USB-C Was Supposed to Simplify Our Lives. Instead, It’s a Total Mess

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by haertig

That's pretty obvious. When you have old stuff you're often going to need an adapter to connect it to new stuff. Similarly, if you want to plug a modern mouse into a computer that is so old that it only has PS/2 ports ... you're going to need an adapter.

I remember giving up an old car when leaded gasoline went away.

I remember saying goodbye (quite happily!) to single-ply toilet paper when two-ply came out.

Sometimes, it just works out better to upgrade. But you don't have to. Nobody is going to drag you kicking and screaming into a computer store and force you to upgrade your USB-A computer and USB-A peripherals. You can keep using that setup as long as you want. Sure, eventually you'll be left behind when you can't find parts anymore. Kind of like that car in your garage that requires leaded gasoline. But you can still make even that work, so USB-A should be perpetually available to you with a little effort and planning.

FWIW, I still have one old computer with a PATA hard disk in it. It sits in the basement unused, but it still booted and ran just fine when I tried it a year of so ago (out of curiosity). It didn't even have any USB ports on it.

If this news also made sense, then there would be nothing wrong with it (unleaded petrol).
But many of the changes are only geared towards increased consumption - USB-A / Micro USB can also be operated at USB3 speed.
To design a new connection for something that is also possible via an existing one - is simply stupid.
And also electricity through this - especially!

[Cootey]

Originally Posted by rcentros

I just try one direction and, if that doesn't work, I flip it.

I always assumed that USB-A has three sides. The first side is wrong, the second side is wrong, then the first side tried a second time is right.

[Uncle Robin]

Originally Posted by Cootey

I always assumed that USB-A has three sides. The first side is wrong, the second side is wrong, then the first side tried a second time is right.

This is, of course, an immutable law of this and every Universe.

[haertig]

Originally Posted by ottischwenk

If this news also made sense, then there would be nothing wrong with it (unleaded petrol).
But many of the changes are only geared towards increased consumption - USB-A / Micro USB can also be operated at USB3 speed.
To design a new connection for something that is also possible via an existing one - is simply stupid.
And also electricity through this - especially!

There are two different micro-USB connectors - one can handle USB3 speeds and power, the other cannot. The one that cannot is the one typically found on phones. The one that can, is often seen on things like external portable hard drives. The two connectors are not interchangeable. Why they are both called Micro-B is pretty silly if you ask me.

USB3, with it's higher speeds AND higher power, requires 9 wires. USB2 only requires 4. The attached picture shows the two different types of micro-B connectors (this picture is too old to include USB-C):

[MGlitch]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I've plugged in a USB cable plenty of times going only by feel. So if I can do it, without seeing, I see no reason why a blind person cannot also do the same.

I ate today so world hunger is solved! Oh wait no. That’s not how things work.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I'm complaining that if we had peripherals being made more so with USB-C then we'd need an adapter going to USB-A. So really, there is no solution and USB-C is not a solution as much as a problem. If we had stuck with the USB-A style port, then there would be no problem as peripherals would fit the port.

Go back to PS/2 then. Seriously this is just how technology is, it moves forward. You don’t need to move as fast as it, or really at all but you’ll likely start missing out on experiences if you drag your feet too much.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by MGlitch

I ate today so world hunger is solved! Oh wait no. That’s not how things work.



Go back to PS/2 then. Seriously this is just how technology is, it moves forward. You don’t need to move as fast as it, or really at all but you’ll likely start missing out on experiences if you drag your feet too much.

But for technology to move forward, it has to work and not be such a complicated mess (USB-C).

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by ottischwenk

If this news also made sense, then there would be nothing wrong with it (unleaded petrol).
But many of the changes are only geared towards increased consumption - USB-A / Micro USB can also be operated at USB3 speed.
To design a new connection for something that is also possible via an existing one - is simply stupid.
And also electricity through this - especially!

Micro USB can't really be operated at USB3 speeds, it needs that weird side add-on to do it which kinda makes it not so "micro" anymore. It also can't handle the extra power ( up to 100W) USB C allows, it can't support Displayport connections either. Nor can USB3 micro USB do 20Gbps connections like USB C 3.2. Not the same features at all.

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by salamanderjuice

Micro USB can't really be operated at USB3 speeds, it needs that weird side add-on to do it which kinda makes it not so "micro" anymore. It also can't handle the extra power ( up to 100W) USB C allows, it can't support Displayport connections either. Nor can USB3 micro USB do 20Gbps connections like USB C 3.2. Not the same features at all.

Theoretically or according to the data sheet!
In reality, it is junk to run data lines next to power lines.

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by ottischwenk

Theoretically or according to the data sheet!
In reality, it is junk to run data lines next to power lines.

According the data sheet and real world. My 15" MacBook Pro happily takes 97W through USB C, and my Samsung T5 SSDs run considerably faster through USB C than USB A, and that's only 10Gbps vs. 5Gbps. I don't have any 20Gbps devices yet, or any Thuberbolt 3 devices like a SSD RAID array that can do 40Gbps through a USB C port with TB3 alternate mode.

And no, it's not junk to run data next to power lines.

[haertig]

I never imagined I'd hear people argue that USB-A is better than USB-C. Yet here we are.

There might be arguments to continue using USB-A in the presence of USB-C. Those would mostly relate to cost to upgrade a computer or peripherals. If the older technology suits you needs, why pay to upgrade? I can certainly support that. But to argue that the old stuff is technologically superior is entertaining to read, to say the least. Sometimes older stuff is superior, especially if the change was made to reduce costs, but that's not the case with these USB ports. USB-C can do everything that USB-A can do, and a lot more. The opposite cannot be said.

Most of my stuff is USB-A by the way, I have only a few USB-C devices at the moment. That's because I do not feel the need to spend money to upgrade the old stuff quite yet, not because I think it's superior.

[MGlitch]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

But for technology to move forward, it has to work and not be such a complicated mess (USB-C).

USB C isn’t a mess and it works so again get with the times or not.

[crane3]

Read that avid gamers prefer the PS/2 connections as it is faster than usb-2/c for the keyboard & mouse.

usb-c won't be outdated 'that' soon as it works with a TB3 port. I had used the usb-c cable from a Samsung s5e to the tv on the laptop that had only 2 tb3 ports & was able to see UHD video. Don't know how many laptops will be having just TB3 ports instead of micro-usb or usb-c.

Hardware changes. When I wanted to upgrade my cpu, I found that I had to get a new motherboard because the new cpu had more pin connections; then found that I could not use my 8 gig ram because the memory chips now had different pin configurations. My 6-7 yr old desktop does not have any SSD drive as the added speed is not needed for what I want to do these days. Still have a cd rom as I still need to use the cd for music on my car; not going to get a new car just to have usb whatever.

[DiapDealer]

USB-C made me a nice sandwich today.

[ottischwenk]

Originally Posted by haertig

I never imagined I'd hear people argue that USB-A is better than USB-C. Yet here we are.

No - the USB-C port layout is for commercial purposes only.
All the advantages are behind the connector and would also be possible with an existing one.

[salamanderjuice]

Originally Posted by ottischwenk

No - the USB-C port layout is for commercial purposes only.
All the advantages are behind the connector and would also be possible with an existing one.

Not really.

A lot of the extra features of USB C comes from the fact it has extra pins, while they could maybe cram some more pins into the existing USB A shape, you'd run into the same problems USB C has, except worse because they'd still fit in ancient ports. More pins means you need new cables and ports anyways to use features.

If you think USB C is a mess, imagine how bad it would be with grandmas trying to use HDMI to USB A cables in their 15 year old Dell desktops and trying to charge their 10 year old laptop through the USB A port.