Announcements during Apple October 30 Event

[OtinG]

Now that the new Mac mini 2018 are in users' hands, the question has been answered. Yes you can update the RAM modules in the Mac mini 2018, but it is way more work and complicated than doing so on my Mac mini late-2012. Here is a link to a Mac Rumors article that discuses it.

Perhaps many of the people in forums like this one can accomplish this process, but I still think that the average Mac mini 2018 owner would not have the skill level nor tools to attempt it. As the article states, it requires an enthusiast level of expertise. IMO, an enthusiast level of expertise falls somewhere between the novice and professional levels, and certainly way closer to the professional level. This is NOT a simple task like it was with my Mac mini late-2012 where you open a trap door and simply unplug the factory RAM modules and plug-in the 3rd party ones. The Mac mini 2018 requires one to detach the bottom plate with a tool, unscrew and remove the antenna plate, unscrew and remove the fan assembly, unscrew and remove the main board, unscrew and remove the RAM cage, remove the rubber stabilizers and press the spring clips, then replace the RAM modules, then reverse these steps to put everything back where it goes.

If you are an enthusiast, then go for it. If you are not, either find a friend who is or pay more to Apple to get more RAM installed.

[tomsem]

MacSales (Other World Computing) already has memory upgrade kits for the new Mac mini:

https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/mac-mini/

$1100 for 64GB is a bit of a deterrent, but assume it will be less in the future.

There is no video to show how-to but they will probably have one before too long. They also offer an upgrade service.

I would be comfortable with the procedure myself.

[OtinG]

Originally Posted by tomsem

MacSales (Other World Computing) already has memory upgrade kits for the new Mac mini:

https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/mac-mini/

$1100 for 64GB is a bit of a deterrent, but assume it will be less in the future.

There is no video to show how-to but they will probably have one before too long. They also offer an upgrade service.

I would be comfortable with the procedure myself.

There is a video how-to embedded in the Mac Rumors article which I linked above in post #46.

[OtinG]

Here is the Youtube Mac mini 2018 take-down and RAM upgrade video. Note that the torx wrenches are not standard as Apple used non-standard tox screws, so be sure to buy the correct wrenches/drivers.



It doesn't look like it will be too challenging for techie types (enthusiasts), but probably a bit too much for most non-techie types.

[Dylrob]

Originally Posted by OtinG

Here is the Youtube Mac mini 2018 take-down and RAM upgrade video. Note that the torx wrenches are not standard as Apple used non-standard tox screws, so be sure to buy the correct wrenches/drivers.



It doesn't look like it will be too challenging for techie types (enthusiasts), but probably a bit too much for most non-techie types.

To be fair, how many "non-techie types" even buy desktop computers anymore? The new mini in particular seems aimed at a certain market niche.

[OtinG]

Originally Posted by Dylrob

To be fair, how many "non-techie types" even buy desktop computers anymore? The new mini in particular seems aimed at a certain market niche.

I don’t know where you get your information, but a lot of non-techie types prefer desktops and laptops to tablets when it comes to photo processing, database and spreadsheet apps, document creation, et cetera, at least in my generation. Tablets are terrible for those kind of tasks as it takes too long to enter data and manipulate. Basically anyone who works in an office environment using a computer likely prefers them for the kind of tasks the Mac mini is designed for. There are a lot of computer owners especially those older than Millennials who grew up with smartphones and tablets.

[Dylrob]

Originally Posted by OtinG

I don’t know where you get your information, but a lot of non-techie types prefer desktops and laptops to tablets when it comes to photo processing, database and spreadsheet apps, document creation, et cetera, at least in my generation. Tablets are terrible for those kind of tasks as it takes too long to enter data and manipulate. Basically anyone who works in an office environment using a computer likely prefers them for the kind of tasks the Mac mini is designed for. There are a lot of computer owners especially those older than Millennials who grew up with smartphones and tablets.

I'm saying portables in general... laptops and tablets... dominate the market. (and keep in mind that tablet doesn't just mean iPad; it includes Surface and other Windows based systems too, many of which take the productivity angle into consideration by offering keyboard/Trackpad attachments)

Also consider how many non-techies are going to upgrade their RAM. And how many are going to buy a Mini instead of a complete package like the iMac. You're getting to an ever smaller market share that Apple would have to compromise on the new cooling system in order to appease. A fan design that I would imagine is meant to help with thermal throttling.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Dylrob

I'm saying portables in general... laptops and tablets... dominate the market. (and keep in mind that tablet doesn't just mean iPad; it includes Surface and other Windows based systems too, many of which take the productivity angle into consideration by offering keyboard/Trackpad attachments)

Also consider how many non-techies are going to upgrade their RAM. And how many are going to buy a Mini instead of a complete package like the iMac. You're getting to an ever smaller market share that Apple would have to compromise on the new cooling system in order to appease. A fan design that I would imagine is meant to help with thermal throttling.

I notice that the goalpost has moved from can't change the RAM because it's hardwired to the mother board, to it's too difficult for Great Aunt Effie to do unless she reads the directions first. People are always going to find something to complain about if they look hard enough.

The bottom line is that anyone who is familiar with a screwdriver and who has worked on computers will find it fairly easy to upgrade memory on a mini. Anyone who can't, probably shouldn't be trying to upgrade memory themselves because it's actually possible to kill yourself via electrical discharge if you don't know what you are doing or aren't careful. I've had it happen to soneone I knew and he actually knew what he was doing, he just got a little careless. Word to the wise, you shouldn't open any electronic device unless you know what you are doing.

[OtinG]

Have you guys ever worked in a techie company? I worked in several over a quarter of a century, all software companies. The interesting thing is that even among the software development staff including programmers, QA folks, technical writers, etc., the odd thing was that only about 5-10% of those people could open an older WinTel box and change the RAM. Why? Because they had never even tried or just assumed it was too complicated. So if the vast majority of folks in a techie job were unlikely to attempt what was a rather simple task for many of us back in the 1980s through the early 2000s, I have to assume the same will be true for today with the new Mac mini 2018. Albeit a younger generation now is the primary target rather than my generation. I wish I had a dollar for every friend and relative who owned a WinTel machine back in those days who asked me to come over and upgrade their PC. It was usually a very quick and easy task. I'm still amazed at the numbers of people who own computers but have no clue how to even do simple upgrades. Now a days I try not to overestimate their abilities or their desire to tackle even the easiest of these upgrades. And upgrading the Mac mini 2018 is not that easy for most people. But enough...I'm tired of arguing with people who apparently cannot see things through anyone else's eyes but their own. Not everyone is like us, most computer owners I've met and known and worked with in the past 37 years would consider this RAM upgrade to be more than they would be willing to take on. And I'm pretty sure Apple thinks that too.

BTW, I think there are a lot of people who want a less expensive Mac and don't care if they need to provide the keyboard, mouse, and monitor separately. Yes a lot of sales will go to server farms, but a lot will go to individuals who want a Mac but have a limited budget and cannot afford or justify paying for a more expensive iMac, MBA, MB, MBP, or MPro.

[Dylrob]

Originally Posted by OtinG

Have you guys ever worked in a techie company? I worked in several over a quarter of a century, all software companies. The interesting thing is that even among the software development staff including programmers, QA folks, technical writers, etc., the odd thing was that only about 5-10% of those people could open an older WinTel box and change the RAM. Why? Because they had never even tried or just assumed it was too complicated. So if the vast majority of folks in a techie job were unlikely to attempt what was a rather simple task for many of us back in the 1980s through the early 2000s, I have to assume the same will be true for today with the new Mac mini 2018. Albeit a younger generation now is the primary target rather than my generation. I wish I had a dollar for every friend and relative who owned a WinTel machine back in those days who asked me to come over and upgrade their PC. It was usually a very quick and easy task. I'm still amazed at the numbers of people who own computers but have no clue how to even do simple upgrades. Now a days I try not to overestimate their abilities or their desire to tackle even the easiest of these upgrades. And upgrading the Mac mini 2018 is not that easy for most people. But enough...I'm tired of arguing with people who apparently cannot see things through anyone else's eyes but their own. Not everyone is like us, most computer owners I've met and known and worked with in the past 37 years would consider this RAM upgrade to be more than they would be willing to take on. And I'm pretty sure Apple thinks that too.

BTW, I think there are a lot of people who want a less expensive Mac and don't care if they need to provide the keyboard, mouse, and monitor separately. Yes a lot of sales will go to server farms, but a lot will go to individuals who want a Mac but have a limited budget and cannot afford or justify paying for a more expensive iMac, MBA, MB, MBP, or MPro.

Again, the question is that market really big enough to warrant compromising on the cooling system?

I mean okay, yeah, they could have just put it in a bigger case and avoided the problem entirely, but this is Apple we're talking about.

[meeera]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

I notice that the goalpost has moved from can't change the RAM because it's hardwired to the mother board, to it's too difficult for Great Aunt Effie to do unless she reads the directions first.

... Yeah, Great Aunt Effie has been installing her own RAM since the twentieth century, hon.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by OtinG

Have you guys ever worked in a techie company? I worked in several over a quarter of a century, all software companies. The interesting thing is that even among the software development staff including programmers, QA folks, technical writers, etc., the odd thing was that only about 5-10% of those people could open an older WinTel box and change the RAM. Why? Because they had never even tried or just assumed it was too complicated. So if the vast majority of folks in a techie job were unlikely to attempt what was a rather simple task for many of us back in the 1980s through the early 2000s, I have to assume the same will be true for today with the new Mac mini 2018. Albeit a younger generation now is the primary target rather than my generation. I wish I had a dollar for every friend and relative who owned a WinTel machine back in those days who asked me to come over and upgrade their PC. It was usually a very quick and easy task. I'm still amazed at the numbers of people who own computers but have no clue how to even do simple upgrades. Now a days I try not to overestimate their abilities or their desire to tackle even the easiest of these upgrades. And upgrading the Mac mini 2018 is not that easy for most people. But enough...I'm tired of arguing with people who apparently cannot see things through anyone else's eyes but their own. Not everyone is like us, most computer owners I've met and known and worked with in the past 37 years would consider this RAM upgrade to be more than they would be willing to take on. And I'm pretty sure Apple thinks that too.

BTW, I think there are a lot of people who want a less expensive Mac and don't care if they need to provide the keyboard, mouse, and monitor separately. Yes a lot of sales will go to server farms, but a lot will go to individuals who want a Mac but have a limited budget and cannot afford or justify paying for a more expensive iMac, MBA, MB, MBP, or MPro.

Yes, I've worked for many tech companies. I've also built my own pc's from the 80's all the way to my first mac mini in 2007. It was the only way to get the configuration that I wanted most of the time.

Heck, I even upgrade the memory and hard drive on that mac mini, and upgraded the memory in each of the macs (iMac and mini) I've bought since then. Certainly, the 2007 mac mini was the most difficult of all those. My current mac mini (2010) was fairly trivial to upgrade, assuming you simply followed instructions.

I get that many people are on a limited budget. But if you are on a limited budget, then your choices become much more limited. That's just the nature of things. If I try to remodel my house myself because I'm on a limited budget, does it make sense to complain because I'm not much of a handy man and you have to know what you are doing to make things come out right? If you don't know what you are doing, then installing a ceiling fan yourself can be a pretty difficult and dangerous. Same for cars. Same for a lot of things.

[tomsem]

An entertaining and informative review of the new iPads:

https://youtu.be/Cj1tAK_21zc

Apparently there is no discernible performance benefit to having 6GB RAM in the 1TB models vs 4GB RAM in the other models. It just comes down to whether you need 1TB storage or not.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by tomsem

An entertaining and informative review of the new iPads:

https://youtu.be/Cj1tAK_21zc

Apparently there is no discernible performance benefit to having 6GB RAM in the 1TB models vs 4GB RAM in the other models. It just comes down to whether you need 1TB storage or not.

I'm really not sure what the business model is for 1TB on an iPad. I'm sure there are a few cases, but I don't see where the need is wide spread. I guess we will see how well it sales.

[johnnyb]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

I'm really not sure what the business model is for 1TB on an iPad. I'm sure there are a few cases, but I don't see where the need is wide spread. I guess we will see how well it sales.

Having loads of super large psd files and tons of raws on your iPad and not on an affordable harddrive because you cannot connect it?
Maybe the extra ram will also help with those large files? Or maybe it’s so that people who spend 2000 cash on an iPad don‘t get super-angry right away when 6GB inevitably becomes standard in all of Apple‘s devices and they begin phasing out the smaller RAM-size models by introducing OS features that effectively throttle all devices than cannot provide the RAM needed. Remember, iOS has no real time swap, it just slows down and closes apps as needed...