Conflict: Clip Shortcuts under 'localized Wndows'

carmenchu · 08-01-2018, 08:47 AM

Hello!
After years of silent suffering, I have made some tests, and submit this issue:
- Though I have installed the un-translated (english) version of Sigil, my operating system (Windows7, but the issue obtains also under W10) and so my keyboard are 'localized' (for spanish).
- Thus, besides CTRL and ALT keys, there is also a ALT GR key (taking the place, I think, of the LEFT ALT key.
- Now, on Sigil, code view, pressing CTRL+ALT or ALT GR and ANY NUMBER, either from usual keys OR Num Keypad (with Bloq Num) launches the associated Clip.
- This disables ALT GR usual behaviour, tested in Notepad, Scite and this Text Area:
ALT GR + 0 = \
ALT GR + 1 = |
ALT GR + 2 = @
ALT GR + 3 = #
ALT GR + 6 = ¬
ALT GR + other numbers. = unused (all keys from normal keyboard);

ALT GR + number (numpad) = nothing;

CTRL+ALT+number (normal keyboard) = here, same as above; Notepad and Scite = nothing at all.

- Thus, apparently, Sigil manages to 'kill' the keyboard configuration for some characters.
- Quit and dirty workaround: disable some clip shortcuts through preferences.
- Added problem: Preferences doesn't allow me to insert CTRL+ALT+10 or any other two digit number: the second one pressed overwrites the first one.

QUERY: Any idea for keeping both the keys and the clips?

Thanks!

DiapDealer · 08-01-2018, 09:07 AM

Surely you're saying that the standard ALT GR shortcuts for Notepad, Scite, and the like are only "dead" while Sigil is running, right? Sigil can't affect other programs' keyboard shortcuts when it's not running.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carmenchu

QUERY: Any idea for keeping both the keys and the clips?

You don't need to disable the Sigil clips shortcuts to remedy the situation. Just change all the Sigil clips shortcuts to something that doesn't interfere with your standard ALT GR shortcuts.

As far as multi-digit shortcuts ... that's probably not in the cards. Holding three keys down simultaneously is the upper limit of what I can reasonably call a "shortcut." Sorry.

carmenchu · 08-01-2018, 04:25 PM

Of course, Sigil doesn't disable anything OUTSIDE. My complaint is that INSIDE it disables the CTRL+ALT+Digit shortcut ALT GR+number access to some characters--which lack single-key access. I cited Notepad and Scite as examples of the behaviour of text-based applications...
- As for alternate shorcuts: I expect that those offered by default have been chosen so as not interfere (hopefully) with existing shortcuts--i.e., avoid CTRL+C... So, is the list exhaustive/safe? Can I pick ANY shortcut I never use, and link it to my clips? Or should I stick to training myself to use instead my newly installed Clip ToolBar?
- CTRL+ALT+20, and its relations and friends, APPEAR in the current LIST OF SHORTCUTS in preferences... and I did try to re-assign it--I didn't take it out of my noddle. If they cannot be used--i.e., it's NOT an example of my own particular trouble with 'special keys', then I find the list very misleading.
Thanks for any suggestions.

KevinH · 08-01-2018, 04:44 PM

Use Sigil shortcuts preferences to assign what you want as shortcuts for the clips using new key sequences and key sequences of other shortcuts from unused items/actions.

DiapDealer · 08-01-2018, 05:42 PM

It sounds like the beef here is really with Qt's handling of alternate keyboard layouts. As I mentioned to someone else, report it and provide the relevant patches upstream to Qt to get this fixed properly.

When Qt patches QTextEdit and the like to properly recognize the AltGr key as separate from the Right-Alt key, it will automatically be incorporated into Sigil. Until then, the only recourse is to change your Sigil-clips shortcuts to something that doesn't stomp on your AltGr defaults.

KevinH · 08-01-2018, 06:03 PM

Yes, a Qt Windows only bug. See:
https://bugreports.qt.io/browse/QTBUG-69317

DiapDealer · 08-01-2018, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carmenchu

- CTRL+ALT+20, and its relations and friends, APPEAR in the current LIST OF SHORTCUTS in preferences... and I did try to re-assign it--I didn't take it out of my noddle. If they cannot be used--i.e., it's NOT an example of my own particular trouble with 'special keys', then I find the list very misleading.

Are you sure about this??

To my knowledge, only the first ten clips are assigned keyboard shortcuts by default on a new Sigil installation. And those use CTRL+ALT+1 through CTRL+ALT+0. If you're seeing CTRL+ALT+20 in the Keyboard Shortcuts Manager, I'm fairly certain Sigil didn't put them there. I see no double-digit shortcut's assigned by default in a new Sigil installation on Windows or Linux.

All 20 clips are listed, but only the first 10 are pre-assigned shortcuts. Clips 11-20 are left for the user to map to some other valid key sequence of their choosing.

carmenchu · 08-02-2018, 07:41 AM

Very sorry!
You are right and I really evolved the CTRL+ALT+20 out of my own noddle.
So, I must conclude that the mix-up with CTRL+ALT+ and ALT GR+ is one of the 'features' of webQt--like mistreating SVG's 'text on path'?
So, one must keep editing the shortcuts, until a new release mends matters--one hopes!
Thank you very much for the explanations.

08-01-2018, 08:47 AM	#1
carmenchu Groupie Posts: 183 Karma: 266070 Join Date: Dec 2010 Device: Win7,Win10,Lubuntu,smartphone	Conflict: Clip Shortcuts under 'localized Wndows' Hello! After years of silent suffering, I have made some tests, and submit this issue: - Though I have installed the un-translated (english) version of Sigil, my operating system (Windows7, but the issue obtains also under W10) and so my keyboard are 'localized' (for spanish). - Thus, besides CTRL and ALT keys, there is also a ALT GR key (taking the place, I think, of the LEFT ALT key. - Now, on Sigil, code view, pressing CTRL+ALT or ALT GR and ANY NUMBER, either from usual keys OR Num Keypad (with Bloq Num) launches the associated Clip. - This disables ALT GR usual behaviour, tested in Notepad, Scite and this Text Area: ALT GR + 0 = \ ALT GR + 1 = \| ALT GR + 2 = @ ALT GR + 3 = # ALT GR + 6 = ¬ ALT GR + other numbers. = unused (all keys from normal keyboard); ALT GR + number (numpad) = nothing; CTRL+ALT+number (normal keyboard) = here, same as above; Notepad and Scite = nothing at all. - Thus, apparently, Sigil manages to 'kill' the keyboard configuration for some characters. - Quit and dirty workaround: disable some clip shortcuts through preferences. - Added problem: Preferences doesn't allow me to insert CTRL+ALT+10 or any other two digit number: the second one pressed overwrites the first one. QUERY: Any idea for keeping both the keys and the clips? Thanks!

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08-01-2018, 04:25 PM	#3
carmenchu Groupie Posts: 183 Karma: 266070 Join Date: Dec 2010 Device: Win7,Win10,Lubuntu,smartphone	Of course, Sigil doesn't disable anything OUTSIDE. My complaint is that INSIDE it disables the CTRL+ALT+Digit shortcut ALT GR+number access to some characters--which lack single-key access. I cited Notepad and Scite as examples of the behaviour of text-based applications... - As for alternate shorcuts: I expect that those offered by default have been chosen so as not interfere (hopefully) with existing shortcuts--i.e., avoid CTRL+C... So, is the list exhaustive/safe? Can I pick ANY shortcut I never use, and link it to my clips? Or should I stick to training myself to use instead my newly installed Clip ToolBar? - CTRL+ALT+20, and its relations and friends, APPEAR in the current LIST OF SHORTCUTS in preferences... and I did try to re-assign it--I didn't take it out of my noddle. If they cannot be used--i.e., it's NOT an example of my own particular trouble with 'special keys', then I find the list very misleading. Thanks for any suggestions.

08-01-2018, 04:44 PM	#4
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 7,602 Karma: 5433388 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	Use Sigil shortcuts preferences to assign what you want as shortcuts for the clips using new key sequences and key sequences of other shortcuts from unused items/actions.

08-01-2018, 05:42 PM	#5
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 27,535 Karma: 193191846 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	It sounds like the beef here is really with Qt's handling of alternate keyboard layouts. As I mentioned to someone else, report it and provide the relevant patches upstream to Qt to get this fixed properly. When Qt patches QTextEdit and the like to properly recognize the AltGr key as separate from the Right-Alt key, it will automatically be incorporated into Sigil. Until then, the only recourse is to change your Sigil-clips shortcuts to something that doesn't stomp on your AltGr defaults.

08-01-2018, 06:03 PM	#6
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 7,602 Karma: 5433388 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	Yes, a Qt Windows only bug. See: https://bugreports.qt.io/browse/QTBUG-69317

08-02-2018, 07:41 AM	#8
carmenchu Groupie Posts: 183 Karma: 266070 Join Date: Dec 2010 Device: Win7,Win10,Lubuntu,smartphone	Very sorry! You are right and I really evolved the CTRL+ALT+20 out of my own noddle. So, I must conclude that the mix-up with CTRL+ALT+ and ALT GR+ is one of the 'features' of webQt--like mistreating SVG's 'text on path'? So, one must keep editing the shortcuts, until a new release mends matters--one hopes! Thank you very much for the explanations.

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