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Old 07-26-2019, 10:28 AM   #31
JSWolf
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When one system replaces another, it doesn't mean that the old way was all bad, just that the new is better.
I like the new systems (Amazon, the internet, etc.) Most people feel the same way. That is why "out with the old, in with the new!"
Sorry, but I have to highly disagree. Look at eBooks. We had some old ways that did work better then the current ways and we had cheaper prices. The old ways changed when the publishers ganged up with Apple to go agency. This was not better then the old ways.
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Old 07-26-2019, 11:37 AM   #32
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Should government intervene to save traditional physical retail stores? I guess a lot of people would argue that government shouldn't and that capitalism should have it's way. But the same argument would suggest that we allow robots take over lots of jobs and put people out of work. Where does laissez-faire capitalism become counter-productive? When, if ever, should government interfere in models of commerce?
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Old 07-26-2019, 11:55 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Pajamaman View Post
But the same argument would suggest that we allow robots take over lots of jobs and put people out of work.
Robots need to be designed, tested, programmed, manufactured, spec'ed, sold, delivered, serviced, retooled, redesigned, rebranded, resold, refurbished...

People will need to do these things, and people will need to teach people how to do these things. When one door is shut. Many windows usually open.
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Old 07-26-2019, 11:58 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by Pajamaman View Post
Should government intervene to save traditional physical retail stores? I guess a lot of people would argue that government shouldn't and that capitalism should have it's way. But the same argument would suggest that we allow robots take over lots of jobs and put people out of work. Where does laissez-faire capitalism become counter-productive? When, if ever, should government interfere in models of commerce?

Physical stores are hardly going anywhere. Plus many now have their own websites. The problem is so many people think Amazon is the only game In town.As i said before Amazons prices are not as cheap as people tend to think. Yeah 5 years ago they were maybe 10 percent lower but that is just not the case anymore.

Plus you will always have people that need their items TODAY....not tomorrow or next week. You will always have people that want a quick turn around on returns....you won't get any of this with Amazon. Unless they start to have return facilities and pickup facilities, which would end up being physical stores.

Oh and another thing about constant deliveries to ones home .....porch pirates have grown exponentially over the years.....
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:12 PM   #35
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From slashdot :
U.S. Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin said that Amazon "destroyed the retail industry across the United States" and that it's appropriate for the attorney general to investigate the company alongside other tech giants in the sweeping antitrust review that the Justice Department announced yesterday. "There's no question they've limited competition,"

So...
Some munchkin dude is out to get the wicked witch of the west?
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:22 PM   #36
Barbara1955
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Bolding mine.

B&N is putting themselves out of business, they don't need any help, from anyone.

As for your assertion about amazon and sony, prove it. Seriously, if you're going to make wild statements like that, at least back it up with a modicum of fact instead of fanboi enthusiasm.
AGREE
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:24 PM   #37
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Physical stores are hardly going anywhere. Plus many now have their own websites. The problem is so many people think Amazon is the only game In town.As i said before Amazons prices are not as cheap as people tend to think. Yeah 5 years ago they were maybe 10 percent lower but that is just not the case anymore.
I think you might be overestimating the number of Amazon people who "think Amazon is the only game in town" (let alone the cheapest game). I know I can save a few bucks if I shop around a bit. But I hate shopping. I like buying and getting. Shopping around also means multiple accounts with multiple logins and multiple points of attack for security breaches that can compromise my financial stability and increase the chances of identity theft. So yeah... I'll stick with buying pretty-much everything that I can't get in my home-town (which is most things in Rural Podunk, USA) from my favorite one-stop-shop. Even if it costs me a few more bucks. And I'm not spreading my financial particulars around the internet any more than I need to, either (I'm strictly a Sold by Amazon/Fulfilled by Amazon customer, by the way).

I do find it ironic, though, that many who claim Amazon's "race to the bottom" is bad for retail, competition, the economy, etc..., aren't at least a little bit happier that Amazon doesn't actually seem to be selling things for the cheapest price possible anymore. Damned if you do, damned if you don't, I guess.

Last edited by DiapDealer; 07-26-2019 at 12:27 PM.
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:38 PM   #38
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So...
Some munchkin dude is out to get the wicked witch of the west?
LOL in light of the fact that Seattle's nickname is the Emerald City
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:51 PM   #39
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Amazon used to be cheaper to buy from than physical stores. But that gravy train ended several years ago. Now they might offer convenience, but not a price advantage (generally, but they do have some awesome sales on occasion!)

I would not buy a large screen TV from Amazon. The hassles of delivery, and possible return, of something that big are just too great. Plus, Amazon's packaging these days leaves a lot to be desired. I imagine for a large TV, they'd throw in a Kleenix as padding, maybe two if the set was over 70".

On the other hand, I just bought some replacement grill grates for my outdoor BBQ yesterday. About the only place to find a selection of those was on Amazon. I could have driven all over my metro area, for days, and never found a single grate that would fit. Let alone a choice of which one I wanted to purchase. And I had the option of buying OEM grates, or Chinese made grates for half the price. Not saying which is better in this instance - but the choice was mine to make.

So IMHO, online retailers are really good for some things, but terrible for others.
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:54 PM   #40
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Not so. At one time I perused a public hacker forum where they boasted a lot. Horrible bunch.
The mere fact that they are bragging means that they are not true hackers.

(It's a somewhat vain attempt at humor based on the True Scotsman fallacy)
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Old 07-26-2019, 12:59 PM   #41
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The mere fact that they are bragging means that they are not true hackers.

(It's a somewhat vain attempt at humor based on the True Scotsman fallacy)
To quote Tywin Lannister (or rather GRRM, of course): “And any man who must say 'I am king' is no true king at all.”
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Old 07-26-2019, 03:04 PM   #42
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Should government intervene to save traditional physical retail stores? I guess a lot of people would argue that government shouldn't and that capitalism should have it's way. But the same argument would suggest that we allow robots take over lots of jobs and put people out of work. Where does laissez-faire capitalism become counter-productive? When, if ever, should government interfere in models of commerce?
Robots already are putting people out of work but it's more subtle and sometimes not so visible. One of the places they're making big inroads is in factories, automating putting things together, manufacturing, etc. Businesses used to have lots of secretaries who typed letters; how many people dictate letters to a secretary who uses shorthand (stenography) to copy what they said and then types it? In the grocery store it's often quicker and more convenient to use the self checkout rather than the human one. Phone trees where when you call you press buttons or say words and it directs your call rather than some receptionist/operator.
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Old 07-26-2019, 04:01 PM   #43
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The retail do have a problem in inventory so that the available items are limited to their 'type of store'(?). Amazon has a very wide available of items that is not limited to Amazon but available via connections to different vendors/sellers.

I had looked for terry cloth pot holder replacement locally for around 5 yrs before decided to check on Amazon; got them & quite happy as the terry cloth types are more flexible for toaster ovens & microwaves for me.

The only place I am able to get zippered fly sweatpants is at LL Bean & they also sell them thru Amazon. Helps greatly for people who have to take blood pressure medications. Local stores' clothing line is catered to the young physical 'fit' & trim abdomens; the stuff don't fit my over-aged pot belly.

Before Amazon, I recall a small chain retailer called 'White Front' which went out of business; then U.S.E. then Gold Circle also shutdown. All before Amazon & Walmart. For books, Borders went out of business even before I got an ebook reader. Some used book stores went out of business due to new laws about minimum wage increase, health plans & now, retirement plans if a business has 5 or more employees.

I think Walmart did more damage to retailers than Amazon. The retailers need to have much better web pages to show accurate stock & availability. I believe people are doing lots of internet browsing/shopping for things instead of walking around a city center shopping area or shopping malls.

Still local retailers are at a disadvantage due to how much inventory they can have because of the yearly inventory taxes; the laws are out-dated & discourage having much stuff in their stores. Does inventory taxes include what is in a warehouse?
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Old 07-26-2019, 04:19 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
Robots need to be designed, tested, programmed, manufactured, spec'ed, sold, delivered, serviced, retooled, redesigned, rebranded, resold, refurbished...

People will need to do these things, and people will need to teach people how to do these things. When one door is shut. Many windows usually open.
It's totally obvious robots will take more jobs than they provide. As you truly seem unable to see that, or refuse to, I'll leave it there.
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Old 07-26-2019, 04:21 PM   #45
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It's totally obvious robots will take more jobs than they provide. As you truly seem unable to see that, or refuse to, I'll leave it there.
Ooh.... wicked burn.
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