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Old 07-26-2019, 09:11 PM   #16
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Only if...? If someone checks out a book from the library, who would have purchased it, that's a loss for the publisher.

Consider that Amazon was able to sell $400 Kindles on the basis of $9.99 brand new, just released, NYT Best Sellers. All the best Sellers, all the time.

Now everyone has a smart phone and a huge amount of people have a eink reader or tablet...and can check out a book from the library for free in seconds..
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Old 07-26-2019, 09:28 PM   #17
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Only if...? If someone checks out a book from the library, who would have purchased it, that's a loss for the publisher.
I think you're making the same faulty assumption that the publishers made. They assume that all those who borrow an eBook at the library would have bought one if the book wasn't available — that each a book that is lent is a loss in sales. They're wrong. Many (if not most) of those who borrow the book at the library would not have bought (or read) the book at all. So the publisher's "loss" is actually a gain. They at least made some money by selling to the library.
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Old 07-26-2019, 11:13 PM   #18
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Such naïveté. It doesn’t have to be EVERY checkout is a loss sale. Just like every pirated book isn’t a loss sale. Some percentage that’s greater than zero and less than 100%. The easier it has become to check out an ebook, the greater that percentage will be.

Time windowing is an excellent step. I’m quite surprised that publishers have ever sold books to libraries during the high demand window. Movies sure don’t. Nobody expects to be able to check out a ,Obie from the library that still playing in the theaters.
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Old 07-26-2019, 11:43 PM   #19
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Generally, if I hear of a book (fiction novel) I want to read, I follow these steps to obtain it:

(1) Check the libraries I'm a member of for an eBook version for download
(2) Check the libraries I'm a member of for an audiobook version for download
(3) Check my closest physical library for a paper version
(4) Check my closest physical library for inter-library loan availability
(5) Check Amazon for a used paper version for purchase

Generally, I stop after going this far and choose a different book to read. But if I really really want to read the book badly:

(6) Ask my friends if they have a paper copy that I can borrow
(7) Check Amazon for paper and eBook purchase prices

For steps 1-4, the library steps, I will happily wait months for the book to become available. I already own enough books to keep me reading for the rest of my life, so there is no urgency for me to obtain "the latest book", ever.

So this new "window" approach for libraries that publishers are reportedly starting up now won't affect me. I won't complain about it much (but I will comment on it), nor will I switch over and start purchasing more eBooks because of it. I probably would have never known it was happening had I not read about it here on MobileRead. What I would notice is if publishers succeeded in getting rid of libraries. That possibility is quite remote. But if they did somehow manage it, I would just revert to my already-purchased lifetime supply of books. I would take such a move by publishers as a slap in the face, and therefore dedicate myself to never buying another of their books (that I don't need anyway). No big loss for them though, as I estimate that I probably won't purchase more than a dozen (fiction novel) books during the rest of my life anyway. I binge-purchased over the last few years, and now I can just sit back and enjoy my investment. Reference/training books are a different story however.
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Old 07-27-2019, 12:30 AM   #20
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Time windowing is an excellent step.
It doesn't affect me. I'll get on the waiting list or I won't read the book. If not for agent pricing (if there was competition), I might actually buy the book, like I used to. "Brilliant" collusion maneuvering by the big publishers is losing them sales. Greed short circuits the brain.
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Old 07-27-2019, 09:46 AM   #21
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It doesn't affect me. I'll get on the waiting list or I won't read the book. If not for agent pricing (if there was competition), I might actually buy the book, like I used to. "Brilliant" collusion maneuvering by the big publishers is losing them sales. Greed short circuits the brain.
I’m sure the publishers have excellent data with regard to pricing and sales. Before ebooks, only the hard backs came out first. These were priced $25-$30. No one complained that the paperbacks were not immediately available.

New release ebooks are $14.99 by most of the big publishers. I may not be the worlds greatest mathematician, but I believe that’s less than what used to be the going rate for new release books.

What we’ve lost are book sellers promotional sales. We can thank Amazon for that due to their profit destroying $9.99 predatory pricing of new release best sellers.

So now it’s the publishers who set the prices preventing one of their book sellers from running all the others out of business.
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Old 07-27-2019, 01:47 PM   #22
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I haven't bought a book in years. Used to go to bookstores and stock up before vacations. But ever since ebooks, I don't buy a pbook unless I am at Costco and it is a recipe book or a recommended knitting books from Amazon.

Unfortunately, the windowing isn't going to change my habits. I don't mind putting a book on hold. I will simply read something else in the meantime. If I run out of ebooks while I am waiting, I will take something from the two double stacked bookcases of all the pbooks I bought when I thought I would have to choose between books and food during retirement.

If I really have to have a book immediately (like the end of the latest Jane Hawke cincology (is that five?) I simply request the ebook from the library. (I think others have caught on to this. I used to get whatever I requested, but now when I request lesser known books, I may or may not get it.) I requested the Jane Hawke book right after I finished the 4th book. I got the book on the day it was released from both libraries I had requested it from-sometime after midnight, but definitely before the stores opened. I immediately returned the book at the library with the lesser number of holds.

I watch talk shows (political and entertainment) to get my ideas for new books, rather than shopping the bookstore. My husband and were talking the other day, and I remarked how I used to have dates take me to book stores. My husband said he used to do it, but doesn't think he every took me (we were older and employed well when we started dating).

I think I may have gone off topic. Apologies.
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Old 07-27-2019, 02:04 PM   #23
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I’m sure the publishers have excellent data with regard to pricing and sales. Before ebooks, only the hard backs came out first. These were priced $25-$30. No one complained that the paperbacks were not immediately available.
I remember quite a few authors being published only in paperback until their sales did well enough that their new books were published in hardcover.

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New release ebooks are $14.99 by most of the big publishers. I may not be the worlds greatest mathematician, but I believe that’s less than what used to be the going rate for new release books.
I used to buy new paperbacks for 25¢ and being horrified when the price climbed to 45¢ and then continued to climb. Admittedly, that was a few years back.

Perhaps I should also say that many of those were two books in one. The old Ace doubles.

I ran into one of those Ace doubles in a used book store recently. I purchased it new for 0.45¢ (Ace M-135, Space Captain by Murray Leinster and The Mad Metropolis by Philip E. High) which the store now had priced at $7.65 in rather poor shape.
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Old 07-27-2019, 03:33 PM   #24
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There are plenty of books for $.99 - I'm getting offers all the time for complete 5 or more book series for $.99.

Not everyone has to buy a NYT's best seller during its high demand window
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Old 07-27-2019, 03:44 PM   #25
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I’m sure the publishers have excellent data with regard to pricing and sales.
I'm sure they do, too. Doesn't mean they make smart decisions with that data. Greed short circuits the brain. Obviously some of them are figuring out that people have gone to libraries instead of buying eBooks from them, and that's why they're now lowering prices. But it's like closing the barn door after the horses have escaped.
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Old 07-27-2019, 03:45 PM   #26
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There are plenty of books for $.99 - I'm getting offers all the time for complete 5 or more book series for $.99.
Yep. But how many of them are from major publishers (the ones who colluded with Apple to raise eBook prices via agent pricing)?
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:41 PM   #27
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Yep. But how many of them are from major publishers (the ones who colluded with Apple to raise eBook prices via agent pricing)?
None of them. So far, the handful I’ve read have been enjoyable...but they are not up to the standards I’m used to from the big publishers.

But no matter how much one points out that new book prices are cheaper than they used to be from the big publishers....you’ll hear a chorus of “I only buy used paperbacks for a nickel”. Completely irrelevant to the battle between Amazon and the big 5 publishers.
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:49 PM   #28
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None of them. So far, the handful I’ve read have been enjoyable...but they are not up to the standards I’m used to from the big publishers.

But no matter how much one points out that new book prices are cheaper than they used to be from the big publishers....you’ll hear a chorus of “I only buy used paperbacks for a nickel”. Completely irrelevant to the battle between Amazon and the big 5 publishers.
Paperbacks are irrelevant but not eBook prices in general — or the fact that Amazon (and Barnes & Noble) used to have great sales on major publisher's eBooks before the Big Publisher/Apple collusion and its agent pricing scheme.

And I think this is a major reason (not the only reason) why more people started borrowing eBooks from the library instead of buying them. I know that's why I did this.
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:59 PM   #29
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Yep. But how many of them are from major publishers (the ones who colluded with Apple to raise eBook prices via agent pricing)?

Hum, now which company was it that signed all the agency pricing contracts with the publishers? I'm thinking of a company that starts with A, but isn't Apple. Funny after using the Feds to discourage Apple from competing head to head with Amazon, Amazon stopped caring about the $9.95 price point and learned to embrace agency pricing.

Now, someone who hadn't totally bought in to the whole Apple/publisher bad, Amazon good narrative, who point out that Amazon was using their other businesses to sell ebooks at below cost, so it wasn't that Apple and the publishers were raising prices, it was the Amazon stopped subsidizing the below market price with their other businesses. Plenty of books are available as ebooks well below $9.95, even from those evil publishers and on the Apple web site. Heck, Apple will even give you the first book in a number of series free. Can't get much cheaper than free. Maybe it's just time to drop that old tired canard.
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Old 07-27-2019, 06:10 PM   #30
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Hum, now which company was it that signed all the agency pricing contracts with the publishers?
No company wants to be viewed as the first to screw their customers with inflated prices, except maybe Apple. But after the first company starts it, every other company will fall right in line and jump on the bandwagon.
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