Page turn is painfully slow compared to Kindle

[3d0g]

Originally Posted by windowsrefund

So the fix is simple. Cache both previous and next page as a background task when the current page has been loaded for a few seconds (this means the page's contents are being read).

Sounds like you've got everything all worked out. When can we expect your wonderful firmware? Will you have "goto page" in the first revision as well?

[windowsrefund]

Originally Posted by 3d0g

Sounds like you've got everything all worked out. When can we expect your wonderful firmware? Will you have "goto page" in the first revision as well?

If I were developing these bits, this is the common sense approach I would be taking to solve this obvious problem. If you want me to take on this task, I'd be happy to discuss the issue of compensation with you off line.

[3d0g]

Originally Posted by windowsrefund

If I were developing these bits, this is the common sense approach I would be taking to solve this obvious problem. If you want me to take on this task, I'd be happy to discuss the issue of compensation with you off line.

To me, common sense would be actually knowing the hardware capabilities / limitations before making such bold claims. Seems more like talking out one's ass instead and therefore, no compensation is forthcoming.

[Taesoo Kwon]

Originally Posted by 3d0g

To me, common sense would be actually knowing the hardware capabilities / limitations before making such bold claims. Seems more like talking out one's ass instead and therefore, no compensation is forthcoming.

Honestly, I think his claim is reasonable. All vizplex panels have the same speed, and software can make big difference. There is an e-reader called starebook and it has a very slow 200mhz cpu and an older generation of vizplex panel which has darker background, but it's page turning speed is about twice as fast as the Kobo wifi e-reader (probably because of page caching, bitmap fonts, and its own proprietary format).
Also Kobo is slower than competing e-readers that have similar hardware specification and software requirements (adobe EPUB).
It seems to me that there are a lot of rooms for improvement in the kobo firmware though I like my kobo wifi.

[maledyris]

Originally Posted by windowsrefund

Somewhere on this forum, someone mentioned something about chapters being cached but I can't see how this would help matters as user's hardly bother to switch between chapters. In the case of caches, I'd think both the previous and next pages should be cached so they can be called up immediately rather than what's happening now.

Hmm... I think you're misunderstanding what it means for a chapter to be cached. It basically means that all pages in the chapter are in RAM and ready to go. Therefore, the previous and next pages are already cached. They've basically already done what you're asking for.
When you get to the end of a chapter, there's that wait time that you have to sit through till the next chapter loads. That's why that happens. The next chapter is being pushed into memory.

I think that short of moving to the new Pearl screen and increasing CPU speed, only a very very modest speed increase could ever likely be achieved on the Kobo Wifi. I'm only speculating of course because I don't know anything about the Kobo software.

I have programmed for the Kindles though, and for non-reading tasks you can do tricks such as employ dirty rects to refresh only bits of a screen, but for reading and other things that require full screen refresh, you're going to be limited by the screen's ability to refresh itself.
If I remember correctly (it's been a few months), the Kindle 2's full screen refresh is about as fast as Kobo Wifi's, and the Kindle 3's was a lot faster because of the new Pearl screen.

One thing I do notice about the Kobo is that it throws away all page-turn button presses until it is completely finished refreshing a page. That's a bit irritating, removing that and buffering some of the key presses could help give the appearance of faster page turns (like for when you're flipping pages to get to a certain page). I could have sworn that the Kindle 2 did not eat button presses while it was refreshing. I thought it simply immediately went to refresh the next page after finishing the current one, but I could be wrong...

Oh, one more thing, the StarEbook doesn't look like it's twice as fast as the Kobo when you check out the YouTube videos of it... It looks about the same speed. I think that might have been a bit of an exaggeration... Anyway, aren't the Kobo and StarEbook both made by the same company (Netronix)?

[Taesoo Kwon]

Originally Posted by maledyris

Hmm... I think you're misunderstanding what it means for a
chapter to be cached. It basically means that all pages in the chapter are in RAM and ready to go. Therefore, the previous and next pages are already cached.

I meant the caching of the fully-rendered page (image), not the text assuming drawing AA font is time consuming.

I think that short of moving to the new Pearl screen and increasing CPU speed, only a very very modest speed increase could ever likely be achieved on the Kobo Wifi.

I think you are over-estimating the speed of the new Pearl screen. The nook 1.5 that uses Vizplex panel is almost as fast as kindle 3, but the Kobo wifi is not. This is also mentioned by some reviewers.

Oh, one more thing, the StarEbook doesn't look like it's twice as fast as the Kobo when you check out the YouTube videos of it...

I have both, and the difference is quite significant admitting that 2x difference is exaggerated. Especially so when flipping back and forth between two consecutive pages.
(Something I do frequently when reading technical articles). When keeping going forward, the starebook gets slower after 3 consecutive page turns though.
Main difference is that on StarEbook, the page flashing starts immediately with button click, but in kobo WIFI there's about half second delay. Also page flashing itself seems slower on Kobo. I don't know why.. It could be because of Starebook supports only 4 grey levels.
It's said that vizplex panel's page refresh can be done in about 0.5~0.7s. But I cannot turn 8 pages in 10 second on the kobo WIFI.

For comparision, it seems that the old kindle 2 can turn more than 70 pages per minute.
http://ireaderreview.com/2010/04/29/...e-turn-speeds/
Nook 1.5 is said to be faster than kindle 2, which I guess is the speed very close to the hardware-limitation. I tested again on my Kobo wifi, and I can only turn 40 pages per minute using a preloaded book.

[maledyris]

Originally Posted by Taesoo Kwon

think you are over-estimating the speed of the new Pearl screen. The nook 1.5 that uses Vizplex panel is almost as fast as kindle 3, but the Kobo wifi is not. This is also mentioned by some reviewers.

Oh really? I've never really gotten a chance to look at the latest Nook. I was in the US last year, and I saw whatever version was available in stores then and I have to admit I was really unimpressed (though admittedly, the iPhone 4 had just come out at the time, so I barely payed attention to it). I'll have to see if I can find some videos. I've never seen a screen refresh on a vizplex that was nearly as fast as the Kindle 3 or the PRS-650. They've all always seemed to refresh at about the same speed (ignoring any delays before they actually began to refresh), so I just assumed that was the limit.

You're right about that click delay though. I was noticing that after the fact. The Kindle 3 still seems to have the absolute fastest reaction to a page turn request out of them all, even the PRS-650 which I think comes the closest.