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Old 12-09-2018, 01:54 AM   #1
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Dates for J.T. Bealby, please

I've started work on Weird Tales by E.T.A. Hoffman, using the version translated by J.T. Bealby -John Thomas Bealby. His date of birth is given as 1858, but I can't find his date of death. Can anyone help, please, or point me to a source? Google gives several responses to a John Thomas Bealby, but I think this is a different person or persons because there is no mention of literary work.

Also, as a bonus, can anyone tell me whether Weird Tales was first written as a collection in German and then translated? I suspect that the short stories in German were translated to English and then collected into the book.
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Old 12-10-2018, 06:30 AM   #2
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Found this
John Thomas BEALBY {CA} (M: 1858 - 1944)
Canada [n|1909]
k Fruit Ranching In British Columbia [n|1909/11]
+ How To Make An Orchard In British Columbia [n|1912]


on :
http://www.authorandbookinfo.com/ngcoba/be1.htm

Name and birthdate sound good, but "Fruit Ranching"???
Canadian citizen.


Edit to add: worldcat has info this same person, I think
http://worldcat.org/identities/lccn-n90601698/

AND that page references Hoffman's Weird Tales, as well as the fruit ranching.


PS: Believe it or not, I was considering doing The Sandman and The Golden Pot, but could find no translator information...

Last edited by GrannyGrump; 12-10-2018 at 06:38 AM. Reason: more data
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Old 12-10-2018, 05:20 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrannyGrump View Post
Believe it or not, I was considering doing The Sandman and The Golden Pot, but could find no translator information...
Project Gutenberg has the 1844 translation of The Sandman translated by John Oxenford (1812-1877) and/or C. A. Feiling (dates unknown).

Archive.org has the Thomas Carlyle (1795–1881) translation of The Golden Pot with a good OCR layer.

Gutenberg Australia also has a slightly revised Carlyle translation, but they don't mention the source.

Last edited by Doitsu; 12-10-2018 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 12-10-2018, 10:24 PM   #4
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I *am* flakey and absent-minded these days --I never checked Gutenberg!
And I failed to find the archive.org posting.

@Alex --- Do you want to do The Golden Pot? (maybe include it as appendix to Weird Tales?) I'll be happy to help proof-read.
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Old 12-11-2018, 11:31 AM   #5
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That would seem to constitute "due diligence" to me. I'd go ahead and post, on the grounds that your Mr Bealby is the one who died in 1944, and is hence in the life+70 PD.
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Old 12-13-2018, 06:48 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrannyGrump View Post
Found this
John Thomas BEALBY {CA} (M: 1858 - 1944)
Canada [n|1909]
k Fruit Ranching In British Columbia [n|1909/11]
+ How To Make An Orchard In British Columbia [n|1912]


on :
http://www.authorandbookinfo.com/ngcoba/be1.htm

Name and birthdate sound good, but "Fruit Ranching"???
Canadian citizen.


Edit to add: worldcat has info this same person, I think
http://worldcat.org/identities/lccn-n90601698/

AND that page references Hoffman's Weird Tales, as well as the fruit ranching.


PS: Believe it or not, I was considering doing The Sandman and The Golden Pot, but could find no translator information...
Thanks, Grannygrump, that's most helpful.

The Sandman is one of the 11 tales in Weird Tales, but I don't remember seeing The Golden Pot anywhere. Could you tell me please where you found it? If you're not going to do it I'd like to have a try at it if I ever get Weird Tales finished.

Last edited by AlexBell; 12-13-2018 at 06:55 PM.
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Old 12-13-2018, 06:49 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
That would seem to constitute "due diligence" to me. I'd go ahead and post, on the grounds that your Mr Bealby is the one who died in 1944, and is hence in the life+70 PD.
Thanks, Harry, that's what I'll do.
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Old 12-17-2018, 05:09 AM   #8
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@ Alex --
I originally found The Golden Pot at PGA:
http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks06/0605801h.html

That translation looks like more comfortable reading than the original Carlyle translation that Doitsu found. Not so "wordy" and stiff. I have sent a request at Gutenberg Australia to try to identify the source of their version, but no response yet.

The Carlyle version:
https://archive.org/details/worksoft...22carl/page/22


Take a look at the PGA version and see what you think.

If it really *is* a revision of the Carlyle translation, would it be considered as Public Domain? Or would the death date of the "editor" of the translation have to be considered also?
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Old 12-17-2018, 09:53 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrannyGrump View Post
If it really *is* a revision of the Carlyle translation, would it be considered as Public Domain? Or would the death date of the "editor" of the translation have to be considered also?
If there is "creativity" involved in the edit, which, from your description, there is, the new work would have its own copyright. As opposed to a mechanical process of, for example, fixing spelling and punctuation errors, which is not creative and does not grant copyright.
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Old 12-17-2018, 10:54 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrannyGrump View Post
If it really *is* a revision of the Carlyle translation, would it be considered as Public Domain? Or would the death date of the "editor" of the translation have to be considered also?
The text of the Gutenberg Australia edition seems to match a version published by Dover.

According Dover:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dover
''The Golden Pot" is a slightly revised version of Carlyle's translation of "Der goldene Topf" [...]
However, since they don't mention who the editor was, their revised version might also be in the Public Domain. (Dover publishes several other books that are in the Public Domain.)

@HarryT Is there a consensus as to how many words an editor must change to claim copyright protection?
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:19 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrannyGrump View Post
@ Alex --
I originally found The Golden Pot at PGA:
http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks06/0605801h.html

That translation looks like more comfortable reading than the original Carlyle translation that Doitsu found. Not so "wordy" and stiff. I have sent a request at Gutenberg Australia to try to identify the source of their version, but no response yet.

The Carlyle version:
https://archive.org/details/worksoft...22carl/page/22


Take a look at the PGA version and see what you think.

If it really *is* a revision of the Carlyle translation, would it be considered as Public Domain? Or would the death date of the "editor" of the translation have to be considered also?
Thanks to you both. I'm only about halfway through doing Weird Tales, so I'll finish that first.

For what it's worth I'm distinctly unimpressed by the PGA version of Weird Tales - many missing periods for a start.

Could you tell me please how you found Internet Archive version of The Golden Pot ? Do you know of a list of English translations of Hoffman's works? and as a bonus where they may be found?

The University of Adelaide ebook site has all the stories in Weird Tales and the biography as separate files.

Last edited by AlexBell; 12-30-2018 at 01:34 AM.
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Old 12-29-2018, 11:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
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I *am* flakey and absent-minded these days --I never checked Gutenberg!
And I failed to find the archive.org posting.

@Alex --- Do you want to do The Golden Pot? (maybe include it as appendix to Weird Tales?) I'll be happy to help proof-read.
Thanks, GrannyGrump

I'm about to upload Weird Tales and hope to start on The Golden Pot within a day or so.
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