Troubleshooting Software update killed my Kindle Paperwhite

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Coincidence does not establish causation.

When I've had a serious problem with my Kindle I couldn't solve I called Customer Service. Works for me.

Again ... working BEFORE the failed automatic update, BRICKED afterwards. These are the facts we're working with here.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by stagnite

Correct, Amazons best solution was to give me a 15% reduction in the cost of a new replacement.
Since my OP, I have removed the battery in the hope it might wipe out the memory and associated problem but no such luck. Still a useless brick that will not move out of the update mode.

It was an automatic update that killed the KP.

Not happy but thanks for your input guys and gals.

Try contacting Amazon again. Explain the situation again (S-L-O-W-L-Y if you have to) and see if you can get someone with a little more common sense this time. I doubt this happens very often, they should look at it as an exception and make and make an exception to their normal procedure by replacing your Kindle with a like refurbished one.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by rcentros

This was an automatic, unrequested upgrade — performed by Amazon — that turned a working Kindle into a brick. Something obviously went wrong in their (Amazon's) update process. This is the responsibility of the company doing the updates — not the one who's working device was ruined by the update.

You would think a pro-active Amazon would replace the the Kindle just so they could study the bricked one to see what went wrong in an attempt to insure that it didn't happen again.

Correlation does not equal causation. If a Jehovah's Witness knocks on my door and my Kindle quits working I wouldn't assume they're connected. So far, two people have had two distinctly different problems and some think it's obviously because of the update. What nonsense.

I would talk to customer service before I came here to whine and ignore the advice that you start by demanding a new Kindle.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Correlation does not equal causation. If a Jehovah's Witness knocks on my door and my Kindle quits working I wouldn't assume they're connected. So far, two people have had two distinctly different problems and some think it's obviously because of the update. What nonsense.

I would talk to customer service before I came here to whine and ignore the advice that you start by demanding a new Kindle.

First point. We're not talking about the second issue here — we're talking about the one issue from the OP.

Now the facts.

Fact. Kindle locked up in the middle of an automatic update.
Fact. Kindle was not locked up BEFORE the update or it couldn't have attempted the update.

I think the evidence is strong enough here. Of course we could discuss what the definition of "is" is, I guess — if we were a couple of professional liars ... err .. lawyers.

[rioachim]

I’d say Amazon should not give you anything beside the standard trade-in discount. Your device broke outside the warranty period for reasons you are only implying without an accurate defect root cause. Tough luck. Buy a new one.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by rioachim

I’d say Amazon should not give you anything beside the standard trade-in discount. Your device broke outside the warranty period for reasons you are only implying without an accurate defect root cause. Tough luck. Buy a new one.

Looks like you should be working for Amazon. Chasing away customers seems to be their current policy and you could drive them no heights of "run off the customer-itis."

Good grief. ONE MORE TIME ... the action that bricked the Paperwhite was initiated by Amazon — not by the customer. You would think Amazon might want to know WHY, wouldn't you? Apparently ignorance is bliss for Amazon.

My wife's Windows 10 laptop BSODs over and over, every single time it updates. My wife has tried to turn off automatic updates. Whenever the Update dialogue comes up she tells it, "no" — but at some point Microsoft basically says "to hell with you, we're going update anyhow." And then I have to fix the computer ... again because it will BSOD, again. Every single time. So, in the world of never blaming the corporate wonks, I guess this is my wife's fault, eh?

I'm guessing you'd feel different if this happened to your Paperwhite. It's always easy to sneer at someone else's misfortune. At least it is for the self-righteous.

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by rcentros

Good grief. ONE MORE TIME ... the action that bricked the Paperwhite was initiated by Amazon — not by the customer. You would think Amazon might want to know WHY, wouldn't you? Apparently ignorance is bliss for Amazon.

Was not. Sounds exactly like an underlying hardware defect. Corrupt update file? Not very likely when it is signed with a 2048bit key which is for all intends and purposes uncrackable by brute force.

My wife's Windows 10 laptop BSODs over and over, every single time it updates. My wife has tried to turn off automatic updates. Whenever the Update dialogue comes up she tells it, "no" — but at some point Microsoft basically says "to hell with you, we're going update anyhow." And then I have to fix the computer ... again because it will BSOD, again. Every single time. So, in the world of never blaming the corporate wonks, I guess this is my wife's fault, eh?

No, same problem. Underlying hardware defect or incompatibility. You cannot blame Microsoft for forcing you to update when you accepted such a behavior by running Windows. If you want full control over your software, then your only choice is running free software on free hardware.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

Was not. Sounds exactly like an underlying hardware defect. Corrupt update file? Not very likely when it is signed with a 2048bit key which is for all intends and purposes uncrackable by brute force.

I don't as much faith in the incorruptibility of downloaded files. I've seen too many corrupted.

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

No, same problem. Underlying hardware defect or incompatibility. You cannot blame Microsoft for forcing you to update when you accepted such a behavior by running Windows. If you want full control over your software, then your only choice is running free software on free hardware.

Microsoft also SUPPOSEDLY gives you the option to NOT upgrade your software. Then they override that option. Oh well, so much for that argument.

Personally I'm not so willing to automatically give grasping corporations the benefit of the doubt. I guess it's a personal decision.

I still think that Amazon would WANT to know WHY their update bricked a working Paperwhite but I guess quality control is not a high priority at Amazon any more.

[latepaul]

Originally Posted by rcentros

I don't as much faith in the incorruptibility of downloaded files. I've seen too many corrupted.

The point of cryptographically signing a file is not that it never gets corrupted, it's that the corruption can be detected. This should mean if the file is bad it's blocked from being installed.

Microsoft also SUPPOSEDLY gives you the option to NOT upgrade your software. Then they override that option. Oh well, so much for that argument.

They haven't given you that option for a while. You can delay the update but not block it forever. See Microsoft's FAQ on updates

Sorry to hear about your Kindle.

[rioachim]

Again, some people make no distinction between ‘root cause’ and ‘effect’. Not to mention that updating mechanism, encryption, signing, flash storage, are foreign concepts.

If your device is out of warranty you are not entitled to a free repair. If you think Amazon makes bad products or services, you can buy a different product next time.

It is impossible to please every customer out there and some will think they are not understood and mistreated. But when you bought the product, Amazon policies regarding updates were the same as now. Legally Amazon’s user agreement covers this, you should have read it before using their ecosystem.

[Paperbackstash]

I agree it's not fair for the customer when this happens, but it's not a surprise Amazon isn't willing to replace it now. I think they should make an exception since it's their software and choice that destroyed a device that was working perfectly fine.

I had this same thing happen to me years back, but it was with an MP3 player. Hooked it to the computer to upload some songs, and it started auto-installing software which completely killed it.

[BookCat]

This thread is making me so ANGRY!
In the UK, warrantees, guarantees etc, have very little standing in law; they are over-ridden by consumer laws, mainly that an item should be fit for purpose. In the case mentioned by the OP, actions on the part of Amazon have prevented his enjoyment of the Paperwhite he bought from them. If Amazon practised good consumer relations, they would ask for the return of the Kindle so that their engineers could determine the cause of the breakdown, meanwhile, they should give the user a goodwill gesture of a newly manufactured (preferably) or at least a refurb Kindle. Then the owner of the Kindle would be likely to tell people how great the customer service is.

As things now stand, if this was in the UK and I were the owner, I would take Amazon to the small claims court. This may cost about the same as a new Kindle, but think of the publicity! On receipt of the summons, I imagine that Amazon would be very quick to pay out much more than 15%!

For those who aren't aware, Small Claims Courts are a cheap way to retrieve small amounts of money or fight consumer issues of a small amount. I was once taken to one for not paying an incompetent vet the grand amount of £34.

My personal experience with Amazon help has been okay, but I've not (touch wood) had a Kindle issue. I have, however, noticed that the people you deal with vary greatly in competence.

[stagnite]

Update.
I tried everything I could including removing the battery for a week or so, removing the battery at the precise moment the screen would refresh after holding the button for 40 seconds, even taped a small object to the button so that the button was permanently held in.
Everything I tried failed to get the damn thing out of update mode.

Eventually, Amazon offered me 20% off a new one so I too that offer. If the Kindle had not been bought as a present for my lovely GF, I would have pressed Amazon harder. They suggested that I took it back to the retailer for a repair - which was Amazon!!!!

Thank you all for your comments. Anyone want a Kindle Paperweight?

[stagnite]

Not received the £19 as yet.

Amazon.co.uk
Your Account Amazon.co.uk
Message From Customer Service
Hello Mr. Stagnite ,

My name is Luis, from the Kindle Customer Support Department at Amazon.co.uk. I've picked up your e-mail today and I'll do my very best to help you with your query.

Thank you for your kind reply providing confirmation of the replacement Kindle being purchased. Once the payment for this delivery is fully processed, we will proceed to refund your 20% discount, as per our promise on our previous communication and will send you a confirmation message once issued.

I have set a follow up, so we will get back to you as soon as we have further information or an outcome for this situation later this week. This because there is a 48 hours waiting period after an order is delivered before we can process any refund on the order.

If you may have further questions, you can also contact us over the phone or via chat.

and earlier:
If you are a consumer, you will also have consumer rights and the one-year manufacturer’s warranty is provided to you in addition to these rights and does not jeopardise your consumer rights in any way. This means that if your Kindle is faulty, you may be entitled to a repair or replacement from the retailer.

[BookCat]

So they're acknowledging that your consumer rights extend much further than their silly guarantees. I don't understand why they are making you wait 48 hours after delivery; they've refunded me (for postage, for example, when I've placed an order over £20 but didn't tick the correct box) while I was online chatting to them - almost instantly and before the item was delivered.

It's mad!