could be on your phone or your iPod, reading, while he's feeding or you're changing a diaper," recalled Querido, an avid reader and book club member who lives in Brampton, Ont.

But as any library patron could tell you, there can be lengthy waits for e-book and e-audiobook titles — especially for A-list authors.*Take, for instance, Oprah Winfrey's latest self-help title,*The Path Made Clear, published in March.

"I think for the audiobook, it's 135 days to wait. And then the e-book is something like 35 days," said Querido.*"If you're willing to wait, it's great.*But if you want to get your hands on that, it's kind of a long time to wait for the book everyone's talking about."*

That kind of wait could get even longer now, as libraries call out*multinational publishers for high prices, restrictive terms and*exclusivity windows that they say make it tougher to get e-content into the hands of eager customers.


......
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Old 07-01-2019, 04:23 PM   #2
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It's the age old battle as to why publishers are forced to sell to libraries. It's also the same discussion on why you can't resell your ebook, or loan it.

Why should "society" pay for access to Oprah's latest book? Clearly there is a long wait because people want to read the book -- NOW. And clearly there aren't enough copies for the most in demand book.

But really, you don't even have to GO to a library to check out an ebook or audio book. The only way to keep library lending from become the same thing as putting an ebook on a file sharing site....is to limit the number of copies.

If you don't want to wait....go buy yourself a copy. If you are poor -- wait or read something else.
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Old 07-01-2019, 05:41 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by leebase View Post
It's the age old battle as to why publishers are forced to sell to libraries. It's also the same discussion on why you can't resell your ebook, or loan it. ...
I don't believe publishers are forced to sell ebooks to libraries. If a library wants to buy an ebook, they are forced to buy it from a publisher.

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... But really, you don't even have to GO to a library to check out an ebook or audio book. The only way to keep library lending from become the same thing as putting an ebook on a file sharing site....is to limit the number of copies. ...
The above seems disingenuous. Overdrive is nothing like a "file shareing site". Each copy is paid for. Each copy is loaned out for a specific amount of time.

I just had a discussion with my librarian. The current system does not work for him/us. Ebooks are just too expensive. I requested an ebook, and he was very hesitant to get it, saying it was just to expensive. In the past, they always honoured my reasonable requests. Instead of the current model, he said he would rather have a per use fee.

The nice thing about physical media (books, CDs, DVDs), is if libraries are unhappy with the publisher price, they can order a consumer version (Amazon).

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If you don't want to wait....go buy yourself a copy. If you are poor -- wait or read something else.
Let them eat cake.
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Old 07-01-2019, 06:46 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by leebase View Post
It's the age old battle as to why publishers are forced to sell to libraries. It's also the same discussion on why you can't resell your ebook, or loan it.

Why should "society" pay for access to Oprah's latest book? Clearly there is a long wait because people want to read the book -- NOW. And clearly there aren't enough copies for the most in demand book.

But really, you don't even have to GO to a library to check out an ebook or audio book. The only way to keep library lending from become the same thing as putting an ebook on a file sharing site....is to limit the number of copies.

If you don't want to wait....go buy yourself a copy. If you are poor -- wait or read something else.
It is about our "HURRY UP" society. We don't want to wait.
You go into a car dealership, it is about your credit and the payments. A home realtor, it is the same. If you have to have a book, and e-book, an audio-book, you can borrow and get it, but then can you resell after use like a car or a house? Not really.

You want it free as a library book. So, wait, you cheapskate!

I had a friend. He rented a long time after he was married and had children. He had a good job, but didn't like debt. He is the only man (without an inheritance or a winning lottery ticket) I know who paid cash straight up and bought a house. I pride myself on frugality, but it took me 6 to 7 years to pay for my first house. After that it was easy.
If we could transfer (legally) the rights to e-books like a paper-book, life would be better.

Now I recognize the difficulty for the authors if their books can be copied and virtually given away to anyone. They will have to find another livelihood. That is a great loss that we have decided must not happen.

By the way I remember the efforts by authors to try to claim some of the money from the resale of their used paper books. They were laughed at.

Generally, that was considered "a bridge too far."

Last edited by frahse; 07-01-2019 at 06:49 PM.
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Old 07-01-2019, 06:51 PM   #5
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You want it free as a library book. So, wait, you cheapskate!
Hmmmm. I hate to say *I* and all other tax payers PAY for the library services, so I think calling us cheapskates is uncalled for.

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Old 07-01-2019, 07:58 PM   #6
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Surely there are also waiting lists for paper versions of popular books?
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Old 07-01-2019, 09:07 PM   #7
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Surely there are also waiting lists for paper versions of popular books?
There must certainly are!

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Old 07-01-2019, 09:30 PM   #8
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I would be willing to pay the same price for an ebook as I do for a printed one if the publishers allowed libraries to accept donated ebooks from their patrons or buy them from wherever they wanted to.
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Old 07-01-2019, 09:48 PM   #9
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I would be willing to pay the same price for an ebook as I do for a printed one if the publishers allowed libraries to accept donated ebooks from their patrons or buy them from wherever they wanted to.
You Can buy an e-book & Gift it to a library.. I have done this. Why cant you?
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Old 07-02-2019, 08:46 AM   #10
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I don't believe publishers are forced to sell ebooks to libraries. If a library wants to buy an ebook, they are forced to buy it from a publisher.Let them eat cake.
Pretty much. An ebook doesn't wear out. An ebook file is limitless. One file is all it takes for everyone in the entire world to read.

Of course publisher's aren't just going to give libraries unfettered access to ebooks. They are in business to SELL ebooks.

"But what about the good of society?" I believe that notion is not applicable to: "man, I want to read the latest book, but so do 10,000 other people and now I'm having to wait....meanwhile, there are 10 million books in the library I could read while I wait".

But...but...but my TAXES. Well, your tax funded library buys a certain number of books. If you don't approve of the selection, or the number of copies, take it up with your librarian about changing their priorities. Or take it up with the mayor to raise taxes to enable the library to buy more copies of the most in demand books so that you don't have to use your own money to....you know....buy the book you want to read.

I want to watch a movie. iTunes has it, but it's $20 to buy and there is no rent option. Oh the injustice! I can't have what I want when I want it. Well, I've never bought such a movie. I've waited for the rental window to appear instead.

But SOMETIMES....I really want to see a movie such that I pay $50 for my wife and I to go see it in the theater...plus popcorn and drinks.

At the theater they show previews of all the great movies coming up. I think "I'll go see that one....nah, this other one's a renter". Or "I'll wait for it to come to the library and get in line".

Life goes on.
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Old 07-02-2019, 09:23 AM   #11
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You Can buy an e-book & Gift it to a library.. I have done this. Why cant you?
Ebooks bought from Amazon won't have the necessary licensing that a library book would need. The license they carry is for non-commercial use, for one thing. It's been my understanding that you can't gift the book to a public library. You can always donate money, and let them buy it.

My public library has a wish list option, to use for books they haven't purchased yet. It seems that if buying a book to give to the library were an option, it would be stated there.

99% of the time I put a library book on hold, waiting isn't a problem. Our library even gives you the estimated wait time along with how many copies of the book they own. Those few times I wanted a book immediately, I buy it.
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Old 07-02-2019, 09:32 AM   #12
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Ebooks bought from Amazon won't have the necessary licensing that a library book would need. The license they carry is for non-commercial use, for one thing. .
Correct. You can't give away an ebook you bought for yourself. You don't own ebooks, you license a copy for personal use. That's not the same thing as saying you can't buy an ebook for the purpose of giving to the library.

This really isn't so hard to understand. An ebook is not a physical book. A physical book degrades with use. A physical book is only in one physical location, ever. That location may change, but it's always in one place no matter where that place is.

An ebook file is perfect and infinitely copy-able. If I bought a DRM free ebook from Amazon and donated it to my library....that one file could be used to give everyone the ability to read the book...at any time, from any place, forever. All the people, all the time, in all the places.

This is untenable. Ergo, license use and DRM to enforce the license. Even without DRM...libraries would still not be free to accept an ebook file and just let anybody "borrow it from the library".
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Old 07-02-2019, 09:42 AM   #13
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That's not the same thing as saying you can't buy an ebook for the purpose of giving to the library.
You can't gift a Kindle book to a public library. That book would have a non-commercial license. I'm not talking about giving a book I've bought for myself to the library. I'm talking about using Amazon's Gifting option.

I've no idea of the process a public library uses to buy the digital books they offer. But I'm sure they are not buying them from Amazon in the same way a Kindle customer does.
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Old 07-02-2019, 09:43 AM   #14
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Pretty much. An ebook doesn't wear out. An ebook file is limitless. One file is all it takes for everyone in the entire world to read.
Same with a pbooks. Once a pbooks is out in the wild, anyone can make unlimited number of copies.


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... "But what about the good of society?" I believe that notion is not applicable to: "man, I want to read the latest book, but so do 10,000 other people and now I'm having to wait....meanwhile, there are 10 million books in the library I could read while I wait".
Rhetoric. I'm guessing not a single library in my state has 10,000,000 books. Never mind 10,000,000 ebooks.

And I have yet to see a wait list of 10,000.

My library (which is part of a state consortium of probably 30 towns), has 8500 ebooks. How many of those are in a particular genre, how many for adults? For children? For teens. So let's pick adults. 30 towns * 10,000 people = 300,000 people. So we have 3000 ebooks for 300,000 people. I'm guessing my local library has a lot more than 3000 pbooks sitting on it's shelves wlone. Why don't you think they buy more ebooks? Too expensive and too restrictive.

What is needed is a more reasonable model for libraries.

Let's not forget why we have copyright in the U.S. If the authors don't want to uphold their end of the agreement, ...
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Old 07-02-2019, 09:54 AM   #15
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My library lists e-books available like this:

Kindle books - 121,258
OverDrive Books - 118,934
OverDrive Read-along - 487
EPUB Books - 112,204
Open EPUB Books - 4,282
PDF Books - 3,871
Open PDF Books - 90
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